Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft picks

[Deus Irae]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

Deus - Thank you for the perfect example of stats without context.

In 2005, when Burgess put up 16 sacks, he was lining up at RDE next to Warren Sapp or Ted Washington.

In 2006, when Burgess put up 11 sacks, he was lining up next to Tommy Kelly or Warren Sapp.

In 2007, when Burgess put up only 8 sacks, he was lining up next to Gerard Warren or Terdell Sands.

And in 2008, when Burgess put up only 3.5 sacks, he lined up at both LDE (strong side) and RDE and was either next to Tommy Kelly (LDT) or Gerard Warren (RDT).

What I notice is that as the quality of talent that Burgess was lining up next to went down, so did his sacks. Meaning that teams were able to focus on him more with double teams.

Stats without context? Oh, please: I pointed out an obvious trend, nothing more. It's not out of context at all. It's precisely IN context. Of course, the irony is that you're apologizing for his decline instead of just conceding it. It was the other players. No, it was his boo boos. No, it's because he was on the Raiders. Everyone like you is defending against the 'stats without context' rather than simply acknowledging them and admitting that they bring up a valid question about his game. Much like Moss a couple of years ago, Bryant last season and Bodden this season, Burgess is coming to the Patriots on a down note and the responsible thing is to ask whether or not that downward trend will continue.

 

[bostonia3333]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

I love this move. I am relieved the Pats can finally put some pressure on opposing qbs. Perhaps Belichick will use Burgess sparingly b/c health will be an issue. I think Belichick will use Burgess against the teams with elite qbs, like IND and NO. Why risk a stupid injury against the crappy game manager qbs that the Jets, Dolphins, and the rest of NFL siberia have???:singing:

 

[spacecrime]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

The big question to be answered....

Will Burgess be a Raiders defection to NE more like a Randy Moss? or more like a Doug Gabriel?

Inquiring minds need to know...soon

How many pro bowls had Doug Gabriel gone to?

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

According to Ian Rapaport at the Herald via Borges (who is an old Raider toady) the deal is for 2010 3rd and 4th round picks that are conditional on the 4th becoming a 5th should the NEP acquire a pick in round 5

BostonHerald.com - Blogs: Rap Sheet

 

[RayClay]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

Deus - Thank you for the perfect example of stats without context.

In 2005, when Burgess put up 16 sacks, he was lining up at RDE next to Warren Sapp or Ted Washington.

In 2006, when Burgess put up 11 sacks, he was lining up next to Tommy Kelly or Warren Sapp.

In 2007, when Burgess put up only 8 sacks, he was lining up next to Gerard Warren or Terdell Sands.

And in 2008, when Burgess put up only 3.5 sacks, he lined up at both LDE (strong side) and RDE and was either next to Tommy Kelly (LDT) or Gerard Warren (RDT).

What I notice is that as the quality of talent that Burgess was lining up next to went down, so did his sacks. Meaning that teams were able to focus on him more with double teams.

8 sacks isn't bad. He was injured last year. I'm sure there is that affect, but it's much less dramatic when you mention he missed 6 games and who knows how healthy he was in the others.

Two full seasons, then 8 sacks in 14 games, 3.5 in 10.

Triceps injury, whatever that entails. Seems to be healthy this year (crosses fingers).

 

[spacecrime]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

A 2011 3rd and a 2011 5th? That's like a 2010 4th and 6th, so no- I'm not dissapointed at all- but thanks anyway!

Sorry, I thought you posted that you would be dssappointed if teh Pats gave up more than a fourth round pick. Must have been someone else

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

Then people like 'BRO' would have to find something else to whine about.

I was obviously right, wasn't I?

 

[signbabybrady]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

I was obviously right, wasn't I?

wait you like the Burgess move....he isn't to old for your tastes???

 

[spacecrime]

Re: DAM ... Belichick must be a HUGE Riaders fan ?

You missed the point.

No he didn't. Re-read what you wrote.

 

[Patjew]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

Guy is big and fast.

I hope he's as good in coverage.

He also seems to enjoy punishing QBs.

 

[DaBruinz]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

I am delighted by this trade.

Clearly the one major hole on the team, injuries aside.

The salary implication is interesting. This could put the Patriots right up against the cap, once the regular season accounting begins.

According to Miguel, the Pats had 4.63 million in cap space. That was before all the other rookies were signed, though. However, the only one who may jump into the Top 51 was Chung.

Also, there have been other roster moves.

Burgess had a salary of 2 million and a roster bonus of 1.5 million. Its unknown whether that roster bonus had already been paid by the Raiders. My guess was that it had. So, Burgess number is either 2 million or 3.5 million. Either way, that only adjusts the top 51 by 600K or 2.6Mill because of the cutting of Al Johnson who had a cap hit of 950K.

I agree that Burgess is a passing-downs player, and this should be a great fit. Woods is very good against the run and very weak against the pass. Crable is supposed to offer pass rush, but he missed last year and has already missed over 15 practices. However, he should be able to learn something from Burgess.

At this point I would envision a three-man OLB rotation, with Burgess subbing for both Woods and Thomas. For Woods, Burgess can come in with the nickel. For Thomas, he can play occasional series. If Crable is ready, this can become a four-man rotation later in the season.

I don't see Burgess subbing for both because I think its a waste of Burgess talent to put him up against a TE by lining him up on the strong side.

The team got better today.

As long as Burgess is healthy and in shape, then I agree with you.

 

[jmt57]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

According to Ian Rapaport at the Herald via Borges (who is an old Raider toady) the deal is for 2010 3rd and 4th round picks that are conditional on the 4th becoming a 5th should the NEP acquire a pick in round 5

BostonHerald.com - Blogs: Rap Sheet

If that is true then it is a fait accompli that the Pats acquire a fifth round pick somewhere between now and draft day next April.

 

[DaBruinz]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

This is the last year of his contract; he's a free agent in 2010.

He'll make $3.5 million this year.

He'll make 2.0 million this year in salary and 1.5 million as a roster bonus. It remains to be seen whether the Raiders already paid the roster bonus or not.

 

[Patjew]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

How many pro bowls had Doug Gabriel gone to?

That's what I was thinking. Was Gabriel ever considered "good"?

 

[RayClay]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

He also seems to enjoy punishing QBs.

He seems kind of mean.

 

[DaBruinz]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

Big diffrence between playing it in a package in the red zone for the worst team in the league (and not in a 2gap) and starting for the SB favorites.

Do you know that they only played the 1 gap in Oakland? At one point under Ryan, they had Bobby Hamilton and Ted Washington on that line. It was the year that Burgess put up 16 sacks. For all we know, Burgess could thrive in the 2 Gap system.

 

[patchick]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

If that is true then it is a fait accompli that the Pats acquire a fifth round pick somewhere between now and draft day next April.

Indeed -- I'm betting on that "somewhere" happening during round 2. With 3 2nd-round picks, a little moving around is awfully likely.

 

[patchick]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

He'll make 2.0 million this year in salary and 1.5 million as a roster bonus. It remains to be seen whether the Raiders already paid the roster bonus or not.

Wow, I totally missed that! Several non-official sources suggest the bonus was already paid, which changes things considerably.

EDIT: Here's an SF Chronicle Raiders blog that confirms:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/raiders/detail?blogid=11&entry_id=44518

 

[RayClay]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

According to Ian Rapaport at the Herald via Borges (who is an old Raider toady) the deal is for 2010 3rd and 4th round picks that are conditional on the 4th becoming a 5th should the NEP acquire a pick in round 5

BostonHerald.com - Blogs: Rap Sheet

Patsfans contest. Who get's traded for a 5th?

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Pats acquire DE/OLB Derrick Burgess for draft pick

...Seems to be healthy this year (crosses fingers).

Story of every defender on this team, it seems, on an annual basis.