Semi OT: Flores suing NFL and NYG. Texts from Bill involved in the suit.

[‘Mondre]

Man I wonder how Flores feels about Watson…

Brady telling Lamar you’re next feels forced, factor that in with Flores not wanting him.

All of this is really fascinating.

Really proud of BFlo and how he’s handling himself through this.

Mind you AB called the nfl racist too but that’s for another day…

 

[Deus Irae]

The reason why the Rooney rule is so stupid is that any owner should be hiring in their own best interest.

In a language they may understand, Goodell and the NFL should be putting more emphasis on making the owners want to WIN and make more MONEY. Parity shouldn't come at the cost of enabling idiots.

Cut down on shared revenue and dismiss the fake anti-racism bs. Hire the best candidates (Flores being the cream of the crop).

Find a way to get rid of the dumba$$ owners.

Here's one of the problems with this whole situation. Owners that have generally been considered among the worst:

Bidwell - Steve Wilks (black coach)
Ross - Brian Flores (black coach)
Snyder - Ron Rivera (Hispanic coach)
McNair - David Culley (black coach)
Brown - Marvin Lewis (black coach)
Ford - Caldwell (black coach)
Johnson - Saleh (Arab, Muslim coach)


So the issue is not that the "worst" owners are also owners who aren't hiring minority coaches. And, on the other side of the coin, look at the ten longest tenured head coaches

The Longest-Tenured Head Coaches In The NFL

BB
Payton (just stepped down, job currently open)
Tomlin
Harbaugh
Carroll
Reid
Zimmer (Just fired, job currently open)
McDermott
McVay
Shanahan


So you've got 8 of the 10 still in their jobs and not in any position where they should be fired right now, and Payton, who'd have made it 9 of the 10 still returning and deservedly so. That means that, from 2017 until now, we've had 10 teams locked in right from the start, and only one of those coaches happened to be black. Following that group, we've had

Gruden
Vrabel
Nagy
Reich
Arians
Kingsbury
LaFleur

and only one of those coaches (Nagy) was behind the 8 ball coming into this year. That meant that, just in terms of those (mostly) stable teams, we were looking at about half the league being stable, with only one black coach in a group of coaches who'd mostly proven they were legitimate head coaches. And, then, even below that group, there are coaches who've either already proven themselves to an extent, or who've shown promise (One, Taylor, now has his team in the Super Bowl).

Furthermore, the people currently complaining about "minority" coaches seem to be ignoring the likes of Rivera (Hispanic) and Saleh (Arab and Muslim). "Only one black head coach" is an unfair characterization of the issue, but it's what's been pushed as part of the narrative, conveniently, as multiple black head coaches (and multiple white head coaches as well) were recently fired.

 

[TomPatriot]

Here are the facts and suppositions of this issue as I see it.

1. By any measure of analysis, Brian Flores had done an admirable job in Miami over the past 3 years, He had 2 winning seasons, he had a winning record against the Pats, he showed GREAT leadership in keeping a 1-7 team together, forget about the 8-1 finish. To overcome that kind of adversity you have had to build as very strong culture in your locker room. Its what every owner HOPES he'll get when he hires a new HC. Flores DID it and got fired anyhow. He had done something no Dolphin HC had done since 2003. Flores proved himself to be a quality NFL HC.

2. His firing was all about going against the owner's illegal requests to throw games and tamper with other team's QB's. If these allegations can be proven, then he has a slam dunk case for wrongful firing. I

That being said, I don't see any racism on the Dolphins part, just a butt stupid owner.

3. What IS racism by the NFL and its owners is to talk about "diversity" all freakin year, and then in a year where there has never been such a large pool of QUALIFIED black HC'ing candidates, go 0-5 in hiring one and it looks like it might be 0-6. THIS is what triggered the "racism" aspect of this suit. Flores is taking one for the team in order point out this OBVIOUS problem in the NFL.

4. I though Flores would be the first HC hired this off season. Even Josh didn't have the success of Brian's resume, especially as a. HC, though Josh has had much longer success as a coordinator. The rest of the guys hired thus far (except Harbaugh) have got NEAR the resume Flores had and still got hired before him. Any wonder he had to wonder WHY.

5. The NFL once again has shot themselves in the foot dismissing this suit after only 2 hours and not taking it seriously, because it IS serious.

6. I would be shocked right now if Miami DOESN'T hire a black HC just in an attempt to try and disprove the lawsuit.

7. In my ideal world, Josh will take Steve with him to LV, (btw I think Steve has proven to be a very good NFL coach, but he needs to get off on his own to gain his own identity) and Bob Kraft makes a big push to bring Brian back here. It might be a long time before Flores gets another chance to be a HC, he shouldn't have to wait any time to get back on a professional staff. BTW I actually am on pins and needles waiting to see who Josh DOES take with him, if anyone.

8. The Rooney Rule is an artificial devise to at least give the impression that there is fairness in hiring HC's and executives. It is unfortunate that it has to exist. "reverse discrimination" they used to say when mandated hiring practices where put into effect to add more diversity to the workforce. And yes it DOES look unfair, except when you look at literally CENTURIES of actual discrimination black people have had to deal with. Hard to believe we STILL have to deal with this, but but although we can say things a "better". this sh!t still exists.

One tiny moan in response to an otherwise excellent post. In most US states, like NY, there isn’t a claim for wrongful termination.

 

[kitty7]

There are federal and state discrimination laws that one has to consider however those are very specific and relate to not discriminating against some (hiring/firing/promotions) based simply on one's race, color, national origin, religion, sex, age, or disability. A lot of states also have laws surrounding bullying and emotional distress in the workplace, that would have been the better route for Flores to take against the Dolphins IMO. As crazy as it sounds but it is what it is, I can hire someone over someone else because they wore a pink shirt to the interview, and I like pink versus white. I can also fire you because you wore boots to work, and I like loafers instead. JUST as long as I don't refuse to hire, fire etc., you because you are Hispanic, Muslim, a male instead of a female, or because you are bipolar. You have to be able to prove the reason you weren't hired, promoted or fired was SPECIFICALLY because of your race, color, national origin, religion, sex, age or disability. Let's say for example you interview for a job and somehow get a copy of the interviewer's notes from the interview and the notes state because you are a female you could go out on maternity leave anytime and for that specific reason I am going to pass on your candidacy, well there you go... One can also be successful (subjective) in their job, but if I'm your manager and believe you are difficult to work with or we have a simple personality conflict with each other you can be fired legally.

 

[1960Pats]

Stephen Ross seems like a nice guy.

Goodell thinks the world of him. He must be a nice guy.

 

[1960Pats]

Here are the facts and suppositions of this issue as I see it.

1. By any measure of analysis, Brian Flores had done an admirable job in Miami over the past 3 years, He had 2 winning seasons, he had a winning record against the Pats, he showed GREAT leadership in keeping a 1-7 team together, forget about the 8-1 finish. To overcome that kind of adversity you have had to build as very strong culture in your locker room. Its what every owner HOPES he'll get when he hires a new HC. Flores DID it and got fired anyhow. He had done something no Dolphin HC had done since 2003. Flores proved himself to be a quality NFL HC.

2. His firing was all about going against the owner's illegal requests to throw games and tamper with other team's QB's. If these allegations can be proven, then he has a slam dunk case for wrongful firing. I

That being said, I don't see any racism on the Dolphins part, just a butt stupid owner.

3. What IS racism by the NFL and its owners is to talk about "diversity" all freakin year, and then in a year where there has never been such a large pool of QUALIFIED black HC'ing candidates, go 0-5 in hiring one and it looks like it might be 0-6. THIS is what triggered the "racism" aspect of this suit. Flores is taking one for the team in order point out this OBVIOUS problem in the NFL.

4. I though Flores would be the first HC hired this off season. Even Josh didn't have the success of Brian's resume, especially as a. HC, though Josh has had much longer success as a coordinator. The rest of the guys hired thus far (except Harbaugh) have got NEAR the resume Flores had and still got hired before him. Any wonder he had to wonder WHY.

5. The NFL once again has shot themselves in the foot dismissing this suit after only 2 hours and not taking it seriously, because it IS serious.

6. I would be shocked right now if Miami DOESN'T hire a black HC just in an attempt to try and disprove the lawsuit.

7. In my ideal world, Josh will take Steve with him to LV, (btw I think Steve has proven to be a very good NFL coach, but he needs to get off on his own to gain his own identity) and Bob Kraft makes a big push to bring Brian back here. It might be a long time before Flores gets another chance to be a HC, he shouldn't have to wait any time to get back on a professional staff. BTW I actually am on pins and needles waiting to see who Josh DOES take with him, if anyone.

8. The Rooney Rule is an artificial devise to at least give the impression that there is fairness in hiring HC's and executives. It is unfortunate that it has to exist. "reverse discrimination" they used to say when mandated hiring practices where put into effect to add more diversity to the workforce. And yes it DOES look unfair, except when you look at literally CENTURIES of actual discrimination black people have had to deal with. Hard to believe we STILL have to deal with this, but but although we can say things a "better". this sh!t still exists.

The NYFL is racist. We know that but we've been ignoring it for many years.

Edit: I agree that the Rooney rule is a joke.

 

[Rob0729]

If anyone thinks the league is going to do anything to Miami for offering to pay to tank or tampering with Brady, you are kidding yourself. There is no way the league is going to validate any part of Flores’ lawsuit. They are not going to risk losing the case to punish the Dolphins.

Ross is a short timer anyway. He already has a succession plan in place to sell his team which the league approved. The league will probably just quietly push him to sell the team in like six months to a year after this story dies down.

 

[1960Pats]

So Bill sent his texts to the wrong Brian? Now that's fantastic.

 

[carmelo15]

Hard to argue, IMO.

here’s the thing with these tweets nobody that’s against what he’s doing will tweet about it cause they’ll get “cancled” so these guys tweeting about it are just for the ride

 

[1960Pats]

If anyone thinks the league is going to do anything to Miami for offering to pay to tank or tampering with Brady, you are kidding yourself. There is no way the league is going to validate any part of Flores’ lawsuit. They are not going to risk losing the case to punish the Dolphins.

Ross is a short timer anyway. He already has a succession plan in place to sell his team which the league approved. The league will probably just quietly push him to sell the team in like six months to a year after this story dies down.

It doesn't matter to me anymore. I'm no longer a fan of the NYFL.

 

[carmelo15]

If Bill B is available and I want to hire him I have to interview someone I have no intention of hiring just to avoid penalties. To me that is stupid and insulting to the people I interview with no intention of hiring.

Exactly!!

 

[carmelo15]

It doesn't matter to me anymore. I'm no longer a fan of the NYFL.

Lol if you really think the nfl is racist you’re a sheep

 

[farn]

So Bill sent his texts to the wrong Brian? Now that's fantastic.

or did he... ?

 

[Sciz]

Took me way too long to make the connection that hiring a new OC is about to get really awkward. The Pats have to interview an outside minority candidate knowing that O’Brien is the clear favorite because he previously held that exact position.

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

I feel for Flores, he was asked by his boss to compromise his integrity, and he wouldn't do it. Good for him! Flores knew both tanking and tampering were wrong, and he didn't obey. It of course, cost him his job. I'm sure going on a 7 game winning streak, after they were effectively out of the playoffs, also didn't help.

Do NFL teams interview black coaches, when they absolutley know they are going to hire someone else, of course they do. Most teams already know, or at least have a pretty good idea, who they are going to hire, before they even fire the old coach. Is that racist? or is it just following the Rooney rule?

I think the racism charges are not really going anywhere. They do of course, cause the most noise, but as a legal course of action, they are almost impossible to take action against. Especially in an "at will" workplace.


Kraft should be filing tampering charges against the Dolphins today, of course he won't because he too, lacks the spine that Flores has shown here.

I hope BB hires Flores back as DC. I think every player will play their guts out for him.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Looks like Chris Greir is gettin' some collateral damage...

Good.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Took me way too long to make the connection that hiring a new OC is about to get really awkward. The Pats have to interview an outside minority candidate knowing that O’Brien is the clear favorite because he previously held that exact position.

Why would it be awkward?

 

[RobertWeathers]

I think Belichick has an unwritten code in which his coaches don't pilfer his staff after walking out the door...

I think that is what soured the Mangini situation...

Partially true.

It's a conversation the exiting coach has with BB FIRST regarding which coach or FO staffer is/isn't under contract next year and who BB is thinking about promoting.

Every coach who has left had that conversation with Bill- except Mangini.

 

[Sam Bam Cunningham]

I feel for Flores, he was asked by his boss to compromise his integrity, and he wouldn't do it. Good for him! Flores knew both tanking and tampering were wrong, and he didn't obey. It of course, cost him his job. I'm sure going on a 7 game winning streak, after they were effectively out of the playoffs, also didn't help.

Do NFL teams interview black coaches, when they absolutley know they are going to hire someone else, of course they do. Most teams already know, or at least have a pretty good idea, who they are going to hire, before they even fire the old coach. Is that racist? or is it just following the Rooney rule?

I think the racism charges are not really going anywhere. They do of course, cause the most noise, but as a legal course of action, they are almost impossible to take action against. Especially in an "at will" workplace.


Kraft should be filing tampering charges against the Dolphins today, of course he won't because he too, lacks the spine that Flores has shown here.

I hope BB hires Flores back as DC. I think every player will play their guts out for him.

By filing tampering charges he validates the lawsuit against himself and his fellow owners He wont do it

 

[Sam Bam Cunningham]

Partially true.

It's a conversation the exiting coach has with BB FIRST regarding which coach or FO staffer is/isn't under contract next year and who BB is thinking about promoting.

Every coach who has left had that conversation with Bill- except Mangini.

Flores took Oshea with him to Miami