What's Edelman worth?

[patfanken]

OK, I managed to slog through all 10 pages (so far) of this thread. That's about 7 pages by Brady 6 and 3 by everyone else. Here are my comments on the comments.

1. When looking at Edelman's accomplishments this year you HAVE to look at them within the prism of the Patriots offense. From Troy Brown, to Wes Welker, to Julian Edelman, virtually every receiver who has ever played it for any time gets close to that 100 catch/100yd threshold. It has to make you wonder if the offense has something to do with the success of slot guys who play there.

Just look at Welker in Denver. Surrounded by more talent than he ever saw here, and having a HOF QB who needs to throw short, he still never came close to his numbers here in catches and yds

The point here is, however you look at Edelman, the fact is that the style of offense the Pats run IS a factor in the success of ANYONE who plays the slot position.

2. Also (as mentioned) you have to look at his numbers within the framework of the 2013 receiving corps, which included a trio of rookies, an impaired, new to the system WR in Amendola, and virtually no TE production.

3. The fact is that there is no way that Edelman appoaches the numbers he had this year if he is playing with a healthy Gronk and Amendola, plus 3 rookies who have made that 2nd year jump. He won't get close to the 150 targets he saw this year.

4. And here where it get interesting. Do you pay Edelman the market price for what he DID in 2013, or do you offer him a number that would more reflect what they EXPECT him to do within the context of having targets taken away from him by the fact there are now better WR's and TE options to go along with him in 2014

5. Now I'll state a case that favors bringing him back. Most people here make the assumption that Edelman and Amendola are interchangeable parts playing the same position. But BB made is clear on a number of occasions that he felt DA and JE have different skill sets. If that's truly the case, then the Pats could use both within the same system, with one taking the slot area and the other more as a true WR.

Now I don't know which would be which, and BB could have just have been blowing smoke up the media's ass. But if $5MM/yr IS Edelman's market price, then since everyone else is so cheap, having around $10MM tied up in 2 WR's isn't a burden especially if you can get out of one of the contract in 2015/16 without much pain

6. I have to laugh at those of you who are using almost word for word the same arguments for keeping Edelman and dumping on Amendola, that were used last year at this time to keep Welker and dump on Edelman.

Here's what I know. If Danny Amendola is healthy and gets 150 targets next season, he WILL have 100 catches and 1000 yds. I'll take it one step farther. If Josh Boyce gets 150 targets from the slot position next year, HE will have 100 catches and 1000yds. It's part the nature of the position, part the structure of the offense, part the QB, and part the skill set of the receiver.

7. But here's what has finally become clear to me this season. You don't have to be a "top 20 WR" to get those numbers on the Pats. Physically you have to have good hands, and quickness. Mentally you have to be fearless, tough, and smart The physical side is, frankly, easy to find. The mental aspect is harder, but its not like finding needles in a haystack. Just look at the fact that Welker, Cruz, and DA were all UDFA's and Edelman was a 7th round pick who never play WR in his life.

8. So in the end, I'd offer Edelman a contract from 3-4 years in the $3-4MM/yr range. with something like a $6MM signing bonus and half guaranteed. If that's not enough to get it done, I'd move on without a regret in world. And that's coming from Edelman's top defender last off season.

9, 2 other facts to keep in mind is that 1. fans always tend to overvalue their own FA's, and 2. We all vastly overvalued Welker's market price last season. Remember last season the "market" valued the TOP slot receiver in NFL history to be at $6MM/yr for what amounts to 1 year. What then will the market be for a player who has been healthy only one year in 4, and has only one year of high end production.

I don't know what it will be, but if history tells us anything, it will probably be LESS than we think.

 

[BradyBranch39]

Edelman's worth more than BB will offer him. And it will bite us in the asses. Again.

Luckily, we got away with offering him next to nothing this past offseason, because nobody else was smart enough to snatch him.

 

[SalemPats]

Edelman's worth more than BB will offer him. And it will bite us in the asses. Again.

Luckily, we got away with offering him next to nothing this past offseason, because nobody else was smart enough to snatch him.

Agreed, we have to sign him. He's going to get an offer somewhere else, it would be embarassing if we have DA in the slot next year instead, he's just not good enough

 

[Christiancat]

I will throw out a guess and say, 3-4 million a years for the next 3 years.

 

[Brady6]

amendola has his own thread (many)...i don't get it

It's not really about Amendola it's about his contract as well as Welker's contract. They were the big name UFA slot receivers who signed last so it makes sense that their contracts would be discussed when assessing Edelman's value.

 

[supafly]

it would be embarassing if we have DA in the slot next year instead, he's just not good enough

Concern of injury? Yes--although you'll have that with any of Amendola, Edelman, or Sanders, so it's all the same.

"Just not good enough?" No, that's ridiculous--he looked more than fine in week #1, when he caught everything thrown within a 10 mile radius and everyone was extremely excited. He also had some fine years with STL, catching 85 and 63 (in only 8 starts).

The problem was that he was injured and didn't really return until a month later, after week #1. Even then, he had a concussion and missed another 1.5 games. By that time, we long needed to move on and had Edelman in the slot receiving the heavy bulk of the targets, which totaled 175 for the season. We had an offense comprised of Edelman and a bunch of nobodies, so who do you think was going to get the looks?

It's fine to want Edelman to stay, but you're overvaluing him and undervaluing Amendola at the same time in regards to their potential to be our quick/short passing receiver with the bulk of targets.

 

[supafly]

OK, I managed to slog through all 10 pages (so far) of this thread. That's about 7 pages by Brady 6 and 3 by everyone else. Here are my comments on the comments.

1. When looking at Edelman's accomplishments this year you HAVE to look at them within the prism of the Patriots offense. From Troy Brown, to Wes Welker, to Julian Edelman, virtually every receiver who has ever played it for any time gets close to that 100 catch/100yd threshold. It has to make you wonder if the offense has something to do with the success of slot guys who play there.

Just look at Welker in Denver. Surrounded by more talent than he ever saw here, and having a HOF QB who needs to throw short, he still never came close to his numbers here in catches and yds

The point here is, however you look at Edelman, the fact is that the style of offense the Pats run IS a factor in the success of ANYONE who plays the slot position.

2. Also (as mentioned) you have to look at his numbers within the framework of the 2013 receiving corps, which included a trio of rookies, an impaired, new to the system WR in Amendola, and virtually no TE production.

3. The fact is that there is no way that Edelman appoaches the numbers he had this year if he is playing with a healthy Gronk and Amendola, plus 3 rookies who have made that 2nd year jump. He won't get close to the 150 targets he saw this year.

4. And here where it get interesting. Do you pay Edelman the market price for what he DID in 2013, or do you offer him a number that would more reflect what they EXPECT him to do within the context of having targets taken away from him by the fact there are now better WR's and TE options to go along with him in 2014

5. Now I'll state a case that favors bringing him back. Most people here make the assumption that Edelman and Amendola are interchangeable parts playing the same position. But BB made is clear on a number of occasions that he felt DA and JE have different skill sets. If that's truly the case, then the Pats could use both within the same system, with one taking the slot area and the other more as a true WR.

Now I don't know which would be which, and BB could have just have been blowing smoke up the media's ass. But if $5MM/yr IS Edelman's market price, then since everyone else is so cheap, having around $10MM tied up in 2 WR's isn't a burden especially if you can get out of one of the contract in 2015/16 without much pain

6. I have to laugh at those of you who are using almost word for word the same arguments for keeping Edelman and dumping on Amendola, that were used last year at this time to keep Welker and dump on Edelman.

Here's what I know. If Danny Amendola is healthy and gets 150 targets next season, he WILL have 100 catches and 1000 yds. I'll take it one step farther. If Josh Boyce gets 150 targets from the slot position next year, HE will have 100 catches and 1000yds. It's part the nature of the position, part the structure of the offense, part the QB, and part the skill set of the receiver.

7. But here's what has finally become clear to me this season. You don't have to be a "top 20 WR" to get those numbers on the Pats. Physically you have to have good hands, and quickness. Mentally you have to be fearless, tough, and smart The physical side is, frankly, easy to find. The mental aspect is harder, but its not like finding needles in a haystack. Just look at the fact that Welker, Cruz, and DA were all UDFA's and Edelman was a 7th round pick who never play WR in his life.

8. So in the end, I'd offer Edelman a contract from 3-4 years in the $3-4MM/yr range. with something like a $6MM signing bonus and half guaranteed. If that's not enough to get it done, I'd move on without a regret in world. And that's coming from Edelman's top defender last off season.

9, 2 other facts to keep in mind is that 1. fans always tend to overvalue their own FA's, and 2. We all vastly overvalued Welker's market price last season. Remember last season the "market" valued the TOP slot receiver in NFL history to be at $6MM/yr for what amounts to 1 year. What then will the market be for a player who has been healthy only one year in 4, and has only one year of high end production.

I don't know what it will be, but if history tells us anything, it will probably be LESS than we think.

It's rare to agree so much with one post, but I read all 9-10 points, and I thought that you made a ton of sense in every single point.

One thing we know for sure is that our slot position probably isn't something that we need to be quite THIS concerned about. It's more of the WR depth chart in general, along with a hopeful improvement on the outside.

As you've said, all of Brown, Welker, Edelman, and even Amendola (pre-season and week #1) have all looked great playing the slot position in this offense. However Belichick sees the best choices will be fine with me.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

2013 Edelman was a lot closer to 2012 Welker than to 2012 Edelman—and this in an offense that didn't have all the other weapons that the 2012 passing game did.

So, come 2014, assuming that the passing offense improves, does that make Edelman more useful or less useful? Think what he could do with, say, a healthy Aaron Dobson drawing safeties downfield AND a healthy GRONK swallowing up coverage.

FWIW, I think this is the big unanswered, and possibly unanswerable, question.

 

[supafly]

2013 Edelman was a lot closer to 2012 Welker than to 2012 Edelman—and this in an offense that didn't have all the other weapons that the 2012 passing game did.

So, come 2014, assuming that the passing offense improves, does that make Edelman more useful or less useful? Think what he could do with, say, a healthy Aaron Dobson drawing safeties downfield AND a healthy GRONK swallowing up coverage.

FWIW, I think this is the big unanswered, and possibly unanswerable, question.

Yes, I think that's an excellent statement.

We'll have to roll with the old "in BB we trust" once again, particularly in terms of retaining Edelman and addressing the WR position, but something tells me that he will not stand pat after such a glaring lack of options again (not taking TE Gronkowski into account).

There are several different options from signing Edelman, letting him walk and addressing the outside receivers more, to replacing some of the missing production with a draft pick at TE who can actually catch passes.

 

[patfanken]

Yes, I think that's an excellent statement.

We'll have to roll with the old "in BB we trust" once again, particularly in terms of retaining Edelman and addressing the WR position, but something tells me that he will not stand pat after such a glaring lack of options again (not taking TE Gronkowski into account).

There are several different options from signing Edelman, letting him walk and addressing the outside receivers more, to replacing some of the missing production with a draft pick at TE who can actually catch passes.

You are right in this aspect, Sup. We fans can go back and forth for the next 4 months and it will mean nothing. What BB actually does in FA and the draft will tell us a lot more.

My opinion is that he basically likes the potential he has in his WR corps as it stands. Its young, athletic, and slightly bigger than in previous years. I really don't think he will do much but tinker with the TC make up, regardless of whether Edelman stays or leaves. But I repeat, this is just my opinion. If it's right it will tell us a lot about how BB felt the trio of rookies did in HIS eyes. If I'm wrong and BB uses a high pick or brings in a Emmanuel Sanders type of WR, then it will tell us, the WR corps still needs work and he wasn't happy with how the young WR's worked out.

Where I DO think BB will be looking for a "do over" will be with the TE group. That's why I wouldn't be surprised to see the Pats 2nd pick in the draft be a TE, and a mid range vet FA added as well. I suspect our first 3 picks next year are going to be a DT, TE, and OLman. And it still pisses me off that Zack Sudfeld is a Jet.

 

[mgteich]

Obviously, it depends on who's available in the top three picks.

IMHO, we need a DE a lot more than a DT. We had Ninkovich and Jones playing well over 90% of the defensive reps. In the sub package our choice were Carter, Bequette and Buchanan.

At DT, we likely have at least one of the Wilfork and Kelly coming back. We also have youngsters Jones, Siliga, Vellano and Armstead.

You are right in this aspect, Sup. We fans can go back and forth for the next 4 months and it will mean nothing. What BB actually does in FA and the draft will tell us a lot more.

My opinion is that he basically likes the potential he has in his WR corps as it stands. Its young, athletic, and slightly bigger than in previous years. I really don't think he will do much but tinker with the TC make up, regardless of whether Edelman stays or leaves. But I repeat, this is just my opinion. If it's right it will tell us a lot about how BB felt the trio of rookies did in HIS eyes. If I'm wrong and BB uses a high pick or brings in a Emmanuel Sanders type of WR, then it will tell us, the WR corps still needs work and he wasn't happy with how the young WR's worked out.

Where I DO think BB will be looking for a "do over" will be with the TE group. That's why I wouldn't be surprised to see the Pats 2nd pick in the draft be a TE, and a mid range vet FA added as well. I suspect our first 3 picks next year are going to be a DT, TE, and OLman. And it still pisses me off that Zack Sudfeld is a Jet.

 

[Brady6]

OK, I managed to slog through all 10 pages (so far) of this thread. That's about 7 pages by Brady 6 and 3 by everyone else. Here are my comments on the comments.

I’m dedicated

1. When looking at Edelman's accomplishments this year you HAVE to look at them within the prism of the Patriots offense. From Troy Brown, to Wes Welker, to Julian Edelman, virtually every receiver who has ever played it for any time gets close to that 100 catch/100yd threshold. It has to make you wonder if the offense has something to do with the success of slot guys who play there.

So Troy Brown an all pro 3 time SB winning WR who is in the Patriots hall of fame and Wes Welker widely considered to be the best slot receiver to ever play in the NFL have had success in it so that means anyone can? I am sure the system has something to do with the success of players just like the system had to do with the success of Terrell Davis in Denver but it still doesn’t mean that the players aren’t valuable. You realize that outside of Welker and Edelman the Patriots franchise has had 1 other season where a player exceeded 100 receptions and that was Troy Brown in 2001. This is not an accomplishment that you should be so quick to file as anyone could do it.

Just look at Welker in Denver. Surrounded by more talent than he ever saw here, and having a HOF QB who needs to throw short, he still never came close to his numbers here in catches and yds

Welker played in 13 games, 2 of which he left early and he had 73 catches for 789 yards and 10 touchdowns, Welker was not as effective after his first concussion but prior to that he had 61 catches for 648 yards and 9 touchdowns in 9 games which projects to 108 catches, 1152 yards and 16 touchdowns over a full season. The belief that Welker was ineffective is beyond false he had 1 more touchdown this season than his replacement Amendola has in his entire career.

The point here is, however you look at Edelman, the fact is that the style of offense the Pats run IS a factor in the success of ANYONE who plays the slot position.

If anyone was having success they wouldn’t have moved Edelman back into the slot at halftime against the Broncos in week 12; they would have left Amendola there because he would have been having success like anyone else.

2. Also (as mentioned) you have to look at his numbers within the framework of the 2013 receiving corps, which included a trio of rookies, an impaired, new to the system WR in Amendola, and virtually no TE production.

Edelman caught 69.5% of the targeted passes that went his direction.

Top Catch Ratio in NFL:
1. Eddie Royal – 70.1% (67 targeted passes)
2. Brandon Gibson – 69.8% (43 targeted passes)
3. Julian Edelman – 69.5% (151 targeted passes)

The argument that he benefited from being the only target is lost when you consider that he pulled in the 3rd highest percent of his targets in the NFL. Not to mention the other players who had over 100 receptions were all targeted significantly more than Edelman:

• Garcon – 113 catches/182 targeted passes
• Brown – 110 catches/166 targeted passes
• Johnson – 109 catches/181 targeted passes
• Marshall – 100 catches/164 targeted passes

Overall Edelman was 10th in the NFL in targeted passes going his way.

3. The fact is that there is no way that Edelman appoaches the numbers he had this year if he is playing with a healthy Gronk and Amendola, plus 3 rookies who have made that 2nd year jump. He won't get close to the 150 targets he saw this year.

Is that a fact? You realize Welker was targeted 174 times in 2012 and 172 times in 2011 which is 21 and 23 times more than Edelman this season and we had Gronkowski, Hernandez, Lloyd, Woodhead and others in those seasons? You act like Edelman received this unreasonable # of targeted passes and he caught 35% of them and his 100+ catches was forced on him. That is so untrue.

4. And here where it get interesting. Do you pay Edelman the market price for what he DID in 2013, or do you offer him a number that would more reflect what they EXPECT him to do within the context of having targets taken away from him by the fact there are now better WR's and TE options to go along with him in 2014

Once again why are we taking targets away? We’ve targeted Welker since he arrived:

2007 – 145 times
2008 – 150 times
2009 – 162 times
2010 – 122 times (returning form ACL/MCL surgery)
2011 – 172 times
2012 – 174 times

Edelman’s 151 targets in the slot don’t seem that likely to drop in my opinion.

6. I have to laugh at those of you who are using almost word for word the same arguments for keeping Edelman and dumping on Amendola, that were used last year at this time to keep Welker and dump on Edelman.

Here's what I know. If Danny Amendola is healthy and gets 150 targets next season, he WILL have 100 catches and 1000 yds. I'll take it one step farther. If Josh Boyce gets 150 targets from the slot position next year, HE will have 100 catches and 1000yds. It's part the nature of the position, part the structure of the offense, part the QB, and part the skill set of the receiver.

You know you actually have to be able to get open to have 151 balls thrown your direction right? Brady does not just throw it to you because he likes you, Amendola could get out of a paper bag in the Denver game and many others this season so you perception that we just chuck 151 passes his direction and he catches 69.5% of them and averages 10.1 yards per catches is ridiculous. For the record based on Amendola’s catch ratio this season if you threw him 151 balls he would not catch 100 of them. Also his career average per catch is 9.4 yards the lowest of any WR in the past 20 years with at least 100 receptions in his career so it would take him 107 catches just to break the 1000 yard barrier.

Boyce caught 49% of his targeted passes in 2013 so he would have about 75-76 receptions.

7. But here's what has finally become clear to me this season. You don't have to be a "top 20 WR" to get those numbers on the Pats. Physically you have to have good hands, and quickness. Mentally you have to be fearless, tough, and smart The physical side is, frankly, easy to find. The mental aspect is harder, but its not like finding needles in a haystack. Just look at the fact that Welker, Cruz, and DA were all UDFA's and Edelman was a 7th round pick who never play WR in his life.

I disagree, you just named 4 players who are successful in the slot, I would subtract Amendola because I don’t feel he is successful I would deem him as solid, there are 32 teams in the NFL if they were so easy to find every team would have one.

 

[Brady6]

Miguel posted this in the Amendola thread...

Here's how to get rid of Amendola -
In February/March make him a June 2 designation.
That means the Pats would carry his $3 million salary and his $375,000 roster bonus on their books until June 2nd. On June 2nd he would be released. His 2014 cap number would then drop from $4.575m to $3.2million ($1.2 million signing bonus proration plus $2 million fully guaranteed salary - net cap savings in 2014 of around $800K.

His 2015 cap number would go from $5,575,000 to $3,600,000.

So apparently there is a way that we can move away from Amendola without it being as detrimental to our salary cap, if this is true as I said in the Amendola thread I would expect us to either offer a restructured deal at considerably less money and eliminate most of the guaranteed money or cut ties with Amendola and move on. Whether you like him or don’t like him we know that he cannot be trusted or relied upon (Edelman might not be able to be either based on history) so it makes sense to move away from him and retain the player we know is effective in that role - Edelman and then invest in a player who is less redundant to Edelman.

 

[manxman2601]

Miguel posted this in the Amendola thread...


So apparently there is a way that we can move away from Amendola without it being as detrimental to our salary cap, if this is true as I said in the Amendola thread I would expect us to either offer a restructured deal at considerably less money and eliminate most of the guaranteed money or cut ties with Amendola and move on. Whether you like him or don’t like him we know that he cannot be trusted or relied upon (Edelman might not be able to be either based on history) so it makes sense to move away from him and retain the player we know is effective in that role - Edelman and then invest in a player who is less redundant to Edelman.

please try to limit your dislike for Amendola to one thread.

 

[Brady6]

please try to limit your dislike for Amendola to one thread.

It is not about like or dislike it is about fielding the best Patriots team possible. It is not in the best interest of this team to invest in 2 players (Edelman and Amendola) that have a skillset that is best in the slot, if the league did not have a salary cap and this was the Yankee's hell yeah keep everyone but we only have so many resources to allocate to positions. We know Edelman can give us the production in the slot we're still unsure about Amendola so it makes the most sense to keep Edelman and then sign a true Y-WR or a TE-Flex to play with Gronkowski, Edelman and Dobson.

 

[mgteich]

1) The patriots have $6.8M in dead money (unamortized bonus plus $2M of guaranteed salary) to account for.

2) $2M of the $3M of Amendola's salary is guaranteed. The cost to the patriots of keeping Amendola is $1.375M of new money.

3) Cutting Amendola after 2014 is a totally different dynamic. The contract ramifications are clear. The contract was set up as a 2-year contact, with three one-year options for the patriots.

3) If you really need a sub forum dedicated to why Amendola isn't worth $375K of money and another $1M if he makes the team, I guess we can talk to Ian.

BOTTOM LINE
IMHO, there is not way that Amendola isn't worth a $1.375M show-me contract, especially that he could be cut in camp if he really wan't worth the money. I simply don't see why it makes sense to replace him with a minimum salary. To say it another way, Amendola is worth $1.375M as our #5 receiver.

Miguel posted this in the Amendola thread...


So apparently there is a way that we can move away from Amendola without it being as detrimental to our salary cap, if this is true as I said in the Amendola thread I would expect us to either offer a restructured deal at considerably less money and eliminate most of the guaranteed money or cut ties with Amendola and move on. Whether you like him or don’t like him we know that he cannot be trusted or relied upon (Edelman might not be able to be either based on history) so it makes sense to move away from him and retain the player we know is effective in that role - Edelman and then invest in a player who is less redundant to Edelman.

 

[manxman2601]

It is not about like or dislike it is about fielding the best Patriots team possible. It is not in the best interest of this team to invest in 2 players (Edelman and Amendola) that have a skillset that is best in the slot, if the league did not have a salary cap and this was the Yankee's hell yeah keep everyone but we only have so many resources to allocate to positions. We know Edelman can give us the production in the slot we're still unsure about Amendola so it makes the most sense to keep Edelman and then sign a true Y-WR or a TE-Flex to play with Gronkowski, Edelman and Dobson.

Look I'm not going to try to reason with you on Amendola, your bias is clear in almost every post. All I'm asking is that you don't infect the whole board with it. The number of threads I'm having to avoid is growing larger day by day it seems. It's up to you, all I ask is that you consider other users who don't share your rather negative views.

 

[Brady6]

1) The patriots have $6.8M in dead money (unamortized bonus plus $2M of guaranteed salary) to account for.

2) $2M of the $3M of Amendola's salary is guaranteed. The cost to the patriots of keeping Amendola is $1.375M of new money.

3) Cutting Amendola after 2014 is a totally different dynamic. The contract ramifications are clear. The contract was set up as a 2-year contact, with three one-year options for the patriots.

3) If you really need a sub forum dedicated to why Amendola isn't worth $375K of money and another $1M if he makes the team, I guess we can talk to Ian.

BOTTOM LINE
IMHO, there is not way that Amendola isn't worth a $1.375M show-me contract, especially that he could be cut in camp if he really wan't worth the money. I simply don't see why it makes sense to replace him with a minimum salary. To say it another way, Amendola is worth $1.375M as our #5 receiver.

It is not always as cut and dry as what he is worth it is also about where he fits and if we would want to dedicate a roster spot and the money to a player who is not in our long term plans and isn't going to be a big part of our offense. I don’t know what the Patriots plans are for Amendola and Edelman but they're redundant which I think we can all agree. Do we want to use Amendola at the WR-Y and block Boyce or someone else, do we want to use more 3 WR sets to keep Amendola involved if we opt to draft or sign a top tight end in the offseason.

I mean the case could be made the other way do we want to retain Edelman or do we feel confident in moving forward with Amendola and believe that he will be productive in season 2? Honestly for me I am not anti-Amendola I am anti signing 2 slot receivers to similar contracts and then attempting to keep them on the field at the same time over players who may give us a different dynamic. I am more comfortable with Edelman because he has done it so that is why I am inclined to favor him but if it is Amendola that is fine if the team believes he can do it. I just cannot envision a situation where our resources are best allocated to both Amendola and Edelman.

 

[Brady6]

Look I'm not going to try to reason with you on Amendola, your bias is clear in almost every post. All I'm asking is that you don't infect the whole board with it. The number of threads I'm having to avoid is growing larger day by day it seems. It's up to you, all I ask is that you consider other users who don't share your rather negative views.

As I said in my post below I am not ant Amendola, I am disappointed in his performance which I have expressed before. In this context however I am looking at team building and that comes down to it not being in the best interest of this team to pay Amendola and Edelman in 2014 when they both fit best at the WR-Z (slot) in our offense. Ultimately I favor Edelman and not because I like him better but because he has done it and proven capable, Amendola has not so we would be paying for something that comes with a question mark as well.

As far as my bias goes it is amusing that after I have mentioned numerous times that you have a bias for Amendola you're now in here suggesting that I have one against him.

Bias - prejudice in favor of or against one thing, person, or group compared with another, usually in a way considered to be unfair.

Everything I post is built on comparisons to other players on the Patriots, other teams and historical data, everything I say is supported with context in the form of data, you on the other support Amendola with nothing other than your personal beliefs to support your posts, you never offer data, context, something comparable or even tangible to justify your position, that my friend is a bias and that is bad for this board not people talking about factual and tangible information in order to assess a value of a player or an overpayment of another.

You want to make everything out to be my personal issue with Amendola and that is not the case but you make yourself believe that because that allows you to justify your position, excuses and overall beliefs and ignore the creditable information I offer to disapprove those beliefs, so you drill into your brain that I have something against Amendola so you can say - "he just hates Amendola that’s why he thinks that" if you did not drill home that false belief you'd have no choice but to actually look at what I write about him and you'd find that much if not all is valid and supported with tangible evidence.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Look I'm not going to try to reason with you on Amendola, your bias is clear in almost every post. All I'm asking is that you don't infect the whole board with it. The number of threads I'm having to avoid is growing larger day by day it seems. It's up to you, all I ask is that you consider other users who don't share your rather negative views.

Manx, i know you would rather talk to him than about him but when it comes to this there is not much choice. Brady6 has been asked repeatedly by numerous posters to cut out the endless repetitive posts about Amendola and he has said he would do so repeatedly only to start right back up on it and now goes from thread to thread bringing it with him. It has gone beyond ridiculous and i can't read a thread without having to go past 2,000 Brady6 is on your ignore list posts. It's NEM all over again.