Rumor: Some Patriots Players Have Doubts About Cam Newton

[Ring 6]

If I had a choice I'd take Dalton in a heartbeat. At least he knows what's going on and can get the ball close.

I saw a post upstream with the thought of Cam as a TE. Seeing how he shied away from a loose ball in a big SB situation I'd be a tad skeptical, but he couldn't be any worse than he is as a QB.

Frankly where we were last year, and only being able to bring in the dregs of the qb position I understood the newton move.
Best shot we had was to minimize the passing game and try to win with defense, running game and just have the QBs be a piece.
I could have seen if newton accepted that and played his old style of running away when he couldn’t figure out who was open and either running for yards or running around until coverage broke down so he could make the occasional big play, and punt when he doesn’t. But he never did that. He wanted to prove he could be what he isn’t. I expected the Lamar Jackson offense and got the Tim Tebow offense.

 

[moosekill]

If Cant Newton is the best choice they have at QB then this team is in trouble, now and in the future.

Not only were the Pats wrong in letting Brady go, it was the worst move by a Boston sports team since Ruth. If TB12 was still with the team they'd probably be one of the favorites to win the SB.

I'm not that interested in Brady having success. I'm a Pats fan first.

Sadly Brady got old and is going to retire in a year or two or three. He is 100%% playing on borrowed time right now. All of you who are Brady fans should be enjoying every minute of his play time this year and next year if he still plays, because it isn't going to go on much longer.

If winning the superbowl is the goal, then the Patriots with Brady weren't going to do it last year with him, and it is very very questionable they would have done it this year with him. They would not have had the money to spend on free agents this year, they would have drafted lower, and still probably have taken a qb in the draft. So the rest of the team wouldn't have been as strong as they are this year.

Trading the best player in baseball who was very young for cash to finance a musical is in no way comparable to a 42 year old free agent qb deciding to play for another team that wasn't offering more money, but simply had a better surrounding cast.

 

[1960Pats]

Frankly where we were last year, and only being able to bring in the dregs of the qb position I understood the newton move.
Best shot we had was to minimize the passing game and try to win with defense, running game and just have the QBs be a piece.
I could have seen if newton accepted that and played his old style of running away when he couldn’t figure out who was open and either running for yards or running around until coverage broke down so he could make the occasional big play, and punt when he doesn’t. But he never did that. He wanted to prove he could be what he isn’t. I expected the Lamar Jackson offense and got the Tim Tebow offense.

I was disappointed with the Newton move for two reasons.
1) I can't stand him. He's a smooth talking BSer and not much of a QB.
2) It meant that we didn't have a QB when the Pats chased Brady away.
Hopefully, we'll see how great of a teammate Newton is when he's holding a clipboard for Mac Jones.

 

[amfootball]

I was disappointed with the Newton move for two reasons.
1) I can't stand him. He's a smooth talking BSer and not much of a QB.
2) It meant that we didn't have a QB when the Pats chased Brady away.
Hopefully, we'll see how great of a teammate Newton is when he's holding a clipboard for Mac Jones.

I was more disappointed that we not only resigned him but also paid him more money.

 

[1960Pats]

Trading the best player in baseball who was very young for cash to finance a musical is in no way comparable to a 42 year old free agent qb deciding to play for another team that wasn't offering more money, but simply had a better surrounding cast.

Stop making things up. The Pats didn't offer Brady two years and 50 mil.

These two blunders are similar because both had success prior to leaving, though Brady had more because he had more years under his belt than Ruth. Btw, the 20 year career for Brady with the Pats, when you think of it, should have been more of a reason to keep him here.
They were also both gone and their teams didn't return to anywhere near the same level of success, though I sure as heck hope the Pats don't go 86 years without winning.
The major difference that I see is that the Socks got something in return. The Pats did not.

 

[1960Pats]

I was more disappointed that we not only resigned him but also paid him more money.

That shows how truly unprepared the Pats were for Brady's leaving. It reeks of arrogance on the team's part.

 

[Ring 6]

I was disappointed with the Newton move for two reasons.
1) I can't stand him. He's a smooth talking BSer and not much of a QB.
2) It meant that we didn't have a QB when the Pats chased Brady away.
Hopefully, we'll see how great of a teammate Newton is when he's holding a clipboard for Mac Jones.

Personality, good guy/bad guy isn’t even a conservation for me. It’s 100% about what they do on the field.
Newton actually seems like a guy who would go out of his way to prove he’s a good teammate and above complaining. But who knows, and really who cares.

 

[moosekill]

Stop making things up. The Pats didn't offer Brady two years and 50 mil.

These two blunders are similar because both had success prior to leaving, though Brady had more because he had more years under his belt than Ruth. Btw, the 20 year career for Brady with the Pats, when you think of it, should have been more of a reason to keep him here.
They were also both gone and their teams didn't return to anywhere near the same level of success, though I sure as heck hope the Pats don't go 86 years without winning.
The major difference that I see is that the Socks got something in return. The Pats did not.

Could you show me the contract offer the Patriots made to Brady, just wanted to compare it to the contract he signed with Tampa, thanks!

 

[moosekill]

Stop making things up. The Pats didn't offer Brady two years and 50 mil.

These two blunders are similar because both had success prior to leaving, though Brady had more because he had more years under his belt than Ruth. Btw, the 20 year career for Brady with the Pats, when you think of it, should have been more of a reason to keep him here.
They were also both gone and their teams didn't return to anywhere near the same level of success, though I sure as heck hope the Pats don't go 86 years without winning.
The major difference that I see is that the Socks got something in return. The Pats did not.

This is really just sad, stop we get it, we all loved Tom. Most of us all realized he was going to either retire or leave at some point. He decided to leave a couple of years before he retired to try and go out as a winner. He probably wasn't going to do that here if he stayed, so he decided to go elsewhere.

The Patriots got the chance to use the cap savings to start the rebuilding process a couple of years earlier than they would have. See there is this thing in the NFL called a salary cap, it is pretty hard for some people to understand, but there is a limit to how much a team can spend on players. Unlike baseball in the 1920's. I can go more into depth if you need more help with that.

 

[Ring 6]

Gibbs won with the best players on the field that day, just like BB. If Gibbs had a HOF QB for 20 years he would have had an even better record.
How would the 49ers have done without Montana?
The Giants D under BB without LT?
Winning is about the players, not the coaches.

It’s about both players and coaches.
It’s not like coaches are given better players in a vacuum. The talent difference between good teams and bad teams is not that big, especially over a period of time.
Coaches develop players. Coaches put players in position to succeed or fail. Coaches ultimately give an assignment to every player on every play.
Invariably we see a change in coaches dramatically change the fortunes of teams with mostly the same players.
It’s like saying Amazon succeeded because they have the best package handlers rather than the best system and management.

 

[Ring 6]

Stop making things up. The Pats didn't offer Brady two years and 50 mil.

These two blunders are similar because both had success prior to leaving, though Brady had more because he had more years under his belt than Ruth. Btw, the 20 year career for Brady with the Pats, when you think of it, should have been more of a reason to keep him here.
They were also both gone and their teams didn't return to anywhere near the same level of success, though I sure as heck hope the Pats don't go 86 years without winning.
The major difference that I see is that the Socks got something in return. The Pats did not.

If the patriots didn’t offer Brady 2 years and 50 million, that’s why he took it from the bucs.
They NEEDED TO do that to keep him.

 

[203Pat]

Hey you can have whatever criteria you want. Mine is that a 3 year extension of 2019, and largely the second half of 2019, scrambling to make the playoffs and being one and done, with a QB in his 40s doesnt interest me.
If Brady stayed we weren’t winning because we saw what 2019 looked like and we were still 3 years away from having the resources to improve the team.
You yourself just said the roster was devoid of talent and you are skeptical with all of the influx of talent that the team will be good, so you’ve answer it yourself. Without it, the team would be awful. Brady wasn’t elevating it in 2019 and would be dealing with roughly the same squad now.

When I say ultimately the best move, it’s because we would not have competed for a championship before Brady retired if he stayed.
Rebooting now rather than holding on emotionally was a smarter move.
Of course the team would be better with Brady, but it wasn’t going to be good enough, so they needed to move on.

So making the playoffs with an old QB is worse than not making the playoffs with a bad QB so you can hopefully get a good one?

If Bill hits on a couple draft picks and makes a decent free agent signing or two they are right back in the mix heading into this season with Brady at the helm. I don't know why people on here act like QB is just some plug and play position. "We drafted a QB so now we are good to go. Rebuild complete." Some teams spend decades searching for the right guy but we had the guy and ran him out of town for some hopes and dreams down the road.

I am not sure how Brady didn't elevate the team when we at least at a functional offense and then when he was gone we had an offense that looked like it was from 1932. If Meyers could manage 59/700 and Byrd could manage 47/600 with Cam I am sure they could have been better with Brady.

Like I said before I don't know how winning with an old guy is worse than losing with a bridge/rookie.

 

[Ring 6]

Stop making things up. The Pats didn't offer Brady two years and 50 mil.

These two blunders are similar because both had success prior to leaving, though Brady had more because he had more years under his belt than Ruth. Btw, the 20 year career for Brady with the Pats, when you think of it, should have been more of a reason to keep him here.
They were also both gone and their teams didn't return to anywhere near the same level of success, though I sure as heck hope the Pats don't go 86 years without winning.
The major difference that I see is that the Socks got something in return. The Pats did not.

I agree that in terms of sentimentality they could/should have kept him.
But why keep him if you don’t have the resources to build around him as he ages, and why would he stay? I mean other than sentimental reasons.
In the second half of 2019 the passing offense was terrible. Now I am 99% sure Brady was injured, even still why fail together when you each have a better chance to succeed apart?
And the patriots absolutely got something for Brady, something more valuable than trade receipts, they got the cap room to rebuild and proceeded to upgrade fully half of the roster.

 

[amfootball]

If the patriots didn’t offer Brady 2 years and 50 million, that’s why he took it from the bucs.
They NEEDED TO do that to keep him.

No they didn't. He wanted to stay. The Pats did not offer him anything except a one year deal at less money than what he was making the year prior and this was after he just helped to deliver the 6th ring. The Bucs offered him the best deal as a FA but prior he was looking for a multiyear commitment from the Pats going back to 2017 after Jimmy was traded.

 

[Ring 6]

So making the playoffs with an old QB is worse than not making the playoffs with a bad QB so you can hopefully get a good one?

If Bill hits on a couple draft picks and makes a decent free agent signing or two they are right back in the mix heading into this season with Brady at the helm. I don't know why people on here act like QB is just some plug and play position. "We drafted a QB so now we are good to go. Rebuild complete." Some teams spend decades searching for the right guy but we had the guy and ran him out of town for some hopes and dreams down the road.

I am not sure how Brady didn't elevate the team when we at least at a functional offense and then when he was gone we had an offense that looked like it was from 1932. If Meyers could manage 59/700 and Byrd could manage 47/600 with Cam I am sure they could have been better with Brady.

Like I said before I don't know how winning with an old guy is worse than losing with a bridge/rookie.

Making the playoffs, maybe, and going one and done with a 43-45 year old qb and a deteriorating team around him is absolutely worse than facing reality, taking a season on the chin and upgrading half the roster while drafting the QB of the future.
Do you honestly think the patriots future looks brighter today with Brady but without Henry, Smith, Agholor, van noy, brown, judon?

You seem more worried about “functional” and no bad seasons, while I am concerned about competing for championships.
The team isn’t “fixed” by drafting a QB, but the team improved by having the resources to improve the roster.
A team that can go 12-4 with an average qb and no Brady is better than a team that can go 4-12 with an average qb that has Brady.

 

[Ring 6]

No they didn't. He wanted to stay. The Pats did not offer him anything except a one year deal at less money than what he was making the year prior and this was after he just helped to deliver the 6th ring. The Bucs offered him the best deal as a FA but prior he was looking for a multiyear commitment from the Pats going back to 2017 after Jimmy was traded.

Did he tell you that? Seemed to me he was in a hurry to leave. You know since he told Kraft there was nothing they could do.
So I’ll play along, he was underpaid getting 2/50 from Tampa, what would he have taken to play here?

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

 

[203Pat]

Making the playoffs, maybe, and going one and done with a 43-45 year old qb and a deteriorating team around him is absolutely worse than facing reality, taking a season on the chin and upgrading half the roster while drafting the QB of the future.
Do you honestly think the patriots future looks brighter today with Brady but without Henry, Smith, Agholor, van noy, brown, judon?

You seem more worried about “functional” and no bad seasons, while I am concerned about competing for championships.
The team isn’t “fixed” by drafting a QB, but the team improved by having the resources to improve the roster.
A team that can go 12-4 with an average qb and no Brady is better than a team that can go 4-12 with an average qb that has Brady.

So you're basically fine with trading as close as you can get to a sure thing (Brady taking the team to the playoffs) for hopes that maybe in 2-3 years a new guy can do the same thing. Let's say in theory Stidham was the guy of the future. He looked good in camp and practice last season and had a year to absorb whatever he could from Brady and the coaches. Then at least I could see kicking Brady to the curb. I would still have hated it but at least I could understand the fact that we had the guy Bill felt it was time to make the move. In reality we had no one. Stidham apparently is not even close to starting QB material so Bill went bargain hunting for a guy who put together a horrific season. That I do not understand.

Brady and whomever vs Henry, Smith, Agholor, Van Noy, Brown, Judon, and no answer at QB is easy. I would take Brady in a heartbeat. Let's say Brady retires in 2 years. How many of these guys are still realistically going to be here in 2 years?

You can have a good/great roster all day but if you don't have a QB then what? You're not competing for championships. The Colts roster outside of QB is pretty damn good and they haven't had a QB since Luck retired and they aren't true super bowl contenders. The Chiefs were always hanging around as a solid team but never a super bowl team until Mahomes. Hell look at the Bucs. They were a middling joke of a team year in year out until Brady showed up. It is the quarterback that makes the team. You can always supplement around him and may have some lean years but if you have a QB your are in a significantly better spot to compete for a ring than the Indianapolis Colts' of the world.

 

[amfootball]

Did he tell you that? Seemed to me he was in a hurry to leave. You know since he told Kraft there was nothing they could do.
So I’ll play along, he was underpaid getting 2/50 from Tampa, what would he have taken to play here?

Every report out there has said Brady was looking for an extension back in 2017 after Jimmy was traded. I have no idea what the contract extension would have looked like back then but it was clear that Bill did not want to extend him to age 45 despite Brady stating that was his goal when he was in his late 30s and despite winning Super Bowls at ages 37, 39 and 41. Bill wanted to go year to year and was going to sign Brady in 2020 for less than he was making in 2019. Brady wanted a multiyear commitment understandably, and when he did not get it, he asked for the FT to be removed which Kraft and Bill happily did as they were never going to franchise him anyway.

I never said Tampa was underpaying him. I said he was a FA so they gave him a 2 year deal, guaranteed. The Patriots chose not to match despite Brady meeting in person with Kraft at his house. But had they extended him back in 17 or 18, there is a good chance it would have been for less money that what Tampa paid him. He wanted to finish his career here and always worked with Bill to ensure the team was in a good position to compete with its money/cap.

 

[Clonamery]

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