The more time that goes on, the more I have trouble rooting for Kraft

[Jackson 2]

Unless this is going to get our picks back, it has no place in this thread.

Mother of God...

 

[OhExaulted1]

Unless this is going to get our picks back, it has no place in this thread.

The thread's titled:
The more time that goes on, the more I have trouble rooting for Kraft

...so I posted a pic of him charitably donating his time to Make-A-Wish kids.

You can step away from the pulpit now, "Reverend".

 

[ReverendMaynard]

The thread's titled:
The more time that goes on, the more I have trouble rooting for Kraft

...so I posted a pic of him charitably donating his time to Make-A-Wish kids.

You can step away from the pulpit now, "Reverend".

Right. And the context of the thread makes it clear that it has nothing to do with his charitable endeavors. But, like the rest of your ilk, you'll just keep on ignoring what has been said over 600+ replies and keep spouting non sequiturs that don't even approach a point actually being made by those you disagree with.

 

[Ring 6]

Why won't the Kraft haters / detractors, etc just accept the words of a guy who was duped and admitted it. Go back and read what he said again:

Robert Kraft Apologizes To Patriots Fans, Calls NFL's Actions 'Incomprehensible'

Just let it go already, even if Goodell wanted to actually do the right thing (admit they were wrong, there was no evidence, nothing out of the ordinary happened and there is such a thing as the Ideal gas law), the a/hole owners that pulled off this scam and ultimate heist would still not allow it to happen.

For whatever reason, be it spy gate make up call, refusal to believe a team can be as good for as long at the Pats have in the salary cap era, whatever it is.......they will not do the right thing. They are aholes, period and don't ever forget it.

For me, I accept Krafts apology. I know he kept this team in the area and my experience, having followed this team since the very first game and the NFL my entire life is that the guy is a true fan and a tremendous owner.

That's good enough for me.

There are 2 sides in this argument. But they are not "Kraft detractors/haters" and "Kraft supporters". They are those that think Kraft screwed up, and those that are defending his actions saying he should not have done anything further.

Your argument supports those that say he screwed up, since, as you say, he admits it himself.

 

[Ring 6]

Lost, it seems, in all of this is that by suing the NFL itself Kraft would be putting his ownership in jeopardy over essentially the 29th pick in the NFL draft and alienating the very owners who could be forced to vote to decide the franchises fate.

Talk about a poison pill.

First the discussion is about failing to appeal, not your strawman about lawsuits, and second if you seriously think the other owners would try to take away his franchise over this, you are nuts, and if you think they could succeed you are delusional.

 

[Ivan]

The smear campaign of unsubstantiated rumors and innuendo leaking out of Park Ave. would still be in full swing with a scandal hungry media ready to feed the ignorant public masses all the water cooler gossip they can gobble up.

It never stopped. When asked, about testing balls this season Goodell claimed there were "no violators" this season, and the attack on Brady has never stopped. Bob Kraft continues to give Goodell a pass when he should be giving it right back to him, or at least allow Jonathan to do it for them.

 

[Ring 6]

Why do you claim I hate Kraft every post. I disagree with his actions. You seem completely incapable of separating disagreeing with hate. Very simplistic way of looking at things. Or maybe it's just that you can't make a viable argument otherwise.

He is a one trick pony, that's all he's got. If he can't make an argument to refute what you say, he attacks your opinion as tainted because clearly you can't be objective because you hate Kraft.
Tried that one with me to, entirely unsuccessfully.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

The thread's titled:
The more time that goes on, the more I have trouble rooting for Kraft

...so I posted a pic of him charitably donating his time to Make-A-Wish kids.

You can step away from the pulpit now, "Reverend".

I clearly should have titled the thread:

Nine Months Later: Have you forgiven Robert Kraft?

There seems to be a lot of discussion over whether or not his actions are worthy of criticism, even though Kraft himself acknowledges they are. I don't see why he would say that if he truly believed that he did everything he could reasonably do to ensure his fans enjoy the best experience following his team.

My post should have clarified that this is about the singular event of his Deflategate knee buckling and nothing else. Of course, I'm sure that most people, including myself, do not hate Kraft and don't believe he is a crummy owner and aren't grateful for many of the things he has done. He has been a leader of one of the most successful franchises in sports while signing guys who are easy to root for, has done wonders in the community, and kept the franchise here. This thread isn't about bashing the sh*t out of Kraft; it's about re-focusing on his actions during what was, to me, subjectively, one of the most gutless and cowardly acts I can imagine.

That's cool if people want to point out all the great things Kraft has done, but I can assure you that I have appreciated his ownership over the years as much as most. However, this doesn't have anything to do with ownership; it has to do with a man being in a position to fight for what's right and folding like a $50 suit.

Maybe I will come around to it and just forgive Kraft eventually. I am an open minded person. But right now, that notion seems quite difficult. I thought that after the smoke had cleared, I'd be able to see Kraft's viewpoint a little better, but time and perspective make this all look worse.

But let's be clear about one thing: Kraft is a powerful man who is likely in a better position now than he was nine months ago to go on the attack against the league. The tide has turned on Deflategate with national writers almost all in unison that the Patriots are getting screwed. Why is he still silent? If he really is sorry, there are thing he could be doing, there are things he could be saying. Maybe he's working behind the scenes, I don't know. But since he folded, the NFL has continued to do so many below-the-belt tactics to Brady and the Patriots, most recently with the abandoned promise to give data on air pressure. Where is Kraft? It's not too late to join the Force.

 

[IllegalContact]

There are 2 sides in this argument. But they are not "Kraft detractors/haters" and "Kraft supporters". They are those that think Kraft screwed up, and those that are defending his actions saying he should not have done anything further.

Your argument supports those that say he screwed up, since, as you say, he admits it himself.

no dopey........once his appeal window past, he could not do anything further and would be laughed out of a courtroom....and that was last april/may......

 

[OhExaulted1]

Because the league has continued to go after Brady and continues to lie about the Patriots and smear them and Kraft continues to play along with them and give Goodell a pass on it.

So you believe Kraft could have done something to stop Goodell from continuing to go after Brady and made sure the smear campaign orchestrated from 345 Park Ave. stopped.

He's an owner, not a wizard.

 

[OhExaulted1]

Right. And the context of the thread makes it clear that it has nothing to do with his charitable endeavors. But, like the rest of your ilk, you'll just keep on ignoring what has been said over 600+ replies and keep spouting non sequiturs that don't even approach a point actually being made by those you disagree with.

The actual point is what? You wanted Kraft to yell and scream and stamp his feet louder to make his detractors feel better?

The picks were taken and I don't think any logical, rational human being could find a shred of evidence that Goodell was going change his mind on the punishment appeal. The Saints appealed after the players punishments were nullified by Tags. Guess what happened? Denied.

600+ posts and no one here has shown me a anything to believe Roger was going to reduce or return the picks. All the posturing and bemoaning Krafts actions doesn't change the facts

Roger took the picks away and has no intention of giving them back. Dress it up in whatever manner makes you feel better.

 

[OhExaulted1]

First the discussion is about failing to appeal, not your strawman about lawsuits, and second if you seriously think the other owners would try to take away his franchise over this, you are nuts, and if you think they could succeed you are delusional.

Strawman nothing. He signed a clause as an owner stating he would not sue the league as part of the collective ownership group.

Your strawman argument is he should have done something he couldn't. You wanted him to file a lawsuit in direct contradiction to a contract he signed stating he wouldn't. As far as the appeal goes, you're delusional if you think it would have gone past the Goodell decision.

If Brady's case is quickly decided in his favor I'm hoping Kraft can find a legal way to fight back.

As Ice has made clear and I'm in the hopefull category theres still 2 months until the draft. The story isn't over yet.

 

[IllegalContact]

The actual point is what? You wanted Kraft to yell and scream and stamp his feet louder to make his detractors feel better?

The picks were taken and I don't think any logical, rational human being could find a shred of evidence that Goodell was going change his mind on the punishment appeal. The Saints appealed after the players punishments were nullified by Tags. Guess what happened? Denied.

600+ posts and no one here has shown me a anything to believe Roger was going to reduce or return the picks. All the posturing and bemoaning Krafts actions doesn't change the facts

Roger took the picks away and has no intention of giving them back. Dress it up in whatever manner makes you feel better.

 

[OhExaulted1]

I clearly should have titled the thread:

Nine Months Later: Have you forgiven Robert Kraft?

There seems to be a lot of discussion over whether or not his actions are worthy of criticism, even though Kraft himself acknowledges they are. I don't see why he would say that if he truly believed that he did everything he could reasonably do to ensure his fans enjoy the best experience following his team.

He deserves some criticism. He was naive and got duped.

My post should have clarified that this is about the singular event of his Deflategate knee buckling and nothing else. Of course, I'm sure that most people, including myself, do not hate Kraft and don't believe he is a crummy owner and aren't grateful for many of the things he has done. He has been a leader of one of the most successful franchises in sports while signing guys who are easy to root for, has done wonders in the community, and kept the franchise here. This thread isn't about bashing the sh*t out of Kraft; it's about re-focusing on his actions during what was, to me, subjectively, one of the most gutless and cowardly acts I can imagine.

That's cool if people want to point out all the great things Kraft has done, but I can assure you that I have appreciated his ownership over the years as much as most. However, this doesn't have anything to do with ownership; it has to do with a man being in a position to fight for what's right and folding like a $50 suit.

Unfortunately, much of the rhtoric has most certainly centered around bashing the sh*t out of Kraft. "Bend over Bob" told Orthwein to go screw I'm not selling and while your at it sell me the team because I'm not budging. That was one of the most stand up moments in this franchises history. If people want to make Framegate the overall barometer describing Krafts ownership then they should expect other posters to remind them of all the other things he's done. Lack of perspective shouldn't be an excuse to spout eternal vitriol post after post, as some here have done.

Maybe I will come around to it and just forgive Kraft eventually. I am an open minded person. But right now, that notion seems quite difficult. I thought that after the smoke had cleared, I'd be able to see Kraft's viewpoint a little better, but time and perspective make this all look worse.

He's already asked for the fans forgiveness.

But let's be clear about one thing: Kraft is a powerful man who is likely in a better position now than he was nine months ago to go on the attack against the league. The tide has turned on Deflategate with national writers almost all in unison that the Patriots are getting screwed. Why is he still silent? If he really is sorry, there are thing he could be doing, there are things he could be saying. Maybe he's working behind the scenes, I don't know. But since he folded, the NFL has continued to do so many below-the-belt tactics to Brady and the Patriots, most recently with the abandoned promise to give data on air pressure. Where is Kraft? It's not too late to join the Force.

Now this is a sentiment I can get on board with. April 28th is more than 2 months away. Goodell's appeal hearing is next week (I crack a smile knowing I can state it that way knowing Roger is finally having to play defense).

 

[ReverendMaynard]

The actual point is what? You wanted Kraft to yell and scream and stamp his feet louder to make his detractors feel better?

The picks were taken and I don't think any logical, rational human being could find a shred of evidence that Goodell was going change his mind on the punishment appeal. The Saints appealed after the players punishments were nullified by Tags. Guess what happened? Denied.

600+ posts and no one here has shown me a anything to believe Roger was going to reduce or return the picks. All the posturing and bemoaning Krafts actions doesn't change the facts

Roger took the picks away and has no intention of giving them back. Dress it up in whatever manner makes you feel better.

If you don't get it after 600+ replies, you never will.

 

[Ivan]

So you believe Kraft could have done something to stop Goodell from continuing to go after Brady and made sure the smear campaign orchestrated from 345 Park Ave. stopped.

He's an owner, not a wizard.

I have never said Kraft could have changed the sanctions I have said he should have fought back, and given his apology for rolling over its pretty clear he agrees.

I think Kraft's repeated capitulations set a really dangerous precedent. It's very clear the league is out to get the Patriots but their real target is Belichick, and if Goodell decides there was a sock violation and it was Belichick's fault he's going to try and ban him long term. We will see if people change their minds about fighting back the next time they try to f.ck them?

As fans most of us back our teams through thick and thin and its not asking too much to expect the owners who are getting rich off of it to do the same.

 

[IllegalContact]

If you don't get it after 600+ replies, you never will.

but you get it????

 

[ReverendMaynard]

but you get it????

Yup.

 

[RobertWeathers]

but you get it????

Jabba The Slut

 

[Ring 6]

no dopey........once his appeal window past, he could not do anything further and would be laughed out of a courtroom....and that was last april/may......

And all along the discussion has been about how he blew it by not appealing.