What went wrong: one cold hard fact

[Patspsycho]

You're confusing cause and effect, son.

I've already explained why it's not cause and effect. We haven't been blown out in any of our losses except for Cleveland. Losing by an average of 8 points is scarcely cause for abandoning the run game.

I'd like to blow up the myth that abandoning the run game will always happen when we get behind, with this simple argument:

If the other team's offense is scoring more points than we are (perhaps due to our suspect defense) then there is no better way to shut them down than to keep them off the field. How do you keep them off the field? You put together sustained, grinding drive that eats the clock up, not two minute pass-pass-pass offense that just gives the ball right back.

 

[Patspsycho]

The only cold hard fact I got out of the OP was that he stopped watching the game after the second quarter.

Oh, was the 2nd half any different?

 

[condon84]

Oh, was the 2nd half any different?

No, not really. But as Chris pointed out in his retorts, we did run when we had the chance but eventually, the circumstance of the game dictated the plays that we ran. I don't think it was an overall, "let's not run the ball" gameplan.

As far as your myths and facts, those are your opinions, not facts. Someone could make the counterargument using statistical evidence where we are close to or dead last in the league in defense.

 

[Ring 6]

I've already explained why it's not cause and effect. We haven't been blown out in any of our losses except for Cleveland. Losing by an average of 8 points is scarcely cause for abandoning the run game.

I'd like to blow up the myth that abandoning the run game will always happen when we get behind, with this simple argument:

If the other team's offense is scoring more points than we are (perhaps due to our suspect defense) then there is no better way to shut them down than to keep them off the field. How do you keep them off the field? You put together sustained, grinding drive that eats the clock up, not two minute pass-pass-pass offense that just gives the ball right back.

That makes no sense. Reducing the number of possessions each team has accomplishes nothing.
Scoring is what matters, and if you are behind scoring quickly matters as well.
Taking time off the clock so the other offense isnt on the field also makes it longer before our offense can get back on the field and score again.

 

[Ring 6]

Oh, was the 2nd half any different?

Yes. Actually we fought back to scoring to get within 6 points with over 4 minutes left but a bad call turned that into 2 minutes left, so when we got the ball back with a chance to win there was only 19 seconds to go.
Had the call been made properly, we would have had the ball in decent field position with over 2 minutes left down 6. Wouldn't you have been mad you gave up on the team then?

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I like this premise, Psycho. And I agree with it for the most part. But, at the same time, the passing game certainly could have helped setup the running game.

This might be unpopular, but I think the idea that the offense (outside of Brady) gets shut down- for example, by the Jets or Steelers) is somewhat of a myth. Brady sometimes is too cautious and gunshy. Guys weren't open last year against Pittsburgh, but he threw to them anyway because of their matchups. Gronkowski's touchdowns last year were mostly great passes that only Gronk could get to, but he wasn't wide open on them. It seems like when the offense struggles, Brady is slow to read defenses and hesitant to pull the trigger, looking too often for the safe play. In the long run, the results are excellent because it reduces turnovers, but in a game where the defense struggles, it can also be detrimental.

I saw several plays yesterday where Brady threw to his first read, which was not a good matchup, while his second and third reads were wide open. Example: the first series of the game going to Branch on the quick slant, double coverage, while both Hernandez and Welker were beating their guys easily.

Back to the running game, though, I think the point is well made that we need to run the ball. Particularly when things aren't working, and you have a wild card like Ridley sitting on the bench, why not try him out? His quickness seems to make him ideal to run against that defensive line. I completely agree about Faulk, what the heck was he doing in there? It isn't 2005 anymore, and while I respect Faulk tremendously, this did not seem like a good time to play the seniority game on the depth chart.

 

[JFK]

You can always look at it both ways, since getting Moss we haven't won just off running. The other way to look at it is that we run so much in wins because we set up the pass first, dominate or at least do a great job, and it makes it easier for our RB by committee to get a lot of carries.

If we run the ball 30 times yesterday or in a lot of our losses we still lose, Benjarvus is not going to carry this team, he feeds off Brady, and so does the defense in regards to turnovers.

Time of possession and catching up without time.
Compare the steelers run vs pass despite the fact they ran the ball to kill time

 

[PatsChamp88]

This was the first half. The 2-minute drive I'm referring to is the end of the 1st half. I'll edit my post to make that clear.

Regards,
Chris

Thanks for your posts in this thread, sometimes people struggle to read

 

[Patspsycho]

That makes no sense. Reducing the number of possessions each team has accomplishes nothing.
Scoring is what matters, and if you are behind scoring quickly matters as well.
Taking time off the clock so the other offense isnt on the field also makes it longer before our offense can get back on the field and score again.

Huh? This was exactly the strategy the Steelers used to keep us off the field in the first half and it was pretty successful. Our TOP for the first half was slightly over one minute, IIRC.

 

[Patspsycho]

Yes. Actually we fought back to scoring to get within 6 points with over 4 minutes left but a bad call turned that into 2 minutes left, so when we got the ball back with a chance to win there was only 19 seconds to go.
Had the call been made properly, we would have had the ball in decent field position with over 2 minutes left down 6. Wouldn't you have been mad you gave up on the team then?

No. You may not disagree with stats, but for me, they are useful sometimes (otherwise why would BB even have Ernie Adams on his staff??) and one thing has been very consistent: when our run attempts are not near or equal to our pass attempts, we lose the game, period.

So I knew we were going to lose midway through the 2nd quarter. Why would I want to hang around?

 

[Patspsycho]

No, not really. But as Chris pointed out in his retorts, we did run when we had the chance but eventually, the circumstance of the game dictated the plays that we ran. I don't think it was an overall, "let's not run the ball" gameplan.

As far as your myths and facts, those are your opinions, not facts. Someone could make the counterargument using statistical evidence where we are close to or dead last in the league in defense.

Yes it was an overall "let's not run" gameplan, because Faulk was the starting back.

 

[Joker]

I watched the entire sordid mess...and rewatched it on DVR.

Vollmer got abused the entire game.BJGE had zero production(turf toe?). That backup LB that replaced Harrison possesses very good speed and made Welker's life difficult.

There was a Pitt fan posting here last week that broke down what Pitt would do, using the previous games this season as an example. He said the Steelers would probably keep Miller in to block because of OL injuries.Miller caught six of the first ten throws from Roth. He said Roth would test the Pats corners deep all game...they did the exact opposite. He said Pitt would play their normal soft zone...they played aggressive man.

Face facts...the Pats and BB got snookered...by better preparation and a better game plan...and one they seemed not to have even anticipated...result??...an ugly loss....this happens to all teams across the NFL spectrum at some point during the season...Pats fans are just not used to it as are most other fan bases.