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Slot Options without Edelman


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Jordan Matthews was the best slot receiver in football? Are you nuts? Doug Baldwin, Larry Fitzgerald, Julian Edelman, Jarvis Landry, Golden Tate, Mohamed Sanu, Keenan Allen, Randall Cobb? Even in his best year he was maybe on the fringe of the top-10. He put up big numbers in a Chip Kelly offense that was mostly devoid of talent but ran more plays than any other team in history. He's not very physically gifted, but he's physical and wins at the catch point. Still, there was a reason he was available later into free agency.

Britt's best years are well behind him, and his weird year with the Rams came when he was the only warm body available to catch passes. He's a journeyman now, and one whose production and yards per reception has steadily dropped since 2014. He'll be 30 in September, and he's got a reputation as a malcontent. Maybe he'll go back to his old self with a full offseason with Brady, but it's just as likely he's on the waiver wire come opening day.

Neither of these guys are even guaranteed to make the team, let alone play a major role. I'd love to see them do well but I'm not expecting anything.
 
Jordan Matthews was the best slot receiver in football? Are you nuts? Doug Baldwin, Larry Fitzgerald, Julian Edelman, Jarvis Landry, Golden Tate, Mohamed Sanu, Keenan Allen, Randall Cobb? Even in his best year he was maybe on the fringe of the top-10. He put up big numbers in a Chip Kelly offense that was mostly devoid of talent but ran more plays than any other team in history. He's not very physically gifted, but he's physical and wins at the catch point. Still, there was a reason he was available later into free agency.

Britt's best years are well behind him, and his weird year with the Rams came when he was the only warm body available to catch passes. He's a journeyman now, and one whose production and yards per reception has steadily dropped since 2014. He'll be 30 in September, and he's got a reputation as a malcontent. Maybe he'll go back to his old self with a full offseason with Brady, but it's just as likely he's on the waiver wire come opening day.

Neither of these guys are even guaranteed to make the team, let alone play a major role. I'd love to see them do well but I'm not expecting anything.

You can say whatever you want. Matthews was the most productive slot receiver from 13-16 and it was his first 3 years in the league. I dont care what system he played in, that is not too shabby.

I just dont think calling the guy "unimpressive" is fair.

Britt has to stay healthy. In this offense, with Brady he could do well.
 
You can say whatever you want. Matthews was the most productive slot receiver from 13-16 and it was his first 3 years in the league. I dont care what system he played in, that is not too shabby.

I just dont think calling the guy "unimpressive" is fair.

Britt has to stay healthy. In this offense, with Brady he could do well.

He was playing at Vanderbilt in 2013. He's never broken 1,000 yards. Are we even talking about the same player? He's not even the most productive slot receiver drafted in the 2nd round of the 2014 Draft, and he's the fourth most productive slot receiver in that draft altogether (depending on whether you consider Brandin Cooks and Odell Beckham slot receivers or not; both have spent plenty of time running routes from the slot).

Maybe Matthews will be great with the Patriots, maybe he's the next in the apostolic succession of slot receivers. But I've seen the guy play a fair amount and I didn't see anything special.
 
He was playing at Vanderbilt in 2013. He's never broken 1,000 yards. Are we even talking about the same player? He's not even the most productive slot receiver drafted in the 2nd round of the 2014 Draft, and he's the fourth most productive slot receiver in that draft altogether (depending on whether you consider Brandin Cooks and Odell Beckham slot receivers or not; both have spent plenty of time running routes from the slot).

Maybe Matthews will be great with the Patriots, maybe he's the next in the apostolic succession of slot receivers. But I've seen the guy play a fair amount and I didn't see anything special.

In pads he looks like a specimen especially in the slot. I’ve watched my fair share of eagles games since he arrived and the word I would use is inconsistent. Guy dropped his fair share of easy catches but also showed flashes. No way in hell was he the top slot guy during that time. He wouldn’t have even been considered the best slot guy on our roster during those years.
 
In pads he looks like a specimen especially in the slot. I’ve watched my fair share of eagles games since he arrived and the word I would use is inconsistent. Guy dropped his fair share of easy catches but also showed flashes. No way in hell was he the top slot guy during that time. He wouldn’t have even been considered the best slot guy on our roster during those years.

He wouldn't have been the second best slot guy on the Patriots in 2014-16...
 
Not sure why you are obsessed with Lawrence maroney

But at least you have learned that catch rate is heavily influenced by type of pass. You are welcome for that lesson.
I guess you will have to wait to see Patterson not being the slot receiver to get that one through your hard head though.

You told us that Maroney was a first rate RB. Went to bat for him. A litany of your other predictions and evaluations were out in left field too.

The Farmers Almanac is more accurate than your postings.
 
You told us that Maroney was a first rate RB. Went to bat for him. A litany of your other predictions and evaluations were out in left field too.

The Farmers Almanac is more accurate than your postings.
Of course you are making things up.
 
Wrong year. Last year was 2017.

And still in 2016 he averaged 8.7 ypc with 6.4 yac which means his average depth of catch was 2.3 yards downfield.
You are clowning yourself.

Last year was 2017? Really?

What a clownshow. Pay attention. Spelling everything out for you, the 2017 game charting is not up yet. Edelman did not play in 2017 so how could anyone compare him to another WR?

2016 Edelamn yards after catch - 5.15
2016 Patterson average yards after catch - 6.19

Edelman 1st downs per reception - .56
Patterson 1st downs per reception - .44

I dont care what yard line the pass was thrown to or which Minnesota QB made the throw. Patterson made the plays as called.
 
Of course you are making things up.

The board has a search function. It took me less than 5 minutes to go back to 2010 and find this gem where you said Maroney was "equally as talented" as Marshawn Lynch and inferred that the Bills would trade Lynch straight up for Maroney. As Lynch was a first rate RB in his prime, you were inferring then that Maroney was a first rate RB.

Would you trade Maroney for Marshawn Lynch?
 
Last year was 2017? Really?

What a clownshow. Pay attention. Spelling everything out for you, the 2017 game charting is not up yet. Edelman did not play in 2017 so how could anyone compare him to another WR?

2016 Edelamn yards after catch - 5.15
2016 Patterson average yards after catch - 6.19

Edelman 1st downs per reception - .56
Patterson 1st downs per reception - .44

I dont care what yard line the pass was thrown to or which Minnesota QB made the throw. Patterson made the plays as called.
You literally know nothing about football.
 
Nope its the truth.

You refused to accept that Maroney was terrible. Instead you bragged on him.
Maroney was neither a top RB or terrible. He was effective for a number of years on winning teams.
But if you have to go back 10 years to (wrongly) call me out on an opinion that says volumes.
 
Jordan Matthews was the best slot receiver in football? Are you nuts? Doug Baldwin, Larry Fitzgerald, Julian Edelman, Jarvis Landry, Golden Tate, Mohamed Sanu, Keenan Allen, Randall Cobb? Even in his best year he was maybe on the fringe of the top-10. He put up big numbers in a Chip Kelly offense that was mostly devoid of talent but ran more plays than any other team in history. He's not very physically gifted, but he's physical and wins at the catch point. Still, there was a reason he was available later into free agency.

Britt's best years are well behind him, and his weird year with the Rams came when he was the only warm body available to catch passes. He's a journeyman now, and one whose production and yards per reception has steadily dropped since 2014. He'll be 30 in September, and he's got a reputation as a malcontent. Maybe he'll go back to his old self with a full offseason with Brady, but it's just as likely he's on the waiver wire come opening day.

Neither of these guys are even guaranteed to make the team, let alone play a major role. I'd love to see them do well but I'm not expecting anything.

BTW, this is all great. But its opinions and guesses.

Britt has been a downfield player (more than Hogan) with some pretty average QBs. He is only a year older (30) than Hogan as well and will now be playing with the GOAT. Look what playing with the GOAT did for Hogan.

So while we can guess and speculate what happened and why and what will happen - Saying Britt isnt a "downfield player" is wrong. He is a downfield player whether he comes here and excels or flames out regardless of his attitude as well - none of that changes what type of WR he is. Can he still do it is the question?? So far in camp he was the standout until he pulled his hamstring. He may not be the "downfield player" he used to be but he might be given what TB has done for receivers.

Also, again, I dont think anything Matthews did his first 3 years in the NFL is "unimpressive". Sure he gets a lot of balls but 225 catches, 2673 yards and 19 touchdowns his first 3 years in the league is pretty solid regardless of system.

Doug Baldwins 1st 3 years in the NFL 130 catches, 1932 yards 12 TD

And BTW
Matthews avg catch % those years was 65%
Baldwins was 62.4

Granted Baldwin's yards per reception is a few yards longer but the point stands. Matthews caught 42% more balls, 28% more yards, and 37% more TDs than Baldwin over their first 3 years in the league.

Also, Matthews did it with 4 different QBs and literally a different one each year - Bradford, Sanchez, Foles and Wentz. Baldiwn, had Jackson for a year and Wilson going forward, exclusively.

Also, if someone came in here and started proclaiming that the great Julien Edelman or even WW for that matter, were overrated because they played with the GOAT and in a system that as BB puts it "favors the slot receiver" people would lose their minds.

By the way, here are the catch % rates for 2 slot WRs
65.6 - Matthews first 4 years in the league.
65.8 - Danny Amendola first 6 years in the league which includes 2 years with the GOAT

Amendola is known for having elite hands.

Lets look at Julian Edelmans last 3 years:

His catch rate was 66.5 and that is with him and Brady literally sharing a brain at this point. Matthews is 65.6 his first four years in the NFL with 4 different QBs none of which hold a candle to Brady.

Matthews and JE have about the same Yards Per Reception avg over those time periods also. I am not saying JM is better than JE at all also. But JE is locked in to TB at this point and that is a huge advantage.

So again, I ask you, without tap dancing, are you going to admit Jordan Matthews at least isnt "unimpressive" and that Britt is at least a proven "Downfield player" regardless of what he may or may not do and what potential boost he may get from playing with the GOAT

Oh, by the way, Matthews and Britt are both playing for contracts this year.
 
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The board has a search function. It took me less than 5 minutes to go back to 2010 and find this gem where you said Maroney was "equally as talented" as Marshawn Lynch and inferred that the Bills would trade Lynch straight up for Maroney. As Lynch was a first rate RB in his prime, you were inferring then that Maroney was a first rate RB.

Would you trade Maroney for Marshawn Lynch?

That was a gem of a thread. I’m
Bummed we’re stuck with BB making these personnel decisions when a few of our own on this board could’ve fixed our rb situation post Maroney with studs such as Toby Gerhart, Jonathan Dwyer and Ben Tate.
 
The board has a search function. It took me less than 5 minutes to go back to 2010 and find this gem where you said Maroney was "equally as talented" as Marshawn Lynch and inferred that the Bills would trade Lynch straight up for Maroney. As Lynch was a first rate RB in his prime, you were inferring then that Maroney was a first rate RB.

Would you trade Maroney for Marshawn Lynch?

Thanks Kon

Im laughing like hell.
 
You literally know nothing about football.

Coming from you thats a compliment.

Check it out.

2016 NE was 2nd ranked passing offense and 15th rushing.
2016 Min was 19th passing and 31st rushing.

FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Innovative Statistics, Intelligent Analysis | 2016 OFFENSE EFFICIENCY RATINGS

Minnesota was a 1 dimensional offense and defenses could smother the pass.

Defenses must respect Brady and not play close to the LOS or he will burn them. This allows for NE players to get further away from the LOS. Like Edelman, Bradys go to guy. Still, Brady will take the 3 yard completion if the play is covered up on 2nd down vs nothing at all. Patterson will warrant the same respect as Edelman because the defense does not want Patterson to get behind them. Look for his YPC to rise.

Also, there is no debate that Patterson is smaller than Mathews.

Patterson was several times in the slot here.

 
Thanks Kon

Im laughing like hell.

Did you collect on your bet from BradyFTW! who was certain maroney would be a pat in 2010?
 
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