Rewatch Pats @ Steelers

[Former Fan]

Wow, they really were not ready for that situation

Yup. Some have used this as proof that Tomlin knew what was going on, but to me the real story here is that the team (including the QB) is already at the line running the first play. It's too late to tell any of them you want to make sure you run a play and not clock it. By the time they can get through to BR and tell him to run a play, he's already signaled to the whole team that he wants to clock it. BR is probably right that it was too late to get everyone setup to run a real play after they already lined up in "clock it" formation.

So, yeah, Tomlin might have figured out what he wanted to do before the first play was run, but he needed to (and had over three minutes to) figure it out earlier, while he still had a chance to tell the players on the field.

 

[TomPatriot]

Will be interesting to see how they solve this issue. Thuney had the same problem late last year but bounced back ok for the playoffs.

Its the third “blackout“ game in a row for JT that started in BUF and hopefully ends @BUF.

With Cannon out and Waddle banged up Tommy needs solid LG. Both Karras and Croston are solid (+ bigger) backups and it seems Thuney could use a break but not likely BB&Scar way.

Hopefully the end of insane road odyssey last 6 weeks and full week of preparation/regeneration for a home game give Joe some juice back..

I'm no Dante but to me a lot of this problem is technique. He's way too high out of his stance, allowing Hayward to get his hands inside and bull rush him. Once a good DL gets his hands up inside, you're done pass blocking because its really hard to recover because the OL has no leverage.

 

[Kontradiction]

I'm no Dante but to me a lot of this problem is technique. He's way too high out of his stance, allowing Hayward to get his hands inside and bull rush him. Once a good DL gets his hands up inside, you're done pass blocking because its really hard to recover because the OL has no leverage.

Yeah, that's what I think is happening too. Once you lose that pad leverage, you're done. That play was over before the ball was even snapped.

 

[DaBruinz]

Wonder how a shallow crossing pattern broke open to begin with? Illegal pick. If Rowe runs into it he is more than a yard beyond the LOS.

Actually, that's not an illegal pick. It's only illegal if the receiver makes contact with the defender. If Rowe had been paying attention, he'd have run into Rogers and fallen over. THAT would have made it an illegal pick..

 

[DaBruinz]

Yea at one point they were like.... 11/14 on 3rd down? Wish i could find the real time stat but it was a major anomaly with such a good secondary. That just wont happen again. Also poor red zone D till the final drive, 3tds in 4 trips, very un patriot like and steelerclike for the matter. Thats the beauty of having brady, so many games with several teaching points and rare breakdowns that likely wont happen a second time still go down as wins.

It wasn't 3 tds in 4 trips because 2 of the TDs should have been called back.

- As I have stated and @luuked pointed out already, DeCastro was illegally downfield blocking.

- If you review the Bryant TD, he was illegally stiff-arming Gilmore long before the ball got there. That's offensive pass interference.

You can't fault the defense for the Refs not doing their job..

 

[Mack Herron]

Actually, that's not an illegal pick. It's only illegal if the receiver makes contact with the defender. If Rowe had been paying attention, he'd have run into Rogers and fallen over. THAT would have made it an illegal pick..

Yes that is right. Of course Rowe would had to be confident the call would be made. If he had run straight into the defender the proper call would have negated the play.

 

[slam]

I wanted to contrast two long gainers against the Patriots to ask what should defensive backs should be doing when they are being blocked ahead of the play. The first is Melvin Gordon's 87 yard TD run in the Chargers' game.



There Harmon spins off the block, Gordon flows into the hole that Harmon vacates, and the long TD ensues.

The second of course is the 69 yard pass that set up the theatrics at the end of the Steelers game.



There Jordan Richards doesn't shed his block until too late, and Schuster gains the sideline and picks up an extra 50 yards from where he should have been forced out of bounds.

In both cases McCourty is kind of picked off by the actions of his teammate. Did he take bad angles?

Is there a technique that the DB being blocked should have played in each case? Were their responsibilities the same in both cases or different? The Steelers play was closer to the sideline than the Chargers one. But in both cases, the easiest path for the runner was given up. Is this an issue that can be addressed? Or do we just tip our cap to the opposition?

 

[Gumby]

Yup. Some have used this as proof that Tomlin knew what was going on, but to me the real story here is that the team (including the QB) is already at the line running the first play. It's too late to tell any of them you want to make sure you run a play and not clock it. By the time they can get through to BR and tell him to run a play, he's already signaled to the whole team that he wants to clock it. BR is probably right that it was too late to get everyone setup to run a real play after they already lined up in "clock it" formation.

So, yeah, Tomlin might have figured out what he wanted to do before the first play was run, but he needed to (and had over three minutes to) figure it out earlier, while he still had a chance to tell the players on the field.

It might just be me, but I could swear that Rapistburgers "clock" signal with his right hand was different than that of his left. And, on the ensuing play the wr to the right ran a route, and all on the left just kind of stood around.

So, what I think was that it was intentional. They thought they could lull the defense if half the eligibles did nothing. BR signaled which side would be hot with his two different clock signals. Does any of the video show that signal clearly?

 

[patfanken]

Another play I already looked at a bit was the first Steeler touchdown. There was a flag on it which was definitely ineligible men downfield:

Look at how one of the lineman above the hashmarks is close to be 2-3 yards up the field at the moment the pass is thrown. I would love to hear how this flag was picked up because it looks clear as day to me:

From the rulebook:




The reason this is a flag is that blocking downfield is only allowed on running plays by design. This is one of the ways defenses can read a run. I cant fault Harris, Harmon or Rowe on this play because they all read run.

Also I dont get why this is not reviewable because this is one of the more black and white rules in the entire game.

Chatham said the same thing:

What bothers me most about this play was the flag was THROWN, and then picked up. If the flag was never thrown, I'd have thought, well they missed that one. Just like they missed a few on the Pats DB's. That happens. But since it was clearly a penalty that was called, I'd love to hear the reason why they picked it up, and why THAT play hasn't gotten more ink.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Can't wait until Henry is a Pat. Dude is so underrated.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

 

[patfanken]

Wonder how a shallow crossing pattern broke open to begin with? Illegal pick. If Rowe runs into it he is more than a yard beyond the LOS.

This is a well designed and executed play against man coverage. NOW, picture this play against a 4 or 5 under zone. Shuster would have gotten a 1 yard completion that MIGHT have turned into a 5 yd gain.

The problem, my friends, was not it the execution, but in the call. With 50 seconds to go, on the Steeler 25, 1st and 10, why the f*ck are we in tight man coverage????????????????????? I bet Matt and Bill had a discussion on that one after the game.

 

[Mack Herron]

This is a well designed and executed play against man coverage. NOW, picture this play against a 4 or 5 under zone. Shuster would have gotten a 1 yard completion that MIGHT have turned into a 5 yd gain.

The problem, my friends, was not it the execution, but in the call. With 50 seconds to go, on the Steeler 25, 1st and 10, why the f*ck are we in tight man coverage????????????????????? I bet Matt and Bill had a discussion on that one after the game.

I thought the same thing. Seemed like a prevent with 3 deep to me, but what do I know?

 

[patfanken]

This play just drives me mental.

Gilmore is actually an insane athlete but at times his speed isn't utilized properly. Dude is a legit sub 4.4 guy and doesn't even bother trying to use the sideline here. Some subtle hand fighting would go a long way here

I thought when I saw the play, that Gilmore made the same mistake I did when the ball was thrown. We both thought it was well overthrown and let up. I don't know if he could have defended it, even if he had kept up his momentum. Great throw, great catch, and one of those indefensible passes. and hopefully a painful lesson learned

 

[patfanken]

Communication issues still hurt us. This has to get straighten out.

Sometime I wonder that if Ebner remained healthy that HE'd be the one getting the Jordan Richards snaps.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Fwiw Thuney was listed as 295 go to N.C. ST. 305 as a Rookie & Almost everywhere now.

For fun I typed in Joe Thuney Weight to google & 287 came up.

Just passing it on

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Sometime I wonder that if Ebner remained healthy that HE'd be the one getting the Jordan Richards snaps.

Definitely, Bill tried using him in subs around 2014-2015 I believe?

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

We've seen this WHAM concept almost every other week

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

This is a well designed and executed play against man coverage. NOW, picture this play against a 4 or 5 under zone. Shuster would have gotten a 1 yard completion that MIGHT have turned into a 5 yd gain.

The problem, my friends, was not it the execution, but in the call. With 50 seconds to go, on the Steeler 25, 1st and 10, why the f*ck are we in tight man coverage????????????????????? I bet Matt and Bill had a discussion on that one after the game.

Yep, semi surprising. You can't go full "prevent" but in this instance I'd think the approach would be to come off a couple yards and keep everything in front of you (tackle in bounds if at all possible). But this just may have been BB/MP playing to win -- trying to force a TO by downs right then and there versus allow the FG that many felt the Steelers would get.

Steelers got lucky on that big play. They didn't get lucky completing it or gaining some yards but 70 yards or 60 yards or whatever, on a paper thin crossing route against a D that was 100% pass? That wasn't drawn up as a big gainer. not even in their dreams, that was a whole lotta good fortune involved in gaining that many yards. But fortune is fickle and the TD that was an incomplete pass was the swing of that pendulum.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

C'mon man. WHAM, Stalk, it doesn't matter. He does it all. Gronk is the greatest of all time.




Michael Irvin used to kill this route back in the day (Cowboys offense actually passed to set up the run)

Bang-8/Skinny Post. One thing you'll notice with Pats WRS is how well they use space to their advantage. Whether it's sidelines or mof they eat it up. Cooks is great at knowing when to cut off a DB before he catches a 40-50 yard bomb. Here Gronk positions himself great.






Some great footwork by Shaq here. Great technique, but check out that fat ass. That's an anchor man. Pointed right at 12, in position.