DRAFT DAY DISCUSSION The Official Round 1 2013 NFL Draft Thread

[BKBroiler]

Overall depth doesn't mean a damned thing to a team that doesn't need "overall depth". The Patriots don't need to worry about QB depth. They don't need to worry about the quality of 6th round TEs.

They need specific positions dealt with.

The Patriots have never been shy about taking a player in any round that they deemed to be the right value. Even if that player plays a position that us fans thought wasn't a position of need (an obvious recent example is Ryan Mallett). They also haven't been shy about trading back if they didn't like any of the players available, but some other team does. So yes, overall depth matters to the Patriots even if you don't think it matters.

And yes, although they aren't their most obvious needs (WR is obviously the top one), the Patriots do worry about QB depth (you never know if another team will decide to make a ridiculous offer for Mallett) and 6th Rd TEs (maybe an intriguing prospect like Kasa falls to the 5th-6th Rd). You - just like every other fan - should realize by now that the Patriots worry about every possible situation and make sure they are prepared as best as they can be to deal with them.

 

[BradyFTW!]

The Patriots have had excellent drafts in the past 3 years. Prior to that, they had poor/horrible drafts for about 4 years. In the meantime, Belichick hasn't picked an outright bust in the first round during his Patriots tenure. It's certainly valid to question which way this year will go, and to prefer to avoid the drop downs.

I do wonder if part of the reason why Belichick's been able to avoid first round busts is because he's so willing to trade out of the first round entirely. Same thing happened in 2008, when a lot of mocks had the Pats taking Darius Butler in the first. It could be that he didn't see anyone on the board who he was confident enough in not-busting that he was willing to invest a first.

 

[shmessy]

Another rambling incoherent post, topped off by acting like people shouldn't be anything but disappointed in Bequette.

What about the best TE combo on the face of the earth?

Meanwhile late first rounders have included Lawrence Maroney and Brandon Merriwether.

Sometimes, it makes sense and sometimes it doesn't.

I think you are just as out of touch and insipid as the poster who started the thread claiming that "what BB did to Minnesotas is outlawed in several states".

Kneejerk reactions that aren't worth a damn. Your Entertainment Tonight outlook is no deeper than his Up With People outlook.

 

[Deus Irae]

Yes, because a 3RD pick should be a starter by the end of the year at a postition the Pats are 5deep in. *roll*


Posted from Patsfans.com App for Android

If you think the Patriots were 5 deep at Bequette's position, you have a generous approach to the word "deep" as applied.

 

[tonyto3690]

Look at the list of guys we've gotten in the 2nd, 3rd and 4th rounds the past couple years.

Vollmer (All Pro)
Gronkowski (All Pro)
Hernandez (Probowler)
Spikes (Quality starter)
Cunningham (Quality role player)
Deion Branch (Quality role player)
Shane Vereen (Quality role player)
Stevan Ridley (future probowler)


I'm sure I'm missing a guy here or there, but that is A LOT of very good talent.

If we can get two more guys of that calibre I would be ecstatic.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Yes, because a 3RD pick should be a starter by the end of the year at a postition the Pats are 5deep in. *roll*


Posted from Patsfans.com App for Android

That's a bit of a straw man. Bequette was solidly beat out for playing time by an UDFA rookie (Francis). People are right to be disappointed in him. Pretty much everyone who's gone on to be a real contributor for the Pats has contributed at least *something* in their rookie season

 

[belichick010405]

One GM says this draft is historically bad | ProFootballTalk

"But he did say there were 13 to 15 players with “true” first-round grades, compared to 20 to 23 last year."

 

[Deus Irae]

The Patriots have never been shy about taking a player in any round that they deemed to be the right value. Even if that player plays a position that us fans thought wasn't a position of need (an obvious recent example is Ryan Mallett). They also haven't been shy about trading back if they didn't like any of the players available, but some other team does. So yes, overall depth matters to the Patriots even if you don't think it matters.

And yes, although they aren't their most obvious needs (WR is obviously the top one), the Patriots do worry about QB depth (you never know if another team will decide to make a ridiculous offer for Mallett) and 6th Rd TEs (maybe an intriguing prospect like Kasa falls to the 5th-6th Rd). You - just like every other fan - should realize by now that the Patriots worry about every possible situation and make sure they are prepared as best as they can be to deal with them.

You, just like every other fan, should realize by now that the Patriots screw the pooch about as often as most teams, and that preferring the higher percentage returns over the lower percentage returns is a perfectly understandable, and valid, preference.

Either approach works, when when they work. Both fail, when they fail.

And I didn't say that overall depth doesn't matter as a general principle. You aren't bothering to read for comprehension.

 

[Brady2Moss]

Yeah, those gronkowski, Hernandez, and Spikes guys all suck. Hate those guys.

Never said that, said the track record is not good in those rounds , reread the posts if you are confused its simple probabilities.

I'm trolling???? uh..newsflash nitwit...every single post you've made here is ARCHIVED...do I have to roll out page after page ,month after month since you signed up here , of YOUR posts...every single one of them NEGATIVE...you're a dyam troll and always have been...that's why you use that nick to ride the coat tails of other REAL pats fans that use the Brady to Moss handle...just go away you transparent hack...you are obviously a hatred filled jagoff with an agenda

This post is barely readable because of the dots, random capitalized outbursts, and excess punctuation of fragments (couldn't even manage to write a whole sentence?)

You clearly do not know what a troll is, there is a difference between someone with the opposite opinion of the majority and someone just seeking to rile people up. You are just spouting nonsense to get the homers to light their torches.

Right the only "real" Patriots fans are those that blindly believe in BB and value. I'm sorry that I don't place such a high value on being a "fan" as to think other fans want to ride my coat tails.

I'm clearly a jagoff Jets fan even though I have donated money to this site . Get a grip.

Brady2Moss - Did the Pats completely fail in the 2008 and 2009 drafts as well?

I see some guys in those drafts that are actually starters for this team. And those were the first two years for a former wide receivers coach of the Pats.

You need to drive to Foxborough with Deus and tell BB & Nick to step aside.

When did I ever say the Patriots have completely failed? I said stop fawning over some imaged beat down on the trade value chart it doesn't mean anything except we have more picks that maybe can lead to a higher yield of good players if a lot of picks in low percentage rounds pan out.

I never said ANYTHING about total draft failures, I said rounds 2-4.

Rounds 2-4 in 08 = Wheatley, Crable, O'Connell, Wilhite ALL garbage
I see NO starters in those rounds.
Rounds 2-4 in 09 = Chung, Brace, Butler, Vollmer, McKenzie, Ohrnberger
I see 1 starter in those rounds.

That is 10 picks 1 starter in the rounds I discussed. Stop changing the argument I never said anything about total draft failures.

 

[DaBruinz]

If you think the Patriots were 5 deep at Bequette's position, you have a generous approach to the word "deep" as applied.

Count them with me Deus:
Jones, Ninkovich, Cunningham, Francis, Scott, Bequette.

Bequette was a rookie and he was coming into an unfamiliar system. Anyone who tries to label Bequette a bust just doesn't understand football.

 

[Brady2Moss]

Yes, because a 3RD pick should be a starter by the end of the year at a postition the Pats are 5deep in. *roll*


Posted from Patsfans.com App for Android

No a 3rd round pick should be able to get on the field SHOULD be able to get a TACKLE just one in his rookie season at a position the Patriots have needed help at and still do. Good job again by changing my argument never said he should be a starter, I said you need impact players and trading back in some supposed fleecing (8 points on the value chart) is not going to make it any easier.

And again thanks for making my point that in rounds 3-4 you are not going to get a starter that makes an impact any time soon. Clocks ticking on Brady's career you need impact NOW.

 

[belichick010405]

Never said that, said the track record is not good in those rounds , reread the posts if you are confused its simple probabilities.




This post is barely readable because of the dots, random capitalized outbursts, and excess punctuation of fragments (couldn't even manage to write a whole sentence?)

You clearly do not know what a troll is, there is a difference between someone with the opposite opinion of the majority and someone just seeking to rile people up. You are just spouting nonsense to get the homers to light their torches.

Right the only "real" Patriots fans are those that blindly believe in BB and value. I'm sorry that I don't place such a high value on being a "fan" as to think other fans want to ride my coat tails.

I'm clearly a jagoff Jets fan even though I have donated money to this site . Get a grip.



When did I ever say the Patriots have completely failed? I said stop fawning over some imaged beat down on the trade value chart it doesn't mean anything except we have more picks that maybe can lead to a higher yield of good players if a lot of picks in low percentage rounds pan out.

I never said ANYTHING about total draft failures, I said rounds 2-4.

Rounds 2-4 in 08 = Wheatley, Crable, O'Connell, Wilhite ALL garbage
I see NO starters in those rounds.
Rounds 2-4 in 09 = Chung, Brace, Butler, Vollmer, McKenzie, Ohrnberger
I see 1 starter in those rounds.

That is 10 picks 1 starter in the rounds I discussed. Stop changing the argument I never said anything about total draft failures.

Can you let me know when you and Deus get to Foxborough in order to run rounds 2 and 3 so that we can track how the two of you are doing?

Thanks in advance.....

 

[Deus Irae]

I do wonder if part of the reason why Belichick's been able to avoid first round busts is because he's so willing to trade out of the first round entirely. Same thing happened in 2008, when a lot of mocks had the Pats taking Darius Butler in the first. It could be that he didn't see anyone on the board who he was confident enough in not-busting that he was willing to invest a first.

I think that could be part of it, and I think part of it is that he sometimes doesn't have a strong "that's the guy!" feeling in general (Wilfork/Seymour/Jones/etc...), while a year like last year shows what he's willing to do when does get to thinking "that's the guy!". We know that one of the weakest of the 1st round picks, Maroney, was one where there was a significant split among the staff about it, for example.

I also think he sometimes gets caught up in the value thing. 2009 really needs to serve him well as a bit of a cautionary tale guiding him when he starts letting that trade down desire become a bit too much.

 

[belichick010405]

No a 3rd round pick should be able to get on the field SHOULD be able to get a TACKLE just one in his rookie season at a position the Patriots have needed help at and still do. Good job again by changing my argument never said he should be a starter, I said you need impact players and trading back in some supposed fleecing (8 points on the value chart) is not going to make it any easier.

And again thanks for making my point that in rounds 3-4 you are not going to get a starter that makes an impact any time soon. Clocks ticking on Brady's career you need impact NOW.

I see so you are unhappy with the draft pick of Bequette? I am hopeful that he breaks through in his 2nd year alongside Wilfork and Jones.

What round were Ridley, Hernandez and Gronkowski drafted in again?

 

[condon84]

I don't know why we just didn't pick Patterson. He's got the height and speed to excel on the outside so he fills a need. Plus he's got the versatility that BB loves. Doesn't make sense to me.

 

[Deus Irae]

Count them with me Deus:
Jones, Ninkovich, Cunningham, Francis, Scott, Bequette.

Bequette was a rookie and he was coming into an unfamiliar system. Anyone who tries to label Bequette a bust just doesn't understand football.

Francis was a UDFA who beat out Bequette. Cunningham was an underperforming draft pick who beat out Bequette. Scott was a FA who woefully underperformed but still kept Bequette on the bench.

Anyone who doesn't acknowledge that Bequette was underwhelming, at best, last year, needs to read some football 101 textbooks.

 

[SVN]

i think the pats package a 2nd and 4th to move up to take a player. Trade the other 2nd for a first next yr or a 2nd and 3rd next yr and trade mallet possibly for a pick next yr.

 

[Run DMC]

Anyone expecting BB to build our team around the draft is nuts. Obviously, this is not the way we do it. We absolutely needed to get more picks in this draft and not unexpectedly, we traded down. Surprise, we picked up 4(!) picks for a lord knows what you're getting #29 draft pick. I have to say that was a masterful move by BB and I am not remotely afraid to call him out if I think he's screwed up (refer to my Welker posts). The draft has never defined this team. It is what it is.

 

[shmessy]

And again thanks for making my point that in rounds 3-4 you are not going to get a starter that makes an impact any time soon. Clocks ticking on Brady's career you need impact NOW.

Seriously. Who is #81? Who is #22?

You're not even trying to make sense now.

 

[strngplyr]

I don't know why we just didn't pick Patterson. He's got the height and speed to excel on the outside so he fills a need. Plus he's got the versatility that BB loves. Doesn't make sense to me.

He isn't a route runner and he's been called immature and supposedly has trouble understanding route concepts.

Those don't fit with what NE does.