PATRIOTS TRAINING CAMP Training Camp Day 4 - July 26

[One-If-By-Sea]

I think of it more of a starting point. For Boutte I think he's safe until Kyle Williams passes him which could happen at any point during camp or maybe Williams needs a little longer. If Williams doesn't pass him then Boutte probably is safe but once he gets pushed down a little it could go fast for him as STs (Hollins) and future considerations (Chism) could come into play more at that point.

Ultimately it looks like he's ahead of some of the other guys and if just puts his head down and plays well he'll probably be here wether WR3, 4, or 5.

The wild cards will come from Polk or Baker. Hopefully they make the decision as difficult as possible and if they do it will be a really interesting problem to manage (can't keep them all).

Great post. Not a legacy of great WRs, so let's hope Williams displaces Boutte soon which would indicate that Williams is progressing well. Williams, Diggs, and Douglas are a good trio, with Hollins as a mismatch (tall and strong) guy.

Chism got a peek with the 1s, so he might make it. Injuries always play a role too. The new staff seems to be methodical in their evaluations so that is good.

 

[Ring 6]

That's a fair point. If we're only looking at what we know, can we also conclude that in Sow's 2 seasons the lineman playing with him were subpar to say the least? That the coaching, especially last year was incompetent? Oline really operates as a unit. a good unit can lift guys up, a bad one can drag them down.

He was one of the subpar players. A bad player surrounded by other bad players isn’t somehow better because of that.
He gets evaluated by his play, but the units, you don’t miss blocks because another guy missed one too.

 

[reflexblue]

My dad worked at the old Sears Distribution Center, where the South Bay shopping plaza is now, and which was right next to the old Howard Johnson's restaurant AND hotel off the Southeast Expressway. Good times, good times... The last HoJos I recall seeing was in Lancaster PA, a couple of miles from our kids' Irish dance studio; but sadly that was torn-down in 2018...

In the sixties my family would go to the north shore every summer ..ipswich, rockport etc we would always stop at hojos on the mass pike. I always ordered french fries and a hot dog. Now i wonder what was in those hot dogs

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

He was one of the subpar players. A bad player surrounded by other bad players isn’t somehow better because of that.
He gets evaluated by his play, but the units, you don’t miss blocks because another guy missed one too.

So if he played on the Eagles line you think he would look equally as bad? I don't believe that for a second.

 

[Ring 6]

So if he played on the Eagles line you think he would look equally as bad? I don't believe that for a second.

The overall line would look better, but no, he wouldn’t execute blocks better because of who the other 4 are.

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

The overall line would look better, but no, he wouldn’t execute blocks better because of who the other 4 are.

Not sure about that. How many missed blocks were on games and stunts? Did his partner make a mistake and leave him on an island? I'm not saying he is/isn't a good player, but it's really hard to make a fair assessment of anyone who played here the last 2 years. Lack of talent and coaching most certainly can impact an individual player. Maybe he looks better this year, maybe he doesn't. Maybe he makes team, maybe he doesn't. Time will tell.

 

[Ring 6]

Not sure about that. How many missed blocks were on games and stunts? Did his partner make a mistake and leave him on an island? I'm not saying he is/isn't a good player, but it's really hard to make a fair assessment of anyone who played here the last 2 years. Lack of talent and coaching most certainly can impact an individual player. Maybe he looks better this year, maybe he doesn't. Maybe he makes team, maybe he doesn't. Time will tell.

If it’s a teammates fault that isn’t his missed block. Thats part of evaluation.

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

If it’s a teammates fault that isn’t his missed block. Thats part of evaluation.

Who's evaluation? I've seen plenty of stats don't align with plays on the field. Again, I don't know what he can/can't be this year. If you want to think his last 2 years (amidst all the BS that went on here) are indicative of what he is that's your right. I will wait till we get some pads on and the physicality ramps up to see if he is salvageable or not.

 

[Ring 6]

Who's evaluation? I've seen plenty of stats don't align with plays on the field. Again, I don't know what he can/can't be this year. If you want to think his last 2 years (amidst all the BS that went on here) are indicative of what he is that's your right. I will wait till we get some pads on and the physicality ramps up to see if he is salvageable or not.

He has every opportunity to earn a job. But based upon his playing in the NFL to date, either his chances are slim or the players he’s competing against are terrible.
It’s not statistics, it’s his ability to make a block.
In this case it’s my own evaluation, plus the fact that last year while we had an awful OL and were plucking guys off waivers and practice squads to start, he never beat out any of the slugs we were putting on the field.

 

[captain stone]

In the sixties my family would go to the north shore every summer ..ipswich, rockport etc we would always stop at hojos on the mass pike. I always ordered french fries and a hot dog. Now i wonder what was in those hot dogs

We're all still here, so how bad could they have really been? Besides, when it comes to hot dogs, my policy is Don't Ask Don't Tell

 

[Grogan14]

We're all still here, so how bad could they have really been? Besides, when it comes to hot dogs, my policy is Don't Ask Don't Tell

Hojos had really good clam rolls!
One time in the newton turnpike hojos I ran into Johnny Most drinking coffee and smoking a cigarette. Nice guy. He was friendly and happy to talk about the celtics. He was by himself.
They don’t make play by play announcers like johnny most anymore

 

[reflexblue]

We're all still here, so how bad could they have really been? Besides, when it comes to hot dogs, my policy is Don't Ask Don't Tell

Memories
Light the corners of my mind
Misty watercolor memories
Of the way we was

 

[captain stone]

Hojos had really good clam rolls!
One time in the newton turnpike hojos I ran into Johnny Most drinking coffee and smoking a cigarette. Nice guy. He was friendly and happy to talk about the celtics. He was by himself.
They don’t make play by play announcers like johnny most anymore

Johnny Most wouldn't be able to get even a job as a PBP broadcaster these days; and we all would've been the worse for it.

 

[Wozzy]

Of course but Sow, for example, has a 2 year track record that is part of evaluating him. You can only evaluate from the information available. Any evaluation should change when new info comes to light, but players typically are who they are.

Sow started every game he was healthy as a rookie, earned a starting spot leaving camp, he played the third most snaps on the entire offense.

By season’s end he and Onwenu on the right side was a nightmare matchup for defenses trying to stop the run. Even third party analysts agreed that side of the line was playing well, unfortunately the other three line positions were still a mess.

He played well for a rookie, his coaches were Belichick and Bill O’Brien… those guys weren’t handing a 4th round rookie anything, he earned it. He has great size/athleticism. He like everyone else still has to prove it, but he’s young and has time.

Mike Vrabel didn’t make a single start his first four years of his career and he’s in the Patriot HOF. Sow is entering year three… too early for labels.

 

[Love The Drake]

Mike Vrabel didn’t make a single start his first four years of his career and he’s in the Patriot HOF. Sow is entering year three… too early for labels.

True, but Mike was behind all pros, borderline hall of famers and fan favorites in Jason Gildon Joey Porter and Clark Haggans to compete.

 

[Uptown]

 

[mgteich]

Sow sucks. He couldn’t beat out the slugs we put out there last year.

Ok, everyone sucked last year. Some will come back better with better health and better coaching.
============
Q1) Do you have all of the first OL making the roster (Campbell, Strange, Bradbury, Onwenu and Moses)? and Wilson makes six?
======
Q2) How many and who do you expect to make the 53 as backups?
2a) Wallace?
2b) Lowe?
2c) next?
2d) next?

 

[mgteich]

Great post. Not a legacy of great WRs, so let's hope Williams displaces Boutte soon which would indicate that Williams is progressing well. Williams, Diggs, and Douglas are a good trio, with Hollins as a mismatch (tall and strong) guy.

Chism got a peek with the 1s, so he might make it. Injuries always play a role too. The new staff seems to be methodical in their evaluations so that is good.

Hmm

How much of a consensus to we have that these are the most likely four to be active in most games (Diggs, Williams, Douglas and Hollins?

If all are healthy, and the answer is that we know the likely active WR's, who else is worth keeping, as another active WR and/or as a backup in case of injury?

WHICH OF THE REST ARE WORTH KEEPING ON THE 53
Chism?
Boutte?
Bourne?
Polk?
Baker?

 

[Ring 6]

Ok, everyone sucked last year. Some will come back better with better health and better coaching.
============
Q1) Do you have all of the first OL making the roster (Campbell, Strange, Bradbury, Onwenu and Moses)? and Wilson makes six?
======
Q2) How many and who do you expect to make the 53 as backups?
2a) Wallace?
2b) Lowe?
2c) next?
2d) next?

Well we were the worst OL in the NFL last year.
Onwenu didn’t suck but he wasn’t much better than average. Strange was decent in the 2 games he played.
Other than that who do you think didn’t suck?
I don’t think, other than Strange, any of it was health.

Yes, I expect that all of our starting OL will in fact make the roster.
Wilson is a lock
Wallace is a lock
Lowe is pretty likely

The 9th is up for grabs with no clear favorites. That’s probably a reason Wallace is seeing time at G because his versatility gives us more flexibility in the 9th spot

We will probably look to other teams cuts for most of the practice OL

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Hmm

How much of a consensus to we have that these are the most likely four to be active in most games (Diggs, Williams, Douglas and Hollins?

If all are healthy, and the answer is that we know the likely active WR's, who else is worth keeping, as another active WR and/or as a backup in case of injury?

WHICH OF THE REST ARE WORTH KEEPING ON THE 53
Chism?
Boutte?
Bourne?
Polk?
Baker?

Looks to me that the Pats save $6M if they release Bourne. Boutte and Chism (barely) have practiced with the 1s. We paid Bourne a large signing bonus and he was injured, so I am not sure he has earned much. If we released the long snapper to save $1M, I doubt Bourne is safe.