So Michael Sam Is Gay, Who Cares? Can He Rush The QB?

[Triumph]

Funny that your avatar contains the famous "μολὼν λαβέ uttered by King Leonidas of the Spartans, during the battle of Thermopylae.

The Spartans were later defeated during the battle of Leuctra, which broke up the Spartan's hold on the Greek peninsula.

Crucial to the outcome of the battle was the action of an elite force called "The Sacred Band," which was exclusively gay.

Sacred Band

Oops.

But thats not what it stands for.

 

[Triumph]

Despite your attempts to discriminate.

Go, go do what you want.

Just dont tell me because I dont care. If you want to do perverted things with other men dont expect me to be overjoyed and tell you how wonderful you are. I dont want to live like you. My choice. Not yours. You have no say in how I lead my life whatsoever. Go march in gay parade and have a good time.

I hope you get lucky.

 

[condon84]

Why do you keep trying to distort this?

The argument is basically that you can have any opinion you want to; you can think that homosexual acts are unnatural as much as you want to.

But if you tell a gay person that you think what they are doing is unnatural, that's wrong.

I've also pointed out that what is natural and unnatural is a matter of subjectivity anyway.

What you're basically saying is that you can state your opinion as long as it toes the PC line. Otherwise, keep it to yourself.

 

[Ring 6]

In regards to Primetime, he posted he was slightly uncomfortable to transsexuals, I don't see how he can equate that to hateful thoughts.

No one has called his thoughts hateful. I surmised that it bothered him because he was being judgmental of another

On your second point, I never disagreed with gays living how they want to live. It was just my opinion that same sex intercourse is unnatural. But it doesn't mean I think they should stop. They can do whatever they want.

Do you not acknolwedge that by saying they are unnatural, you are implying you are better than them?

 

[Ring 6]

What you're basically saying is that you can state your opinion as long as it toes the PC line. Otherwise, keep it to yourself.

PC has nothing to do with it. Judgmental and hurtful do.
If you accept someone and I judge them, particularly in an insulting, hurtful or demeaning way, there is a huge difference in our positions whether they are PC or not.
You use PC as if its a horrible thing. Can you define what you mean by that? If it means not making comments that are insulting, hurtful or demeaning to others or judging someone, it would seem a reasonable thing to strive for.

 

[Ring 6]

Hell. Well, you being so enlightened I'm sure you've already dismissed this ridiculous conundrum. The reason some religious types see this as a moral issue is because the sex act (any sex act) has a huge complex psychological component to it. I could go into the phenomenon know as desensitization (this is shown in many areas of life including Hollywood types becoming bored with one woman and bedding as many as possible or drug addicts going after that next great drug), but, I'm sure you got it covered. Religious types view the sex act in a moral way (and even some as a moral test). It is undeniable that some heterosexual males will engage in anal sex in prison while others will not. Anal sex is an act not a skin color. Is it wrong for religious types to judge this (their word - deviant, I use type of) behavior by heterosexual inmates? You seem to have all the answers so I'll defer to you. I'm sure you'll enlighten us all.

Get back to me when you want to be serious

 

[condon84]

No one has called his thoughts hateful. I surmised that it bothered him because he was being judgmental of another



Do you not acknolwedge that by saying they are unnatural, you are implying you are better than them?

My opinion on same sex intercourse being unnatural is only one aspect of their lives. I don't judge people based on one aspect of their lives.

 

[mb6592]

Hell. Well, you being so enlightened I'm sure you've already dismissed this ridiculous conundrum. The reason some religious types see this as a moral issue is because the sex act (any sex act) has a huge complex psychological component to it. I could go into the phenomenon know as desensitization (this is shown in many areas of life including Hollywood types becoming bored with one woman and bedding as many as possible or drug addicts going after that next great drug), but, I'm sure you got it covered. Religious types view the sex act in a moral way (and even some as a moral test). It is undeniable that some heterosexual males will engage in anal sex in prison while others will not. Anal sex is an act not a skin color. Is it wrong for religious types to judge this (their word - deviant, I use type of) behavior by heterosexual inmates? You seem to have all the answers so I'll defer to you. I'm sure you'll enlighten us all.

I'm not really certain where you're going with this. Are you comparing consensual sex by adults to sexual assault in prison? You don't need to be religious to condemn sexual assault, but if you don't condemn sexual assault you're probably a sociopath.

Now who's the ignorant one? Or is that just your way of not dealing with the issue? Not all prison sex is sexual assault or consensual between two gay men. There are plenty of heterosexual males engaging in various sex acts during their incarceration.

 

[Ring 6]

My opinion on same sex intercourse being unnatural is only one aspect of their lives. I don't judge people based on one aspect of their lives.

It is the central part of their life. Not the sex act, but their sexual identity.
Are you telling me you support their rights to get married, adopt children, and have access to all benefits of married people?

Judging someone on an aspect of their life is judging them.

Calling the way they have sex unnatural is judging them, and as I said considering yourself better than them in that regard.

 

[Boogs]

PC has nothing to do with it. Judgmental and hurtful do.
If you accept someone and I judge them, particularly in an insulting, hurtful or demeaning way, there is a huge difference in our positions whether they are PC or not.
You use PC as if its a horrible thing. Can you define what you mean by that? If it means not making comments that are insulting, hurtful or demeaning to others or judging someone, it would seem a reasonable thing to strive for.

Or not telling the real truth of the matter. Thank God I have a few people in my life that tell me when I'm screwing up. It's not fun to hear that sometimes. But my hurt feelings don't last forever. In the end I take it to heart and if it's true it helps me change and be better.

 

[condon84]

It is the central part of their life. Not the sex act, but their sexual identity.
Are you telling me you support their rights to get married, adopt children, and have access to all benefits of married people?

Judging someone on an aspect of their life is judging them.

Calling the way they have sex unnatural is judging them, and as I said considering yourself better than them in that regard.

Yes I support gays to have the same rights as everybody.

Having an opinion on one aspect of their lives is not judging them. Are you really that hard pressed to call someone a bigot just because they don't agree with everything you want them to agree on? That is an extreme stance.

 

[mb6592]

Hell. Well, you being so enlightened I'm sure you've already dismissed this ridiculous conundrum. The reason some religious types see this as a moral issue is because the sex act (any sex act) has a huge complex psychological component to it. I could go into the phenomenon know as desensitization (this is shown in many areas of life including Hollywood types becoming bored with one woman and bedding as many as possible or drug addicts going after that next great drug), but, I'm sure you got it covered. Religious types view the sex act in a moral way (and even some as a moral test). It is undeniable that some heterosexual males will engage in anal sex in prison while others will not. Anal sex is an act not a skin color. Is it wrong for religious types to judge this (their word - deviant, I use type of) behavior by heterosexual inmates? You seem to have all the answers so I'll defer to you. I'm sure you'll enlighten us all.

Get back to me when you want to be serious

Yeah, I thought so. Same reply you'd give if someone suggested, quite logically, let's let three people marry since same sex marriage is all the rage. Fallacy, red herrings and ad hominems - the last refuges of a scoundrel.

 

[Ring 6]

Or not telling the real truth of the matter. Thank God I have a few people in my life that tell me when I'm screwing up. It's not fun to hear that sometimes. But my hurt feelings don't last forever. In the end I take it to heart and if it's true it helps me change and be better.

There is no 'real truth of the matter' in judging someone.
A lifestyle is not an example of telling someone they are screwing up.

I really can't believe how much you look down on a gay person as being flawed, wrong, and less than you are and almost seem like its your responsibility to convert them to your 'right way'.
Why should what you think is right or wrong matter to them if they do not feel that way?

 

[Joker]

scoundrel????

I LOVE that word...nobody uses that 18th century lingo anymore and its our loss...I would love to have been a scandalous scoundrel in my youth..instead I was just an insipid ingrate with an inferiority complex...

 

[Ring 6]

Yeah, I thought so. Same reply you'd give if someone suggested, quite logically, let's let three people marry since same sex marriage is all the rage. Fallacy, red herrings and ad hominems - the last refuges of a scoundrel.

You really aren't making any sense.
Would you like to explain your position, because I really don't understand what you are trying to say.

 

[Ring 6]

Yes I support gays to have the same rights as everybody.

Having an opinion on one aspect of their lives is not judging them. Are you really that hard pressed to call someone a bigot just because they don't agree with everything you want them to agree on? That is an extreme stance.

That is not my stance. You have done a horrible job to this point of explaining your position. I'm not sure how asking a question in order to clarify what I think you are saying is 'hard pressed to call someone a bigot'.

If you have read my comments and attempted to see them for what they are, you would see that my position is that gays (just like any other group you wish to name) are people who deserve a right make whatever (legal) decisions and lifestyle choices they wish without being subjected to disdain, criticism, harassment, abuse, or worse from someone who has different views.
If you were to tell me that you find homosexuality disgusting, but support their rights, and a gay person would never know you feel that way because you would allow them to live their life to their own standards without enforcing your standards upon them, then I would say you are not bigotted at all.

 

[Boogs]

There is no 'real truth of the matter' in judging someone.
A lifestyle is not an example of telling someone they are screwing up.

I really can't believe how much you look down on a gay person as being flawed, wrong, and less than you are and almost seem like its your responsibility to convert them to your 'right way'.
Why should what you think is right or wrong matter to them if they do not feel that way?

If you think everything is just fine for guys to pretend they are women, like women trapped in a man's body, I disagree. I think there are a whole bunch of mental issues going on there. I'm not better than them. I think it's sad and something's very wrong. This is an internet forum. Sorry to offend you or any transsexual reading this. This is my opinion.

 

[PP2]

But thats not what it stands for.

What are you talking about? Your avatar? What do you think it stands for then?

 

[mb6592]

You really aren't making any sense.
Would you like to explain your position, because I really don't understand what you are trying to say.

Sure you don't. Just leave it alone already. Get the f-ck off your high horse and acknowledge that the human condition (including lust, mores, moralities, sexuality, religious beliefs, etc, etc, etc) is extremely complex and doesn't lend itself to speaking in absolutes. You browbeating everyone is just making you look foolish. No one should bully gay (or any other people). Be courteous and polite to your neighbor. Why isn't that enough for you? Why the need to speak in such absolutes. Who really knows why the f-ck we're here or what the f-ck we should be doing? You seem so sure of yourself, which sheds a very poor light on you.

 

[PP2]

What you're basically saying is that you can state your opinion as long as it toes the PC line. Otherwise, keep it to yourself.

There's no PC line to toe if it's your son that's gay.

That's the problem.