Who took the bigger risk (for the Patriots)?

[signbabybrady]

Bill wouldn’t give Brady the same 2 year deal Brees got. He wanted to go year to year. A completely ****ty way to handle the best player in team and league history.

How'd that work out for New Orleans?

 

[signbabybrady]

Yup. People act like Kraft randomly just skipped in the door and took the franchise tag off the table for no reason.

Regardless of how or why prior to taking it off the table Bill had leverage. After he never even got another chance to try before Brady decided to go.

 

[signbabybrady]

Let's list the decisions of the rebuild that contributed to his getting canned:

1. Patricia/Judge. Trusting that his yes men could develop a first round pick into something beyond a basket case was a mistake.
2. Brady. Bill believed Brady was done, told RKK as such, and then Brady went off and did what he did.
3. ****ty drafts. I think he changed in 2013, post AH, but you can look at his lack of success in the draft as the #1 reason the team couldn't reload quickly.

Those are enough, combined with a 29-38 and an inability to evolve, be it from age, ego, stubbornness or ay combination therein. 70 year old coaches don't get a long leash. Bill didn't surround himself with a network of great coaches to assist him, he kept a small group of confidants designed to carry the message instead of challenge him to be a better coach.

I truthfully believe it was time.

Plenty of other coaches get a chance to switch Coordinator's before they get canned why didn't Bill get the same benefits.

There are a lot of circumstances that surround the bad drafts but it didn't stop Bill from winning SBs during the stretch. That should have been enough to not get canned so quickly.

 

[signbabybrady]

And replacing the best head coach of all time was always going to be a daunting task just like replacing the greatest QB of all time. Changing head coaches is almost always a crap shoot. World class coordinators turn out to be crappy head coaches frequently. Waiting another year or two to move on from Belichick wasn't going to change that. All it would do is delay the rebuild process.

That's just another reason we should have let Bill exhaust every possiblity before we entered the rinse and repeat cycle.

 

[signbabybrady]

He lost me for good right here. I would have fired him after that season.

I didn't want to believe it was a franchise altering blunder and pretended that it wasn't until I couldn't anymore.

Yep.

You didn't like him long before Patricia

 

[sb1]

Reminder that Bill has a .426 W-L record over 4 seasons as a head coach in the post Tom Brady era. That's not really a case to stick with the status quo.

 

[signbabybrady]

How he handled the Mac Jones and Bailey Zappe is one of his worst mistakes. Forget if either guy were any good. He manufactured a QB controversy in 2022. He should have backed Mac coming back from injury. Whether or not he was confident with him or not. He need to show confidence in the guy in public he is starting.

And in 2023, he kept starting and pulling Mac in games seemingly out of spite. You can get away with pulling a QB once in a season and then starting him the next game. When you do it in four or five games, it is destroys confidence in your QBs and divides the locker room between QBs.

Mac went south real quick BB determined he wasn't the guy but collaboration had already seeped in.

 

[signbabybrady]

That was ridiculous. There didn't have to be a QB controversy but Bill went out of his way to make it one after the Bears MNF game.

Not surprised you'd side with Mac over BB. Par for the course with you.

 

[signbabybrady]

Reminder that Bill has a .426 W-L record over 4 seasons as a head coach in the post Tom Brady era. That's not really a case to stick with the status quo.

.235 post Bill sometimes you get what you ask for.

 

[Ring 6]

Even if true, that is an enormous contribution.

Given Bill's unpopular, really toxic reputation going in, and then the list of public relations and team chemistry decisions he made that launched the criticism even higher each time than it was previously.

So many owners stand pat. They're afraid to make moves. Robert is a bit of an emotional loose cannon, but it appears today, especially with the organization's silly trumpeting of the ownership, his actual role in the dynasty is underrated.

Huh? Belichick didn’t have a reputation like that going in. He had a reputation in dealing with the media, which has nothing to do with decision making in running football operations.

His role has been to hire, sit back, then beg for credit for the success.
His role was hiring Belichick. If he had a larger role, there would have been less success.

 

[Rob0729]

That's just another reason we should have let Bill exhaust every possiblity before we entered the rinse and repeat cycle.

They did. Any other head coach would have been fired after the 2022 season. Putting Matt Patricia in charge of the offense was a fire-able offense for any head coach other Belichick. Literally any other head coach would have been fired for that.

And any other head coach would have been fired how he managed the starting QB in 2023 where he kept starting and pulling Mac over and over again. So he had successive years where he did things that would have gotten any other head coach fired.

How many Rich Kotite type of season destroying moves did Kraft have to put up with before he moved on from Belichick? Did we need to let him trade out of the third pick in 2024 and draft an OG in the first round that people had rated as a third round pick and draft Spencer Rattler in the second round to be the Patriots' starting QB?

 

[Steve102]

Plenty of other coaches get a chance to switch Coordinator's before they get canned why didn't Bill get the same benefits.

There are a lot of circumstances that surround the bad drafts but it didn't stop Bill from winning SBs during the stretch. That should have been enough to not get canned so quickly.

You're going to take arguably the greatest coach of all time, one who's certainly at the table among the other greats of all sports, right there with John Wooden, Vince Lombardi, Red Auerbach, Mike Krzyzewski, Bear Bryant... and make him a coordinator?


You don't really believe that, do you? You're just married to your position or being pedantic? Bored and need a summer debate?

 

[lancerman]

.235 post Bill sometimes you get what you ask for.

1 season. Same record as the 1 season before with Belichick. You should be asking why BB and Mayo had the same record

 

[lancerman]

You're going to take arguably the greatest coach of all time, one who's certainly at the table among the other greats of all sports, right there with John Wooden, Vince Lombardi, Red Auerbach, Mike Krzyzewski, Bear Bryant... and make him a coordinator?


You don't really believe that, do you? You're just married to your position or being pedantic? Bored and need a summer debate?

Especially when Kraft straight up said the reason he didn’t think he could keep BB was because he no longer believed in one person having unilateral power and that he never could have wrangled enough from Belichick to make keeping him feasible.

 

[signbabybrady]

They did. Any other head coach would have been fired after the 2022 season. Putting Matt Patricia in charge of the offense was a fire-able offense for any head coach other Belichick. Literally any other head coach would have been fired for that.

And any other head coach would have been fired how he managed the starting QB in 2023 where he kept starting and pulling Mac over and over again. So he had successive years where he did things that would have gotten any other head coach fired.

How many Rich Kotite type of season destroying moves did Kraft have to put up with before he moved on from Belichick? Did we need to let him trade out of the third pick in 2024 and draft an OG in the first round that people had rated as a third round pick and draft Spencer Rattler in the second round to be the Patriots' starting QB?

He's not any other head coach he deserved way more.

 

[signbabybrady]

You're going to take arguably the greatest coach of all time, one who's certainly at the table among the other greats of all sports, right there with John Wooden, Vince Lombardi, Red Auerbach, Mike Krzyzewski, Bear Bryant... and make him a coordinator?


You don't really believe that, do you? You're just married to your position or being pedantic? Bored and need a summer debate?

No I'm saying after Josh left its fair to think he might need to try one or 2 guys. How many OCs has Reid or Tomlin had?

 

[signbabybrady]

1 season. Same record as the 1 season before with Belichick. You should be asking why BB and Mayo had the same record

Bill had to stick with the QB and get him another OC before giving up on a first rounder. But if the problem was Bill like you suggest why didn't removing the problem fix anything?

 

[lancerman]

Bill had to stick with the QB and get him another OC before giving up on a first rounder. But if the problem was Bill like you suggest why didn't removing the problem fix anything?

Bill had to stick with the QB he picked after he created a situation that lost him the GOAT QB.

Removing him didn't fix the problem because Mayo was a disaster and couldn't create improvement on Bill's awful finish.

 

[signbabybrady]

Especially when Kraft straight up said the reason he didn’t think he could keep BB was because he no longer believed in one person having unilateral power and that he never could have wrangled enough from Belichick to make keeping him feasible.

Kraft never should have started medelling with that absolute power. Krafts jealousy of Brady getting number 7 really screwed up Krafts logical managing.

 

[sb1]

1 season. Same record as the 1 season before with Belichick. You should be asking why BB and Mayo had the same record

For a sense of what BB being .426 post Brady looks like in terms of other NFL coaches.

Yep he'd sure have a list of legendary coaches around him as company. Yikes.