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OT: LeBron James

In any event, Kontra, I ain't worried about this team. I don't see them winning it all without an above average big man.
 
In any event, Kontra, I ain't worried about this team. I don't see them winning it all without an above average big man.

This is where I'll agree with you. They need some size. Like I said, they have Pittman but he's a rookie and shouldn't be relied on to be a starting center on this team in his first year. Unfortunately, it looks like he may have to unless Shaq decides he wants to come back for the vet minimum (unlikely).
 
I think Rose is better at playing point and not being a selfish showboating gun
than Wade. 3 guns on a team is not going to win a championship. I think Boozer is a comparable scorer to Bosch and way more physical. The main difference is Bulls have better and younger role players on the roster than Miami by a mile. It's all about chemistry and I think the Bulls are way more balanced than Miami and Lebron would have been a better fit in chitown.

lol... what? No. Just no. Not that I particularly care, but Wade is much better than Rose. You call him selfish because he's one of the best scorers in the league. If Rose had half the offensive game that Wade does, he would do exactly the same.
 
I don't think his marketability is going to change. He's one of the most marketable athletes on the planet (second only to Manning). I don't think that's going to change if the Heat don't win a title right off the bat. On top of that, all of the proceeds of tonight went to the Boys and Girls club. Even if he did it for self-absorbing purposes, good things came out of it.

As for this team, we'll see. It's going to be interesting to see how Riley puts the pieces around these three guys.

I think you're rationalizing because the Heat is one of your teams...

The Cleveland fan base now hates him the way Packer fans hate Favre, actually maybe even more since at least Bret won one there before screwing with them. The NY/NJ and Chicago fan bases now hate him because he was available and they courted him and he didn't choose them. Laker fans and Celtic fans already hated him on principle. Most of the non Miami, non ESPN mediots now hate him because he's an easy target, the poster child for everything that is wrong with sports in this age of underachilving, undeserved mega celebrity they in fact created. If he wins, all will be forgiven from a media standpoint. If he doesn't, he becomes the equivalent of Peyton Manning before the ring had he left Indy high and dry and still not won...

This isn't even about money (Cleveland could have paid him more and NY could have promoted him better) or winning championships (Cleveland was competitive and could have become more competitive - he was the Cavalier who basically folded like a house of cards). This was about three guys who made a pact to play together as some bizarre package deal back in 2008. It will be interesting to see if they remain amigos should the going get rough. For LeBron its about being a star without being accountable. Wade will be the leader of the pack and if things don't pan out...it will be interesting to see whether the friendship endures...


As for the programming benefitting charity, might have been harmless if the decision was ultimately Cleveland. Charity is supposed to begin at home. Tonight LeBron is homeless.
 
I think you're rationalizing because the Heat is one of your teams...

In some instances, but not here. Tiger Woods' marketability wasn't hurt from turning into a gigolo. I highly doubt LeBron's marketability will be hurt by playing in Miami (a city that, in itself, is more marketable than Cleveland). All three guys (specifically Wade and James) stand to gain from this.

The Cleveland fan base now hates him the way Packer fans hate Favre, actually maybe even more since at least Bret won one there before screwing with them. The NY/NJ and Chicago fan bases now hate him because he was available and they courted him and he didn't choose them. Laker fans and Celtic fans already hated him on principle. Most of the non Miami, non ESPN mediots now hate him because he's an easy target, the poster child for everything that is wrong with sports in this age of underachilving, undeserved mega celebrity they in fact created. If he wins, all will be forgiven from a media standpoint. If he doesn't, he becomes the equivalent of Peyton Manning before the ring had he left Indy high and dry and still not won...

Again, people hate Tiger Woods and Kobe Bryant as well. I don't see Gatorade or Nike backing off from either guy. But yes, I will agree with you that LeBron and the Heat as a whole just became the super villains here. As of right now, they're the de facto favorites to win the East and possibly the entire thing (depending on the pieces Riley puts around the three of them). That's to be expected. But their market isn't hurt at all by this move. In fact, it's improved.

This isn't even about money (Cleveland could have paid him more and NY could have promoted him better) or winning championships (Cleveland was competitive and could have become more competitive - he was the Cavalier who basically folded like a house of cards). This was about three guys who made a pact to play together as some bizarre package deal back in 2008.

Well this is only a rumor, but it wouldn't suprise me if it were true. Even if they did make a pact to play together, I don't see the big deal.

It will be interesting to see if they remain amigos should the going get rough. For LeBron its about being a star without being accountable. Wade will be the leader of the pack and if things don't pan out...it will be interesting to see whether the friendship endures...

If you read my posts before this, you would know that this was my fear. Can LeBron come in and realize that this is Wade's team? That he's going to be a star, but not the kind he was in Cleveland? Time will tell. His comments tonight seem to indicate that he's aware of these facts, but the proof is in the pudding.

As for the programming benefitting charity, might have been harmless if the decision was ultimately Cleveland. Charity is supposed to begin at home. Tonight LeBron is homeless.

James made millions and millions of dollars for the city of Cleveland. The fact that he just made some money for a charity like the Boys and Girls Clubs of America is a good thing, no matter which way you try to cut it.
 
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Does anyone else think this is the most overblown bs ever?
The guy hasn't won anything, and its 24/7 coverage on where he will sign a FA contract. He is now going to have his own special announcement show on, of course, ESPN, and I think its an hour long show.
I hope whereever he goes he wins nothing his entire career.

Apparently the owner of the Cleveland Cavaliers wholeheartedly agrees with you...

Cavs owner Dan Gilbert posted an open letter to fans on the team's website ripping James and told The Associated Press he believes James did not play up to his abilities in Cleveland's second-round loss to Boston.

"He quit," Gilbert said. "Not just in Game 5, but in Games 2, 4 and 6. Watch the tape. The Boston series was unlike anything in the history of sports for a superstar. ... People have covered up for him for way too long."

Not Gilbert, not anymore.

"As you now know, our former hero, who grew up in the very region that he deserted this evening, is no longer a Cleveland Cavalier," Gilbert wrote. "This was announced with a several day, narcissistic, self-promotional build-up culminating with a national TV special of his 'decision' unlike anything ever 'witnessed' in the history of sports and probably the history of entertainment. Clearly, this is bitterly disappointing to all of us.

"The self-declared former 'King' will be taking the 'curse' with him down south. And until he does 'right' by Cleveland and Ohio, James (and the town where he plays) will unfortunately own this dreaded spell and bad karma.

"Just watch."

Ouch.



LeBron James walks away from Cleveland for Miami | Comcast.net
 
More ouch. Nobody roots for a chicken...

LeBron James just jumped into an elevator and wants us to think he can fly. Sorry, but we know better. We know that he did something Michael, Magic, Bird and Bill Russell never would have done. We know he ditched Cleveland for an All-Star team.

But you know what? In Miami, anything short of a title will be a failure. Nobody outside of Miami will root for this team, and nobody in Miami roots for anybody. They're too busy enjoying the weather.

I thought he would stay in Cleveland, because I thought all he cared about was adoration. I was wrong about Cleveland, but he is wrong about adoration. He thinks he'll get it by winning a title. He has insulated himself from the world, surrounded himself with yes men. He has no idea how much backlash he is about to get.

That's one of the great ironies of this -- James is trying to flee pressure, but he will just face more of it. He is trying to maximize his "brand," but he just damaged it.

The first time I watched LeBron James live, I thought he could be the greatest player ever. The sad truth for us, for him, and for the NBA is that he never really believed it himself.

LeBron James*took the easy way out in choosing star-studded Heat - Michael Rosenberg - SI.com
 
As I understand things the Heat are now in a position where beyond the 4 guys on the roster (the you know whos + Chamers) the other 8 guys on the roster will be min salary guys IOW scrubs.

I don't think you can win an NBA title with 3 stars and 8 scrubs. If these clowns don't win the blowback will be mind boggling.
 
As I understand things the Heat are now in a position where beyond the 4 guys on the roster (the you know whos + Chamers) the other 8 guys on the roster will be min salary guys IOW scrubs.

I don't think you can win an NBA title with 3 stars and 8 scrubs. If these clowns don't win the blowback will be mind boggling.


With James, Bosh and Wade each getting the max of $16.6 million per year, first year with a $58 million cap, that leaves $8 million for 10 roster spots. Unless they start playing 3 on 3 ball and pray for no injuries, as you said, they are not winning it all....
 
There is a reason New York is called the greatest city in the world. With that being said, F**K Lebron!

who are the ones saying that NY is the greatest city in the world? NYers - there the ones that hype NYC like everything.
 
NY is the greatest city in the world if you like garbage land fills and dirt and the smell of piss in the mourning while walking down the st. NY is a open land fill..
 
Lebron is a fraud. He will fit perfectly in Miami with the Dolphin fans and the 50 people that show up to Miami Hurricane games. Maybe now the Heat won't play in front of the same size crowd as the Marlins.

I am sure Lebron's mom will enjoy trolling the trailer park in Coral Gables.
 
Apparently the owner of the Cleveland Cavaliers wholeheartedly agrees with you...



Ouch.



LeBron James walks away from Cleveland for Miami | Comcast.net

The only thing "ouch" about this report is that Gilbert's feelings are hurt because he and his brand spanking new coach will be watching his team play sub-.500 ball next year. If Gilbert wants to blame anyone for that horrific playoff series against Boston last year, he should maybe point the finger at his coach. There is no reason Mike Brown should have been retained after what had happened in Orlando the year before. In doing so, the team was doomed in 2009-2010.

As I understand things the Heat are now in a position where beyond the 4 guys on the roster (the you know whos + Chamers) the other 8 guys on the roster will be min salary guys IOW scrubs.

I don't think you can win an NBA title with 3 stars and 8 scrubs. If these clowns don't win the blowback will be mind boggling.

How quickly you forget about similar questions surrounding the Celtics after they wrapped up signing the Big 3 prior to 2008. I've asked before and I'll ask again, do you really think Pat Reilly isn't going to surround these guys with capable role players? They already have Mario Chalmers who can most likely go from a 10 PPG guy to a 15 PPG guy. The rest is up to the Heat front office, who I have faith in.
 
WOW! Just read the letter from the Cleveland owner calling James a coward. I know this will be censored, but what a ****!
He claims that the Cav's will win a title before James does. How does he figure. I'm guessing that Miami is the favorite to win the title next year. Cleveland just lost it's best player to free agency, then badmouthed him publicly. Yea, this will help acquire new basketball talent to Cleveland. He gave you 7 years, and you did not win a title. He's a free agent and has no obligation to you. What part of that business do you not understand?
 
How quickly you forget about similar questions surrounding the Celtics after they wrapped up signing the Big 3 prior to 2008. I've asked before and I'll ask again, do you really think Pat Reilly isn't going to surround these guys with capable role players? They already have Mario Chalmers who can most likely go from a 10 PPG guy to a 15 PPG guy. The rest is up to the Heat front office, who I have faith in.

First of all, I'd be stoked if the Celtics had this younger "Big Three" as much as I appreciate Banner 17 and the potential for Banner 18.

For those who think that with all that salary tied up in James, Wade and Bosh prevents them from gaining the other role players that they'll need, they need look no further than the Celtics, as you note.

That being said, you've got to factor in Ainge's talent in finding and signing those role players (helped by recruiting by our own Big Three) as well as a degree of luck (drafting Rondo was a bit of both) and the desire of some quality role players to come to Boston for less than full market value.

Whether the Heat can duplicate the Celts' championship comes down to a number of questions:

1. GM - will Pat Riley have the ability and luck needed to sign the additional role players needed to win a championship? That remains to be seen. He's had some hits and misses in player selection - but then again who hasn't? Much here depends on whether the right role players will buy into the need to accept below market value to make more in a future contract as well.

2. Coach - can Pat Riley manage the huge egos he's now dealing with? The short answer is a clear "Yes" - he's done so in the past but much depends on the players themselves. (See #3)

3. The Players - Can the new Big Three coexist, share the ball and excel? I'd say "yes" but it will be interesting to see how they do when they hit a rough patch - losing some games, as they certainly will - and seeing if the pressure and blame game undermines their relationship.

Doc Rivers did a tremendous job getting everyone on the same page with his "Ubuntu" schtick - and the players deserve credit for pulling together as well. That's not easy to replicate - the fact that the Celts Big Three was older was actually a big PLUS for the Celtics as they had spent 10 plus years in the league and knew the clock was ticking.

The Younger Big Three in Miami will have to be considerably more mature than their ages or egos suggest they can be if they want this to work.

4. Health - Players get injured. Dominating the regular season means nothing if one isn't healthy and playing well in the playoffs. Younger players are not immune to injury and a Big Two, without enough role players around (particularly a rough rebounder in the middle), will not be enough to win a Championship.

5. Pressure - There's a ton of attention and pressure on Miami and all these player now (I know I'll be watching) and any faltering, anything short of sheer dominance, anything short of a championship will be looked at as failure. Things are set up nicely for a Banner - but they are set up just as nicely for immense disappointment amid immense pressure.

So there's still a lot of factors at play here that will keep it interesting for the Heat and for the rest of the NBA, which still has many teams that can dethrone a Heat team that's yet to even have one practice.

But overall, congrats to KontradictioN and all Heat fans for this major coup of team assembly. I'd be pretty stoked if I were you.
 
WOW! Just read the letter from the Cleveland owner calling James a coward. I know this will be censored, but what a ****!
He claims that the Cav's will win a title before James does. How does he figure. I'm guessing that Miami is the favorite to win the title next year. Cleveland just lost it's best player to free agency, then badmouthed him publicly. Yea, this will help acquire new basketball talent to Cleveland. He gave you 7 years, and you did not win a title. He's a free agent and has no obligation to you. What part of that business do you not understand?

It was certainly harsh, but I don't blame him given the context.

#1 - he's the team's owner. He needs to reflect the anger of the citizens and re-direct it away from himself and the team for failing to lure LeBron back.

#2 - he needs to keep people coming to games. His boast of winning a title before the Heat is somewhat laughable but you've got to give him credit for boldness.

#3 - This isn't just the Cav's best player. This is a guy who people in Cleveland have been watching religiously since he was a Freshman in High School. Rooting for the Cavs - during years when the religiously workshiped Browns have been a mockery of a football organization - has been one of the only things that has kept the morale of this dying city afloat.

Now their heart was literally rippled out of what was the strongest sports team the region had to root for by the hometown kid they've rooted for and watched grow up around them. He's put himself before the city, and while I can't say I blame him for wanting a championship, and deciding that wasn't going to happen in Cleveland, he had to know he'd be vilified - especially in making the announcement the way he did, putting salt on a knife and plunging it into the Heart of Cleveland on a national hyped up television announcement.

LeBron has to own all of that for doing what he did in the way that he did it.

The Cavs have correctly assessed that they need to tap into the anger in the fan base that LeBron's actions have caused and use it to their advantage, as much as they can. The letter and sentiment from the organization is a wise move IMO, just as much as LeBron's lack of class in his announcement was unwise.
 
It was certainly harsh, but I don't blame him given the context.

#1 - he's the team's owner. He needs to reflect the anger of the citizens and re-direct it away from himself and the team for failing to lure LeBron back.

#2 - he needs to keep people coming to games. His boast of winning a title before the Heat is somewhat laughable but you've got to give him credit for boldness.

#3 - This isn't just the Cav's best player. This is a guy who people in Cleveland have been watching religiously since he was a Freshman in High School. Rooting for the Cavs - during years when the religiously workshiped Browns have been a mockery of a football organization - has been one of the only things that has kept the morale of this dying city afloat.

Now their heart was literally rippled out of what was the strongest sports team the region had to root for by the hometown kid they've rooted for and watched grow up around them. He's put himself before the city, and while I can't say I blame him for wanting a championship, and deciding that wasn't going to happen in Cleveland, he had to know he'd be vilified - especially in making the announcement the way he did, putting salt on a knife and plunging it into the Heart of Cleveland on a national hyped up television announcement.

LeBron has to own all of that for doing what he did in the way that he did it.

The Cavs have correctly assessed that they need to tap into the anger in the fan base that LeBron's actions have caused and use it to their advantage, as much as they can. The letter and sentiment from the organization is a wise move IMO, just as much as LeBron's lack of class in his announcement was unwise.

I couldn't disagree with you more.
First, I'm not a James fan.
I couldn't stand the circus atmosphere which was played out.
Having said that, it was classless what the owner did. I do not believe the fan base feels what he printed. I'm sure there are some homers that are proud of him. Put it this way, Brady is James in the same scenario, and Kraft makes national news by calling Brady a coward. Therefore, Patriot fans agree with assessment.
 
I couldn't disagree with you more.
First, I'm not a James fan.
I couldn't stand the circus atmosphere which was played out.
Having said that, it was classless what the owner did. I do not believe the fan base feels what he printed. I'm sure there are some homers that are proud of him. Put it this way, Brady is James in the same scenario, and Kraft makes national news by calling Brady a coward. Therefore, Patriot fans agree with assessment.

You're comparing apples and oranges...

Depending on your age, imagine a 6' 4" Doug Flutie - having grown up in Natick, demonstrated himself as a football phenom and gone on to be the uber star star of hometown Boston College

... then the Patriots, having never won a Lombardi, draft him, giving the region huge hopes for a strong team to root for at a time when the owner of the fabled Boston Red Sox franchise had secretly moved the organization out of town in a midnight run of moving trucks

The region is hurting both in the economy and in general low sports morale yet our local "Super Doug Flutie" gives real hope of sheer sports dominance for years to come, even saying that his one main goal is to bring a championship to the area that he loves and grew up in!

Then, he reaches free agency... he teases the region by flirting with other teams but keeps things cute and coy purposefully keeping his intentions a secret and then securing an egotistical nationally televised over-hyped sports special to announce....

... that he's stabbing his hometown and hometown fans who have supported and cheered for him since he was a little boy, right in the middle of the heart on national TV.

People are hurt and angry and Kraft knows it - and vows to do what our anti-Doug Flutie did - and bring a Championship to a region that he believes deserves it now more than ever before - using that anger and bold prediction to buck up morale and more importantly ticket sales.

The classy but meek response of saying "oh well, we tried and we wish him luck" might have been welcome by some who will always love LeBron even though he never fufilled his pledge to bring a championship, but I think the meek approach had more risks than the angry response.
 
With James, Bosh and Wade each getting the max of $16.6 million per year, first year with a $58 million cap, that leaves $8 million for 10 roster spots. Unless they start playing 3 on 3 ball and pray for no injuries, as you said, they are not winning it all....

I really haven't followed b-ball in a long time --- is it moving to a hard cap?
and if it did, wouldn't current deals be grandfathered in somehow?

pretty much every team in the league is over the cap, except maybe a couple.

didn't pierce, garnett, and allen make 50m+ last year?
 
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Comparing it to Brady doesn't make a lot of sense.

For one, we know Brady wants to be here and would sign an extension - and we know Kraft wants him back, and would like to work something out.

More importantly, Brady has won us 3 championships. If he were to leave, the fans would probably find ample blame for both him and management, but it would probably be as amicable a parting as possible. Its hard to begrudge a player who rescued your franchise.

Lebron showed no real interest in staying in Cleveland, other than family ties to the area, which has nothing to do with the fans.

Furthermore, he hasn't won anything, he hasn't rescued the team from anything, and he hasn't made the sports in that area any better. In fact, he is leaving the team in about as awful a situation as one can.

Lastly, he turned the whole thing into a charade, and went on national TV to break the entire Ohio area's collective hearts. That's unprecedented and likely will never be topped.

The guy is a complete d-bag. There really is no way around it.
 
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