Josh McDaniels

[Armchair Quarterback]

No, I said two things. I said Marshall wanted out. I said Marshall had his problem with ownership and the training staff, not McDaniels. Both are correct. It was Bowlen, not McDaniels, who decided to get rid of Cutler.

Marshall's quotes directly refute your claim that he had no problem with McDaniels. Cutler was traded because he could not work things out with JMD and refused to report to the team. And it was Cutler's camp that first requested the trade.

 

[PP2]

Get used to the idea. Reiss mentioned it years ago when McDaniels went to Denver. Ever since he came back, all the whispers seem to indicate that if BB hangs it up in 2-3 years that's the way it would play out.

He retires, McDaniels gets Brady to transition for a couple seasons, and then they move on to the next chapter. Scary to think about, but that seems to be the way things are headed.

Don't think BB is going to hang it up before he wins another one or two. I seem to remember him saying he doesn't want to coach forever, maybe to when he's 70?

Also don't think Brady is the type of player to "transition." He's too proud to do that. He'll either retire abruptly or sign elsewhere where he can start full-time. My guess is that BB will keep going after Brady moves on, for a few more years, with Mallett or a better QB if we can find one.

Of course if I were BB, I would retire when Brady does. Never going to get better than what we had with Brady, so might as well go out on top. ]

He'll do fine post-football anyway, as long he stays away from public speaking.

 

[Rob0729]

Marshall's quotes directly refute your claim that he had no problem with McDaniels. Cutler was traded because he could not work things out with JMD and refused to report to the team. And it was Cutler's camp that first requested the trade.

Marshall had a problem with the world until he was diagnosed and treated for a mental disorder. I don't know if it speak at all to McDaniels if he had a problem with him.

I thought Cutler's problem stemmed from the Broncos interest in Cassel got out and his ego couldn't handle it. I really wasn't anything that happened between McDaniels and Cutler because Cutler asked to be traded a month or so after McDaniels got the job. It was that he didn't like the fact that the Broncos were looking to get Cassel. It really was the fault of the Broncos unable to pull the trigger and someone leaking that the Broncos tried to get Cassel.

I guess it was McDaniels' fault because he prefered Cassel over Cutler and was unable to get him. But it wasn't like there was a personality issue with the coach and player. They barely knew each other and had very limited interaction before the meltdown.

Basically, McDaniels knew Cutler is not a QB you want to hitch your wagon to unless you have a dominant defense that can cover for his costly mistakes by being a gunslinger.

I blame McDaniels more for taking a job with an established QB that he didn't want than anything that happened with Cutler. He could have gone elsewhere where he could have easily replaced the incumbent QB. But in Denver, people mistakingly thought that Cutler was a winner.

 

[Deus Irae]

Marshall's quotes directly refute your claim that he had no problem with McDaniels. Cutler was traded because he could not work things out with JMD and refused to report to the team. And it was Cutler's camp that first requested the trade.

Read for comprehension. Marshall's problem was that Cutler was traded. The decision to trade Cutler was made by Bowlen, after Cutler refused to return his calls. Cutler was also caught lying about this, since his own agent undercut his claim. We've got all this stuff in past threads.

All we're really doing here is re-hashing them with Brady6 taking Maverick's place.

 

[Brady6]

There's no strawman. Your arguments sucked and have been easily refuted. You are the one who tried buiding up Shanahan, and I just responded to that. You got pretty much every Denver point wrong.

Keep telling yourself that ace

Frankly, you're clowning yourself, just like you've done with the Amendola threads.

For somebody who appears to be a bright dude you make write some foolish posts. Danny Amendola has 37 receptions for 412 receiving yards and 1 touchdown this season that is not $5.7 million a year production, Josh McDaniels was combine 14-34 in his 3 seasons away from Belichick (2 as the HC in Denver and 1 as the OC in St Louis). You can attempt to pass the blame to whoever you want, make as many excuses as you desire it does not change the outcome of the situation. If during the Hernandez trial we learn that he or one of his associates accidentally shot Lloyd it does not change the fact that they killed him, maybe they get a lesser sentence but there will still be a sentence. You think making excuses or blaming other people justifies an outcome or gives someone a pass but it doesn’t Josh McDaniels was the captain of the ship in Denver and that ship sunk and as the captain he is the most to blame.

At the end of the day Josh McDaniels was given an opportunity that coaches in this country would give an arm or a leg for and he hacked it, screwed it up royally you can say other factors caused that too but it does matter he was still a primary factor in the failure of that team. Why should Josh be given another chance, do you know how many guys I was deployed with over the years who made mistakes and nobody not even god (if you believe in that) gave them another chance, their mistakes were their outcome whether others contributed to that or not, but that’s beside the point the NFL is not war so give the guy another chance to go somewhere and be a head coach that's fine but it should be a team that has a losing record and needs to be rebuilt, make him earn his stripes. You suggesting that Josh McDaniels should have the privilege of taking over this franchise from Bill ******* Belichick the greatest coach to ever step on a field is a JOKE, that is like giving someone who just crashed their Honda a Ferrari it is ridiculous and frankly I cannot believe that you are saying otherwise.

 

[Deus Irae]

Keep telling yourself that ace

I don't have to. It's clear enough. As I just noted, this stuff is nothing new. You're just taking the Maverick role.

For somebody who appears to be a bright dude you make write some foolish posts. Danny Amendola has 37 receptions for 412 receiving yards and 1 touchdown this season that is not $5.7 million a year production, Josh McDaniels was combine 14-34 in his 3 seasons away from Belichick (2 as the HC in Denver and 1 as the OC in St Louis). You can attempt to pass the blame to whoever you want, make as many excuses as you desire it does not change the outcome of the situation. If during the Hernandez trial we learn that he or one of his associates accidentally shot Lloyd it does not change the fact that they killed him, maybe they get a lesser sentence but there will still be a sentence. You think making excuses or blaming other people justifies an outcome or gives someone a pass but it doesn’t Josh McDaniels was the captain of the ship in Denver and that ship sunk and as the captain he is the most to blame.

At the end of the day Josh McDaniels was given an opportunity that coaches in this country would give an arm or a leg for and he hacked it, screwed it up royally you can say other factors caused that too but it does matter he was still a primary factor in the failure of that team. Why should Josh be given another chance, do you know how many guys I was deployed with over the years who made mistakes and nobody not even god (if you believe in that) gave them another chance, their mistakes were their outcome whether others contributed to that or not, but that’s beside the point the NFL is not war so give the guy another chance to go somewhere and be a head coach that's fine but it should be a team that has a losing record and needs to be rebuilt, make him earn his stripes. You suggesting that Josh McDaniels should have the privilege of taking over this franchise from Bill ******* Belichick the greatest coach to ever step on a field is a JOKE, that is like giving someone who just crashed their Honda a Ferrari it is ridiculous and frankly I cannot believe that you are saying otherwise.

There's nothing that was foolish about my posts, and I'm not defending Amendola. I wanted Welker kept here, I haven't changed my mind about that, and Amendola has certainly lived up to his injury history.

That doesn't make your over-the-top threads about Amendola right, and it doesn't mean you haven't been clowning yourself in them.

 

[fumbrunner]

You suggesting that Josh McDaniels should have the privilege of taking over this franchise from Bill ******* Belichick the greatest coach to ever step on a field is a JOKE, that is like giving someone who just crashed their Honda a Ferrari it is ridiculous and frankly I cannot believe that you are saying otherwise.

Here's how I look at it. Head coaches sometimes do not meet their full potential in their first go-round. BB is one example, the team's move notwithstanding. I think Mcdaniels is a good offensive mind, that I think learned alot from his first head coach stint. As I mentioned earlier, I think it was a mistake to give him defacto carte blanche on player personnel moves. In the long run, I think that experience will make him a more well rounded coach.

I get that people have issues with his play calling, etc. But who better to take over from BB than the one that will have spent a decade (give or take a year or two) under his tutelage?

 

[Brady6]

I don't have to. It's clear enough. As I just noted, this stuff is nothing new. You're just taking the Maverick role.

You can pretend it is how ever you please, I am not expecting the poster I am having a debate with to endorse my point of view

There's nothing that was foolish about my posts, and I'm not defending Amendola. I wanted Welker kept here, I haven't changed my mind about that, and Amendola has certainly lived up to his injury history.

That doesn't make your over-the-top threads about Amendola right, and it doesn't mean you haven't been clowning yourself in them.

You're trying to justify failure with the explanation of circumstance, that is such a childish conjecture to have. Children expect the clouds to part and the stars to align and say things like that's not fair or it's not my fault when that doesn't happen. Adults understand that things seldom go as planned however regardless you will still be judged on the outcome. Belichick lost his starting QB in week 2 of his second season and inserted a 2nd year QB from who was taken in the 6th round into the lineup and he won a Super Bowl, in 2008 he inserted a 7th round QB into the lineup after losing his starter in week one and that team went 11-5, look at all this team has overcome this season to date. How can you be a fan of Belichick all these years who never uses excuses always overcomes the odds and sit here and spew so many excuses nonsense for everyone else? It's mind boggling to me.

 

[Brady6]

I get that people have issues with his play calling, etc. But who better to take over from BB than the one that will have spent a decade (give or take a year or two) under his tutelage?

Steve Belichick
Matt Patricia
Bill O'Brien

All of them in my opinion would be a better choice.

I'm not a fan of OCs as HCs so I would favor the or Patricia but if it was McDaniels or O'Brien it would be O'Brien without hesitation in my opinion.

 

[Patsrock]

Steve Belichick
Matt Patricia
Bill O'Brien

All of them in my opinion would be a better choice.

I'm not a fan of OCs as HCs so I would favor the or Patricia but if it was McDaniels or O'Brien it would be O'Brien without hesitation in my opinion.

Before you put Steve Belichick on any list. How about him coach a position first. He is still 8-10 yrs away from being considered.

 

[Deus Irae]

You can pretend it is how ever you please, I am not expecting the poster I am having a debate with to endorse my point of view

But, if your point of view wasn't a ridiculous one, you'd have more reasoned people agreeing with you, rather than the members of the knee-jerk emotions crew.

You're trying to justify failure with the explanation of circumstance, that is such a childish conjecture to have.

I'm doing no such thing. What I'm doing is responding to someone who doesn't understand that "because Cutler and Marshall" isn't really a good argument, who thinks that a .500 record over 3 years after 3 years of double digit wins is somehow evidence of a team on the rise, and who thinks that having a 24 year old, second year, QB who's brand new to a system, banged up, and missing a bunch of games along with his best receivers, is somehow supposed to be a recipe for great success.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

Read for comprehension. Marshall's problem was that Cutler was traded. The decision to trade Cutler was made by Bowlen, after Cutler refused to return his calls. Cutler was also caught lying about this, since his own agent undercut his claim. We've got all this stuff in past threads.

All we're really doing here is re-hashing them with Brady6 taking Maverick's place.

Take your own advice.

Marshall's problems were also contractual and directly involved JMD.

"Marshall then reviews the circumstances that went from Marshall saying that owner Pat Bowlen had promised to trade the player, that McDaniels reneged, that McDaniels offered Marshall an incentive-based contract with unrealistic factors like rushing touchdowns, that McDaniels threatened to take action against Marshall for conduct detrimental to the team, and that Marshall decided that if he’s going to be accused of conduct detrimental, he’s going to engaged in detrimental conduct."

Marshall says McDaniels hug was ?for show? | ProFootballTalk

Enjoy waging internet war for the next 15 hours or so, I've had my fill.

 

[fumbrunner]

Steve Belichick
Matt Patricia
Bill O'Brien

All of them in my opinion would be a better choice.

I'm not a fan of OCs as HCs so I would favor the or Patricia but if it was McDaniels or O'Brien it would be O'Brien without hesitation in my opinion.

I hope you are joking here. In what world is a second year coaching assistant suitable to be the head coach of the Patriots?? Over one of the most well respected offensive minds in the league?

If that isnt a joke, then you have officially jumped the shark.

 

[Deus Irae]

Take your own advice.

Marshall's problems were also contractual and directly involved JMD.

"Marshall then reviews the circumstances that went from Marshall saying that owner Pat Bowlen had promised to trade the player, that McDaniels reneged, that McDaniels offered Marshall an incentive-based contract with unrealistic factors like rushing touchdowns, that McDaniels threatened to take action against Marshall for conduct detrimental to the team, and that Marshall decided that if he’s going to be accused of conduct detrimental, he’s going to engaged in detrimental conduct."

Marshall says McDaniels hug was ?for show? | ProFootballTalk

Enjoy waging internet war for the next 15 hours or so, I've had my fill.

My advice is fine just aimed at you, thanks. Marshall's beef was about the medical staff and the Cutler trade. Neither of those is on McDaniels. Also, and get this, since it's in the very quote you are pointing to.....

Bowlen was the one who supposedly promised the trade, not McDaniels. McDaniels couldn't have reneged, because he didn't make the agreement, per that very quote. Again, it's an ownership issue.

 

[Brady6]

Before you put Steve Belichick on any list. How about him coach a position first. He is still 8-10 yrs away from being considered.

I don’t expect Bill to retire for at least another 5 and I imagine he could groom Steve in that time.

 

[Brady6]

I hope you are joking here. In what world is a second year coaching assistant suitable to be the head coach of the Patriots?? Over one of the most well respected offensive minds in the league?

If that isnt a joke, then you have officially jumped the shark.

It is not a joke in the sense that we’re talking about the future, I for one don’t expect Bill Belichick to retire until around 2020 and I believe he can groom his son in that time. If we’re are talking about 1-3 years from now of course not but if Bill sticks around 5+ years I think he can have the son ready to go.

 

[Brady6]

But, if your point of view wasn't a ridiculous one, you'd have more reasoned people agreeing with you, rather than the members of the knee-jerk emotions crew.

OK I don’t think McDaniels should be the next head coach of the Patriots. Since you’re disagreeing that means you think he should be, correct?

I'm doing no such thing. What I'm doing is responding to someone who doesn't understand that "because Cutler and Marshall" isn't really a good argument, who thinks that a .500 record over 3 years after 3 years of double digit wins is somehow evidence of a team on the rise, and who thinks that having a 24 year old, second year, QB who's brand new to a system, banged up, and missing a bunch of games along with his best receivers, is somehow supposed to be a recipe for great success.

I don’t really care about the Cutler or Marshall situation, whether it was his inability to work things out with them or his inability to recoup enough value for them or some other reason (aka excuse) he still failed he still went 12-20 and lost 20 of his last 26 in Denver.

Good coaches make things better in time not worse no matter how bad the situation is when they arrive the goal is to make things better, Josh made things worse or at least that’s what his record indicated. Fox took a similar roster and as the 2011 season progressed he made it better and the team improved.

Lets discuss this reasonably enough of the unnecessary comments lets have a real discussion and try and figure what is actually what, so this is my question for you - tell me something what has Josh done since coming back here to make things better than they were when he arrived? As of today what is better on this team because of Josh McDaniels returning? Bill O’Brien he took an offense going one direction and rebuilt it before he left, the offense was better in 2011 when he departed then it was in 2009 when he took over. So that’s what I am looking for something tangible that you can point to and say Josh McDaniels did that.

 

[Wheelman]

It is not a joke in the sense that we’re talking about the future, I for one don’t expect Bill Belichick to retire until around 2020 and I believe he can groom his son in that time. If we’re are talking about 1-3 years from now of course not but if Bill sticks around 5+ years I think he can have the son ready to go.

You are really jumping the gun here. Just because he's the son of Bill Belichick does not mean he's going to be as good as his father.

 

[Brady6]

You are really jumping the gun here. Just because he's the son of Bill Belichick does not mean he's going to be as good as his father.

I don't think anyone is going to be as good as his father. The question is could he a better option than McDaniels.

McDaniels to me is the coach version of Peyton Manning. He does things that are gaudy in the regular season and when he has all the right pieces all as close to perfect as possible but in the face of adversity or when it really counts he fails to perform.

 

[fumbrunner]

I don't think anyone is going to be as good as his father. The question is could he a better option than McDaniels.

So, you have seen enough of Steven Belichick to say he would be a better option than McDaniels, correct? Just want to make sure I'm not misrepresenting your views.

I hope he is more BB than some of these other characters follwing in their fathers' footsteps.

http://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/comment/articles/2012-09/17/famous-fathers-idiot-sons