Poll: Grogan was a beast, no?

[fair catch fryar]

Take away the helmet and it could also say, 70's porn dude after an auto accident.

With really broad shoulders.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

I was a huge Grogan fan, my issue then as it is now were the Int's... he finished his career with 182 TD's and 208 int's, compare to #12 505 TD's and 167 Int's.. the int's always seemed to come at an inopportune time, either that or my memory is off.. he was gutsy and probably cannot compare him to anyone currently playing. Grogan also missed a lot of games due to injury in the back half of his career, but cannot blame him for that as that was the way he played the game..

What has always befuddled me during this period is the forgetting of Darryl Stingley and his sacrifice on the field... that f..ing creep Jack Tatum (aka the assassin) did him wrong...

Darryl was as important to that team as Troy Brown was this century.

Losing Julius Adams in Week 1 also badly hurt us in '78.

 

[mosslost]

56-3 against Jete - One of the best days ever..

Grogan's Pats routinely obliterated the Jets especially at Sullivan stadium

 

[mosslost]

Thanks for posting this. The Chuck Fairbanks Patriots of 1976-1978 with Grogan at QB and that road grader OL of Hannah and Leon Gray were the teams that hooked me on Patriot football forever. That team destroyed the eventual SB Champion John Madden Raiders in Foxboro in the regular season in 1976. Unfortunately we all know what happened in Oakland come playoff time. Too bad. That team deserved better. Good chance the Patriots would have won the Superbowl on our nation's bicentennial. The 1978 squad deserved a better ending IMO as well, but alas, like the '76 team they were undone in the end too--albeit from self inflicted wounds and not Ben Dreith. I think that team still holds the record for most rushing yards in a season and, IIRC, Grogan contributed a bunch of them.

1978 team the all time NFL greatest rush team, like 3500 rushing yards, and without a single 1000 yard rusher (did it with 7 runners, including Grogan who had like 600)

1976 is when I remember really getting hooked because my dad had season tickets from 76-80 and I got to go to 2 home games a year.

 

[mosslost]

I was a huge Grogan fan, my issue then as it is now were the Int's... he finished his career with 182 TD's and 208 int's, compare to #12 505 TD's and 167 Int's.. the int's always seemed to come at an inopportune time, either that or my memory is off.. he was gutsy and probably cannot compare him to anyone currently playing. Grogan also missed a lot of games due to injury in the back half of his career, but cannot blame him for that as that was the way he played the game..

What has always befuddled me during this period is the forgetting of Darryl Stingley and his sacrifice on the field... that f..ing creep Jack Tatum (aka the assassin) did him wrong...

All QBs in that era were like that with the possible exception of Staubach.

Terry Bradshaw had essentially the same career stats as Grogan, more INT than TDs etc.

I do remember Grogan having a 6 INT game at San Fran in 1980 though.

 

[mosslost]

Grogan was the type of QB who would bring a team to its highest levels, if there wasn't a ton of talent. That happened during his rookie season, when Plunkett was hurt, and he led a not ready Patriots team to like a 6-0 start. But Grogan was not the guy you would want if you had a Super Bowl team. He had a bad habit of throwing a stupid INT in the 4th quarter that really cost you.

It wasn't a coincidence that the year the Patriots made the Super Bowl was one when Eason was QB. I am not comparing the two, merely pointing out that the difference may have been that Eason would not kill them in big moments. Sort of what we have learned from BB football.

You are very wrong about the SB 20 year. Grogan came in for injurred Eason that year and the Pats were 6-0 with Grogan in 1985 as starter. Pats were 5-5 with Eason.

Eason played pretty well in the playoffs except for the Super Bowl though.

 

[italian pat patriot]

Eason played pretty well in the playoffs

No doubt
Tony Eason deserve credit about that awesome play off run

 

[upstater1]

56-3 against Jete - One of the best days ever..

Days? That seemed to happen multiple times. They used to call it Super sunday.

 

[DaBronxPats14]

I said it before, i'll say it again..... he's why I became a Pat's fan back in 1976.
In my touch-flag football leagues in '76 on, I QB'd and mostly ran bootlegs and flea flicker bombs. When I first met Grogan few yrs back at his store he was buggin that I was a Pat's Fan from NY and couldn't believe it. Grogan was One Tough SOB and a great guy.

 

[40yrpatsfan]

Must disagree.

Most of those picks were injury related (6 @ Candlestick in the mud in'80)

Too many clutch wins vs. favored teams to count

Grogan was EXACTLY the guy you wanted if you had a Super Bowl team. Starting Eason over him destroyed our seasons, especially in '85 and '86.

BTW, like Bledsoe, Eason was a pick and sack machine, especially in big moments.

Also, the TD passes were down because they ran it in, they had one of the greatest rushing offenses of all time and he didn't throw many passes in the red zone when he knew they would run it in. Another thing is that his rushing yards were not scrambles, they were designed QB runs, which in college was what he was. He loved contact which is why we all loved him. That he was able to develop into a very good deep passer was a bonus and really pretty amazing.

 

[Dragda]

I paid a half a bazillion dollars for an authentic Grogan throwback. It’s surprising how few people outside NE remember who he was.

 

[IcyPatriot]

Last QB to call his own plays ...
I always thought he would make a great coach - he had other plans.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Grogs was a Patsfan Ken kinda guy

 

[GaryfromTO]

loved Grogan. One of the reasons I became a Pats fan

 

[jmt57]

I was a huge Grogan fan, my issue then as it is now were the Int's... he finished his career with 182 TD's and 208 int's, compare to #12 505 TD's and 167 Int's..

Apologies in advance if I am piling on (others have already responded); that is not my intent.

I just wanted to point out to all how very much football has changed, making comparisons from one decade to another in passer and receiving stats meaningless. To me the better stat comparison is to one's peers.

Grogan did indeed throw a lot of picks - even for his time. For six straight seasons he ranked among the top ten in the NFL in number of interceptions, from '75 - '80.

What is overlooked though is that Grogan was ranked in the top five in TD passes three times in that span - despite the very prolific and record setting running game.

- In '76 Grogan threw the 2nd most picks in the NFL, but was also 4th in TDs.
- In '77 he was again 2nd in picks, but was 5th in most touchdown passes.
- In '78 Grogan had the 3rd most picks - but also led the league in TD passes.

As a reminder, the Patriots ranked 2nd (2948 yards), 6th (2303 yards) and 1st (all-time NFL record 3165 yards) in rushing during that time.

Steve Grogan was not the most physically talented passed to make it to the NFL. His passing deficiencies are often overstated though.

One thing that can never be overstated is Grogan's grit, determination, motivation and leadership. For anybody that watched those clubs, there will always be a very special fondness for the '76-'78 Fairbanks/Grogan Patriot teams.

 

[burtgummer]

Grogan to Stanley Morgan is my favorite combo is Patriots history

 

[DarrylS]

Apologies in advance if I am piling on (others have already responded); that is not my intent.

I just wanted to point out to all how very much football has changed, making comparisons from one decade to another in passer and receiving stats meaningless. To me the better stat comparison is to one's peers.

Grogan did indeed throw a lot of picks - even for his time. For six straight seasons he ranked among the top ten in the NFL in number of interceptions, from '75 - '80.

What is overlooked though is that Grogan was ranked in the top five in TD passes three times in that span - despite the very prolific and record setting running game.

- In '76 Grogan threw the 2nd most picks in the NFL, but was also 4th in TDs.
- In '77 he was again 2nd in picks, but was 5th in most touchdown passes.
- In '78 Grogan had the 3rd most picks - but also led the league in TD passes.

As a reminder, the Patriots ranked 2nd (2948 yards), 6th (2303 yards) and 1st (all-time NFL record 3165 yards) in rushing during that time.

Steve Grogan was not the most physically talented passed to make it to the NFL. His passing deficiencies are often overstated though.

One thing that can never be overstated is Grogan's grit, determination, motivation and leadership. For anybody that watched those clubs, there will always be a very special fondness for the '76-'78 Fairbanks/Grogan Patriot teams.

Will not dispute the numbers you presented, imo it was more about the timing of picks if there was a metric would like to see that as from my earphones (used to work and many of these games were blacked out) it seemed as though many of the picks were poorly timed.. injuries had a lot to do with it, you can have all the "grit and leadership" but if you cannot close the deal, then your value is diminished.

I respect him for his toughness, but his in game decisions that led to int's were sometimes suspect..

I know it is a different era, but your comments about his picks from 1975 to 1980 ring hollow, as after the 1980 season he never played a full season so his numbers were skewed as he never played more than 12 games in a season and .. what is telling is his int percentages after 1980: 1981, 7.4%; 1982, 3.3%; 1983, 4.0%;1984, 8.8%;1985,3.2%; 1986, 2.0%; 1987,5.6; 88, 9.3%;89, 5.4%;90, 3.3%. Keep in mind during this stretch he was not throwing as many passes as he did earlier in his career... in that period he only threw over 200 passes in a season twice and in 5 of those seasons he threw less than 150 passes.

 

[patriot1136]

Grogan was pretty much before my time, but I am somewhat familiar with him thanks to my dad and others being a fan of his. My dad basically says he is a tough SOB and was a fan of his and Sam Cunningham's back in the day (whom he also considers a badass).

 

[RobertWeathers]

I paid a half a bazillion dollars for an authentic Grogan throwback. It’s surprising how few people outside NE remember who he was.

That's how you seperate the old time Pat's fans from the millenial crowd.

I hold Grogan to the same standard as I do Terry Bradshaw who is in my Top 5 GOAT.

Not great numbers but he led the huddle and won.

 

[mosslost]

Grogan was pretty much before my time, but I am somewhat familiar with him thanks to my dad and others being a fan of his. My dad basically says he is a tough SOB and was a fan of his and Sam Cunningham's back in the day (whom he also considers a badass).

late 70s Pats was a revolutionary offense (Perkins Erhart system, the per-cursor to today. Howard Cosell called the 1976-78 Pats offense revolutionary)

They were all badasses too. (The whole NFL was kind of like that though in the late 70s.)

I don't know who posted it but somewhere in the thread someone said Grogan was not really know outside of New England. For older fans that followed the NFL fans of other teams remember Steve Grogan. I hear about it all the time with older Jets and Steeler fans.

Grogan's Pats kind of started the tradition of obliterating the Jets on a regular basis. They blew them out with 50s and 40 burgers to like 3, 7, more often than we do now.

And that was the heydey of the 70s Steelers, and the Pats had a pretty good parity with them head to head, 76 we beat them in Pitt. in 78 the defending champ Steelers squeasked a 16-13 OT MNF game in Foxboro.

We had some bad luck in the playoffs when we got there, and it was also harder to get into the playoffs back then.

From 1976-1986, the Pats basically had one horrible year and Grogan was out with a broken leg. (1981 I think) They were basically a good to great to even better than great team for most of the other years in that span.