Reports are the Pats may upgrade the WRs through trade (not necessarily Hopkins)

[Thelonious]

With BoB being named OC, the Hopkins trade becomes a moot point.

LOL. Probably so!

 

[Thelonious]

Actually impressed the avg grade was 82. You must've given extra credit for the long word.

Nope. I just counted it as one of the words. The grade grubbers (bless their dark little hearts) wanted it to be extra credit, said they'd never use the word anyway. I should have said, "Maybe one day you'll be posting on a football forum, and...."

 

[lancerman]

Thanks for the history lesson, but I don't really see what it has to do with my suggestion. Yes. The recent history re WR's here is abysmal. Fine. Can we move on? Right now we have an interesting group, by which I mean that the coaching last year was so awful that we did not get a full look at what they might be and there were a few intriguing moments, interesting in that there is an intriguing wealth of (brace yourself) potential among them. Then there's the protean Mr. Jones. As a group, they warrant a deeper look. Wanna dump a couple? Be my guest. To me, given in particular the need to get a full look at Mac this year, O-Line is the obvious point of emphasis. Given this, I would not waste a high pick on a wr, and in later picks, you ain't gonna get much. If you want a WR, see what you can find trade/free agent, use him, and study what else you have in that room over the course of the season. I would simply make the priority re wr: 1) Forget for a moment about wr's and draft OL help.,2) Pay Jakobi,whatever (whatever) it takes, 3) Keep your eye out for a fun wr later draftpick if you want, but expect little, 4) When 3) doesn't work, buy a vet.

Why should we move on because a group that has played poorly is "interesting". They were the 20th ranked in passing yards this year. Every team below them was bottom feeders. They are also below the halfway mark in passing TD's. Also I don't care if it's Bourne or Meyers, neither are a WR1 on any of the playoff teams this year.

It's been a problem, it's still a problem. I'm not interested in going a 6th year in a row on addressing it based on some pie in a sky notion that a mediocre core is secretly really good.

Yeah it will be costly to get a WR. That's what teams lacking in that area have to do. People need to get over that. Or they can be gun shy and accept more mediocrity.

 

[Thelonious]

Why should we move on because a group that has played poorly is "interesting". They were the 20th ranked in passing yards this year. Every team below them was bottom feeders. They are also below the halfway mark in passing TD's. Also I don't care if it's Bourne or Meyers, neither are a WR1 on any of the playoff teams this year.

It's been a problem, it's still a problem. I'm not interested in going a 6th year in a row on addressing it based on some pie in a sky notion that a mediocre core is secretly really good.

Yeah it will be costly to get a WR. That's what teams lacking in that area have to do. People need to get over that. Or they can be gun shy and accept more mediocrity.

OK. I have no objection to trying a vet wr, but building a decent OL and keeping Jakoby are both more important. Given the reasonable ability of the present wr group. and their potential going forward, adding to that room is a lower priority. The dismal offensive stats this past year were not at all primarily the result of a weak receiver group. They were the result of Bill's asinine mismanagement of the offensive coaching staff. We'll see what they do. It is easy to come up with "good ideas" - such as getting a primo wr - the hard work is fitting all these bright ideas into a workable set of priorities. Some bright ideas are brighter than other bright ideas.

 

[Real fan 02]

Could indeed be. Maybe my judgment is damaged by all the past failures. I do think the present receiver room has significant potential. I also think getting the o-line in order is more important, as is retaining Jakoby Meyers, who has value both on and off the field.. I wouldn't object to taking on Hopkins, ut to me other needs should be granted a higher priority, and I am not sure meeting those higher priorities can leave room for the Hopkins gambit. It comes down to cost in the end, I suppose, as always, and priorities

Yes we definitely need upgrades starting with the offensive line.. we know we have 3 day 1 starters.... Andrew's, ownenu and strange, every where else needs upgrading on the line..

Yes the receiver room is pretty decent, I've also said in past post Myers is absolutely priority to be retained.. at times more than not he and Rham have been the offense.. I'm sure he'll test his market... but I see him back here..

Other upgrades could be adding another threat at TE the Jonnu Smith era is overwith.. I'm not expecting any thing from him.. as far as Hopkins I know he'll have suitors and options, but the knock on him is he is injury prone.. ,but when healthy he's just so dynamic.. he'll help Mac immensely..

On defense, beef up the D line.. guy is 33 and has been a stalwart, barmore is a force, but he won't play a full season..

LB could definitely use a few upgrades.

The secondary, resign peppers, sign a solid veteran corner, I'm not sure if I want Marcus Jones on the outside.. the slot is is calling.. I'd like to retain Jonathan Jones. However we need a playmaker opposite jack jones..

 

[Thelonious]

Yes we definitely need upgrades starting with the offensive line.. we know we have 3 day 1 starters.... Andrew's, ownenu and strange, every where else needs upgrading on the line..

Yes the receiver room is pretty decent, I've also said in past post Myers is absolutely priority to be retained.. at times more than not he and Rham have been the offense.. I'm sure he'll test his market... but I see him back here..

Other upgrades could be adding another threat at TE the Jonnu Smith era is overwith.. I'm not expecting any thing from him.. as far as Hopkins I know he'll have suitors and options, but the knock on him is he is injury prone.. ,but when healthy he's just so dynamic.. he'll help Mac immensely..

On defense, beef up the D line.. guy is 33 and has been a stalwart, barmore is a force, but he won't play a full season..

LB could definitely use a few upgrades.

The secondary, resign peppers, sign a solid veteran corner, I'm not sure if I want Marcus Jones on the outside.. the slot is is calling.. I'd like to retain Jonathan Jones. However we need a playmaker opposite jack jones..

Fair enough. We shall see!

 

[Jim Beankie]

Why should we move on because a group that has played poorly is "interesting". They were the 20th ranked in passing yards this year. Every team below them was bottom feeders. They are also below the halfway mark in passing TD's. Also I don't care if it's Bourne or Meyers, neither are a WR1 on any of the playoff teams this year.

It's been a problem, it's still a problem. I'm not interested in going a 6th year in a row on addressing it based on some pie in a sky notion that a mediocre core is secretly really good.

Yeah it will be costly to get a WR. That's what teams lacking in that area have to do. People need to get over that. Or they can be gun shy and accept more mediocrity.

Please name me the last non home grown FA honest to God WR1 (not AB) that made it to a SB. A quick look and all I could find was maybe Boldin with BAL and Randy in 2013 (washed up) and 2008. Being a Pats fan over the last 2 decades (to reference Office Space) is like being used to not 2 but 3 at the same time. What's the point of getting a costly WR when it's not gonna get us off?

 

[cmasspatsfan]

Sinden wasn't the goalie who Puuked & Ralfed vs Chicago in 2013 or vs St Louis in '19; nor was he the GM with All of those terrible 1st-rounders Not in the top 10 from 2007-13; or who traded away Blake Wheeler & Tyler Seguin for beads & trinkets; or who failed to draft Kyle Conner, Matt Barzal, Thomas Chabot, Roope Hintz, Alex Debrincat etc; or who either traded away his other 1st-rounders for rentals like Rick Nash & Ondrej Kase or simply drafted crap with them.

Now you're talking about something other than what I was commenting on, I agree with your take on those moves, I was talking about Sinden not spending money. Now with the salary cap they spend pretty much what everyone else spends and have had some success. I won't even get into the debacle that happened the year of the lockout/strike back in the 90's and how they screwed that up.

 

[Real fan 02]

With BoB being named OC, the Hopkins trade becomes a moot point.

Yeah.. they've had some past tension however.. if BOB does end up taking the job and we do end up making a D hop trade then I would expect them to bury the hatchet.. speaking of an OC, I believe the team is doing it the right way.. enough with the tittless positions, allow these coaches a football identity on the staff.. I absolutely enjoy that ownership is being transparent with us the fan base...

 

[TheRainMaker]

Michael Irvin is not feeling Bill O'Brien as the OC. In fact, he's the one that reported the weird sh*t that was going on with the Texans and how players like D-Hop were disgruntled with O'Brien. Apparently, players were saying he was a Bill imposter and they weren't buying it. Bill O'Brien being added to a coaching staff that already includes Patricia and Judge would be bad news.

 

[Guts]

Michael Irvin is not feeling Bill O'Brien as the OC. In fact, he's the one that reported the weird sh*t that was going on with the Texans and how players like D-Hop were disgruntled with O'Brien. Apparently, players were saying he was a Bill imposter and they weren't buying it. Bill O'Brien being added to a coaching staff that already includes Patricia and Judge would be bad news.

As a HC sure, but as an OC the Patriots were top 3 offense the years he was here.

 

[TheRainMaker]

As a HC sure, but as an OC the Patriots were top 3 offense the years he was here.

There was no drop off whatsoever after he left. He was only the OC for one year (2011). Play caller for 3, but was highly criticized in his first year in 2009. Had no answer vs Rex Ryan in the divisional round and choked in the 2011 Super Bowl. He had Tom Brady, Gronk, Hernandez, Welker, Branch and a very good OL. He wouldn't have anyone close to that in NE. His claim to fame was yelling at Tom Brady.

 

[Kontradiction]

Sounds like there is a group inside the Patriots organization that wants to get a stud WR. Looks like if they do, they will trade. According to Andrew Callahan, the names could be available via trade includes:

DeAndre Hopkins
Keenan Allen (he has a $15.5 million base and can save them just under $15 million in cap by trading him and they have to give Herbert a big extension)
Mike Evans
Tee Higgins
Jerry Jeudy
Robbie Anderson
Tyler Boyd
Corey Davis

The first three are past their respective primes. The next two are who I hope they bring in.

 

[Real fan 02]

Please name me the last non home grown FA honest to God WR1 (not AB) that made it to a SB. A quick look and all I could find was maybe Boldin with BAL and Randy in 2013 (washed up) and 2008. Being a Pats fan over the last 2 decades (to reference Office Space) is like being used to not 2 but 3 at the same time. What's the point of getting a costly WR when it's not gonna get us off?

Great points... however the way our conference is structured the AFC, you need talent in order to be a contender... even Jax has a Borderline #1 WR in kirk..

It's either gotta be elite QB play or elite WR play.. all the teams left in AFC the playoffs have one or the other.. just the way of the NFL today.. even though aside from Moss and the cup of coffee with brown we never had that elite 1 WR..

However we still had elite play from the guys we did have Troy brown, dion branch, Edelman, Welker, of course gronk and Hernandez

 

[jdlboot14]

The main reason to keep Meyers is he'd be the only WR since Branch & Edelman to succeed here as a homegrown (undrafted) guy to get a 2nd contract. (and Branch hardly counts since he left after his rookie deal, and came back in FA) For BB's 23 years of GM, that's complete failure.
So, will we ever get a drafted WR to make a difference here? I don't think so. So sign Meyers!
And keep trying to get diamonds in the rough in FA.

 

[Real fan 02]

Michael Irvin is not feeling Bill O'Brien as the OC. In fact, he's the one that reported the weird sh*t that was going on with the Texans and how players like D-Hop were disgruntled with O'Brien. Apparently, players were saying he was a Bill imposter and they weren't buying it. Bill O'Brien being added to a coaching staff that already includes Patricia and Judge would be bad news.

There is alot of that on former coaches under Bill that leave... there was talk of that with mangini, Josh as well when he went to Denver. Patricia and judge.. seems guys try to take the patriots culture with them and it does not work.

Patricia will probably be more in the caserio role.. judge who knows! But BOB is his own man with his own offense, and I hope he has at least some autonomy like ownership has given to BB for so long..

 

[Real fan 02]

The first three are past their respective primes. The next two are who I hope they bring in.

Of all juedy is probably the most realistic as he's on his rookie deal...

 

[lancerman]

Please name me the last non home grown FA honest to God WR1 (not AB) that made it to a SB. A quick look and all I could find was maybe Boldin with BAL and Randy in 2013 (washed up) and 2008. Being a Pats fan over the last 2 decades (to reference Office Space) is like being used to not 2 but 3 at the same time. What's the point of getting a costly WR when it's not gonna get us off?

Last year OBJ on the Rams. Was a massive contributor they probably don't get to the Super Bowl without him. And just for the heck of it.... the otherside had a WR that the year before they invested the number 5 overall pick on. Two paths most people are against taking (trading or investing a high pick)

The year before the winning team invested the 7th overall pick on their top receiver (Evans), they also traded for Gronk, and yeah had AB in free agency. So the majority of their pass catching contributors were either a very high draft

In 2017 we got to a Super Bowl with Cooks who we traded a late 1st for.

So make your pick, investing high in the draft or trading someone. What's the point in saving assets and being mediocre?

 

[Real fan 02]

Last year OBJ on the Rams. Was a massive contributor they probably don't get to the Super Bowl without him. And just for the heck of it.... the otherside had a WR that the year before they invested the number 5 overall pick on. Two paths most people are against taking (trading or investing a high pick)

The year before the winning team invested the 7th overall pick on their top receiver (Evans), they also traded for Gronk, and yeah had AB in free agency. So the majority of their pass catching contributors were either a very high draft

In 2017 we got to a Super Bowl with Cooks who we traded a late 1st for.

So make your pick, investing high in the draft or trading someone. What's the point in saving assets and being mediocre?

It's very difficult when it comes to the patriots and drafting WRs... I believe we have something in Thornton.. but the track record is just so bad.. with the draft busts most recently Harry..

It's mind blowing how we can draft well at other areas of the team but WR is just glaring.. for instance at TE the reason we have Jonnu Smith is due to the Keene and asiais draft bust!


Now the Smith contract could have been given to a free agent WR, perhaps a game changer not named algalor. Just my opinion..

 

[cmasspatsfan]

There was no drop off whatsoever after he left. He was only the OC for one year (2011). Play caller for two, but was highly criticized in his first year in 2010. Had no answer vs Rex Ryan in the divisional round and choked in the 2011 Super Bowl. He had Tom Brady, Gronk, Hernandez, Welker, Branch and a very good OL. He wouldn't have anyone close to that in NE. His claim to fame was yelling at Tom Brady.

Gronk was hobbled that game, we probably win it with a healthy Gronk. Didn't Tom also set a record for consecutive completions that game? That was a game we should have won.