The 2nd Patriots dynasty does not happen without Edelman. > NFL Hall of Fame.

[VectorPrime]

Yeah. And a PED suspension. He’s not getting in the hall.

No one involved in the NFL cares about that and rightly so.

 

[Zuma]

Welker > Edelman


So talk to me about Edelman getting into the HOF after Welker gets in. Until then, there's nothing to discuss.

I hate this but it’s true

 

[Patriot_fan989]

No one involved in the NFL cares about that and rightly so.

when they're used to come back from injury, yeah.

 

[sb1]

No one involved in the NFL cares about that and rightly so.

The voters do. I actually think that along with his “dirty” reputation are why Rodney Harrison hasn’t gotten in yet. Look at what PED reputations are doing at the baseball HoF voting.

Fringe HoF case and PED suspension to go with it won’t help JE.

 

[Deus Irae]

Do you think Welker gets in without the infamous drop? I think he does.

I'm not taking a shot at Welker rather the HOF committee.

I don't know, because there's a clear bias against that sort of receiver. My hope is that, now that we're seeing more of those sort of "slot" guys, and as the older voters age out, we'll see an evolution in thought on what's Hall-worthy.

Welker belongs in the NFL HOF. Edelman belongs in the Patriots' HOF.

 

[Deus Irae]

Yeah sorry, no. Welker had a better regular season career, but even without the drop, Welker is blown out of the water by Edelman's postseason accomplishments.

Welker's postseason stats:

13 games
116 targets
88 receptions
75.9% catch percentage
5 TDs


Edelman's postseason stats:
19 games
180 targets
118 receptions
65.6% catch percentage
5 TDs

• In the 2011 playoff run (Welker drop year), Welker had 19 receptions on 23 targets (83% catch rate). In that Super Bowl game, he had 7 catches on 8 targets.
• In comparison, in the 2017 playoff run (Edelman ground catch year), Edelman had 21 receptions on 36 targets (58%). In that Super Bowl game, he had 5 catches on 13 targets.

The notion that "Welker is blown out of the water by Edelman's postseason accomplishments." is not accurate.

 

[amfootball]

What a dumpster fire thread topic.

 

[Patriot_fan989]

thanks for sharing

 

[Hyped]

HIGHTOWER? Anyone?

- Busted his shoulder plowing through an OL-man to stop Lynch on 1st down near the goal line.
- Strip sacked Matt Ryan with us own 28-12....
- Superbowl 53:

And he was hurt for Superbowl 52.....

 

[RobertWeathers]

Welker's postseason stats:

13 games
116 targets
88 receptions
75.9% catch percentage
5 TDs


Edelman's postseason stats:
19 games
180 targets
118 receptions
65.6% catch percentage
5 TDs

• In the 2011 playoff run (Welker drop year), Welker had 19 receptions on 23 targets (83% catch rate). In that Super Bowl game, he had 7 catches on 8 targets.
• In comparison, in the 2017 playoff run (Edelman ground catch year), Edelman had 21 receptions on 36 targets (58%). In that Super Bowl game, he had 5 catches on 13 targets.

The notion that "Welker is blown out of the water by Edelman's postseason accomplishments." is not accurate.

Jesus.

JE and WW did not run 100% the same routes. JE was split out a lot more wide than WW was and was much closer to the line. That is the reason his catch % is higher.

...and what makes a player great is doing IT when IT matters which unfortunately was the #1 fault of WW as a player.

 

[Jim Beankie]

Yeah. And a PED suspension. He’s not getting in the hall.

You beat me to it. One of my faves, but as Snoop Dog said after reading the suspension letter in 100%, "Damn, you f-d up.” While the people in the NFL probably don't give a flying fudgecicle (as it's prob way over 50% in the Hall for usage), they're all about optics and err on the side of hate for everything Patriots. Passing a numbnut test (PED testing in the NFL) is going to be the bare minimum.

 

[Patriot_fan989]

...and what makes a player great is doing IT when IT matters which unfortunately was the #1 fault of WW as a player.

Was it really though, beyond that 1 drop? I don't really remember Welker having many faults at all actually.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

That’s one season.

We’re talking about the most dominant TE in NFL history here.

How did the rest of the seasons go with or without him? They most likely win in 2011 with a healthy Gronk. They most likely at least go to the Super Bowl in 2012. They had no shot against the Broncos in 2013 without him. They do not win against the Seahawks in 2014 without him.
They have no shot of beating the Broncos in 2015 without him. They get blown out by the Eagles in 2017 without him. He set up the game winner against the Rams in 2018.

The offense always ran through Gronk. Edelman was always the sidekick/complementary player. The importance of Gronk vs Edelman is disrespectful to even consider.

Had the Pats not drafted Gronk, I don’t even think Brady stays past 2014.

I am not diminishing Gronk's importance, effort or his individual accomplishments.

His entire career, Tom Brady made the best of what he had. And who he had to play with.

To dismiss Edelman as 'always the sidekick/complementary player' is besides disrespectful, ignorant of reality. It's like saying David Ortiz was just a DH and that's it.

Brady stayed here despite personnel and management decisions which would have driven away most super star players, who are committed to winning titles. Belichick has been brilliant, and he's made some miserable boo-boos. I think you're distracted by statistics.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

One SB victory equals “dynasty” huh?

It’s laughable If you think the Pats would’ve had the same success without Gronk ever being on the roster and Edelman was more important.

We're mixing apples and oranges. Each player must be evaluated on his own merit.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

What a dumpster fire thread topic.

But it's fun!!

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Taking everything into consideration, for those of us who lived through it, I can see the Bruins winning neither Stanley Cup in '70 & '72 without Derek Sanderson.

Further, I can also see the Celtics winning neither title in '81 & '84 without M.L. Carr.

Sinden and Auerbach respectively, did understand and appreciate their importance. Belichick, the same regarding Edelman.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Doesn’t matter what we think. He will not get the votes of the people who decide this because of his lack of pro bowls and a pretty short time as a starter 2013-2020 of which he missed all of 2017 and most of 2020.

Anti-Patriots bias is the major factor in any league issue including HOF voting. Gino. Houston.

Russ Francis is a better player than Dave Casper, period. His stats are similar (Pro Bowls are not a stat). Sorry, but put Francis with Brady or even Kenny Anderson and he's in first ballot.

IMO Welker is HOF worthy, period.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Was it really though, beyond that 1 drop? I don't really remember Welker having many faults at all actually.

Another one.

 

[TheRainMaker]

I am not diminishing Gronk's importance, effort or his individual accomplishments.

His entire career, Tom Brady made the best of what he had. And who he had to play with.

To dismiss Edelman as 'always the sidekick/complementary player' is besides disrespectful, ignorant of reality. It's like saying David Ortiz was just a DH and that's it.

Brady stayed here despite personnel and management decisions which would have driven away most super star players, who are committed to winning titles. Belichick has been brilliant, and he's made some miserable boo-boos. I think you're distracted by statistics.

We're mixing apples and oranges. Each player must be evaluated on his own merit.

I was responding to the original statement that the dynasty doesn’t happen without Edelman which I think Gronk was more important.

What I meant by complimentary/sidekick was that he can’t carry the team on his back the entire season as he’s not built for that. However, he’s been extremely clutch and shows up when needed.

But Gronk was the guy that dominated all season long giving the rest of the guys more room to operate.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Another one.

Nice find and about time someone recognizes that. I think they punted but I know they didn’t score the rest of the game.