Pats ranked #1 CB duo

[50-yard-line]

Jackson is starting to emerge, I think, as a solid backup outside corner (Michael, not JC, who looks great).

 

[jimnance]

From my comfy couch this is the biggest philosophical change I have seen for BB, at one time he seemed to have thought that he plug any athlete and "coach them up", guys like Tiquan Underwood come to mind. Even our beloved Troy was given a shot, he played well but not to the caliber that Gilmore etc have played.

I suspect that Gilmore will be appeased so that both parties do not lose "face" and our D will be kick butt, again.

That was back before all the rules changes and so-called "points of emphasis" favoring qbs and receivers changed the game. Polian's whining contributed but the real culprit is fantasy football. I HATE FF and have refused to play. FF fans bring a ton of $$ to the NFL and its affiliates and they want high-scoring offense. The NFL game was superior and more fun to watch in 2003 than it is today.
So today, the secondary is the most important unit on a D and a shutdown cb like Gilmore who can play outstanding man to man is the most important player on a D. As great as Ty Law was, he was never as important as Seymour. Thats all changed. For the worse.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

"Legion of Whom?"

 

[TheRainMaker]

Great secondary that lacks depth at outside CB.

Most teams are lacking one good outside CB. Pats are elite from both sides on the outside to slot. Asking for more solid outside guys is getting really picky.

Who is screaming to dump Gilmore?

Screaming may be an exaggeration, but there was a long thread this offseason with posters open to the idea of trading him thinking he would hold out.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Most teams are lacking one good outside CB. Pats are elite from both sides on the outside to slot. Asking for more solid outside guys is getting really picky.

Screaming may be an exaggeration, but there was a long thread this offseason with posters open to the idea of trading him thinking he would hold out.

Trading Gilmore for a 1st or 2nd is not a dump IMO. Screaming and dumping are both exaggerations? He is aging so his best years are behind him - remember the year after Revis left us, it was like Revis fell off a cliff. Getting older and coming off a major soft tissue injury is significant and reasonably concerning, not screaming.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

Trading Gilmore for a 1st or 2nd is not a dump IMO. Screaming and dumping are both exaggerations? He is aging so his best years are behind him - remember the year after Revis left us, it was like Revis fell off a cliff. Getting older and coming off a major soft tissue injury is significant and reasonably concerning, not screaming.

There we go.

This is why he's harping on this over and over, because he would have been on the trade-gilmore camp in the 9page Extend-Gilmore thread from a month ago that he can't find for himself.

.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

Jackson is starting to emerge, I think, as a solid backup outside corner (Michael, not JC, who looks great).

It's incredible to have Gilmore, JC , and Jones , this is the best CB group in the league. If one of them could possibly play FS when Devin retires, and keep Gilmore somehow, this secondary could be great for a long long time.

 

[Uptown]

Jones is terrific in the slot. Different look if Gilmore or Jackson goes down. Can’t have everything of course. I think BB will have his eyes open for another CB with size to replace what we hoped Joejuan would be.

Not sure how well he fits into our scheme, but CB Quinton Dunbar was released the other day. IIRC, he was/is solid/above average on the boundary.

 

[captain stone]

I'd be curious historically since about 2010 or so those same rankings. The reason being I am in the camp that CB position is the 2d or 3d highest allotment considered for the Patriots in terms of how much they will spend per position (money, scouting, time, effort, etc). From Revis/Browner to Gilmore/Jackson/Jones that is the current position I think the Patriots knowingly expend significant blood and treasure TRY and "get" a or the top guy in the league.

Given the league-wide offensive changes protecting the QB and WRs, and unlike a DE/sack artist that is really easily "schemed out" as a threat, the CB has the biggest potential impact and elevation of the rest of the defense as a unit in today's pass happy league. If you have that (at least) one shut down CB, it, more than any other position except QB, allows superior ability to shape the opposing team's approach and change the way they play.

If I was ever a GM (no interest...seriously...only weathermen are held to a higher standard with a worse accuracy rate in the guessing game of telling the future) after QB that's where I'd concentrate in today's NFL as the second priority - the CB.

I don't disagree... But then why hasn't Bill drafted another CB for the pipeline since SloJuan? And Kenny Webster does Not count.

The lack of a young CB1 of the Future - and Jalen Mills' suckiness - has given Gilmore most of the leverage in his contract standoff with Bill.

 

[captain stone]

And I'm not as sold on Mike Jackson's performance as most people seem to be... I'd really like to see another vet Outside guy added before Week 1 if the overall situation doesn't improve...

 

[mgteich]

It's incredible to have Gilmore, JC , and Jones , this is the best CB group in the league. If one of them could possibly play FS when Devin retires, and keep Gilmore somehow, this secondary could be great for a long long time.

So, we have 3 starting corners. Your solution to McCourty leaving is to create a hole and have one of them move to safety???

I would expect us to have Mills or Williams or a draftee or an acquisition at free safety.

I would be ecstatic if we keep the best set of 3 starting corners in the league at corner.

 

[mgteich]

Trading Gilmore for a 1st or 2nd is not a dump IMO. Screaming and dumping are both exaggerations? He is aging so his best years are behind him - remember the year after Revis left us, it was like Revis fell off a cliff. Getting older and coming off a major soft tissue injury is significant and reasonably concerning, not screaming.

I strongly disagree. Trading Gilmore for a 2nd would be a definite dump when we could have had him play in 2021 and still could possibly trade or franchise him after the season, or at very worst have a 2023 3rd rounder (in addition to him playing in 2021).

 

[DropKickFlutie]

So, we have 3 starting corners. Your solution to McCourty leaving is to create a hole and have one of them move to safety???

I would expect us to have Mills or Williams or a draftee or an acquisition at free safety.

I would be ecstatic if we keep the best set of 3 starting corners in the league at corner.

No I mean in the future once Devin retires.

 

[PScottman]

I don't disagree... But then why hasn't Bill drafted another CB for the pipeline since SloJuan? And Kenny Webster does Not count.

The lack of a young CB1 of the Future - and Jalen Mills' suckiness - has given Gilmore most of the leverage in his contract standoff with Bill.

As I've said in the past - I don't think Belichick built/builds his core specifically via the draft. Full stop.

He seems the pragmatist looking at what he can control - and data is one of those things. With the vastly superior data of veterans in terms of their abilities specifically at the NFL level, the ROI is imminently more of a sure thing. His success rate of veteran signings is vastly superior to his drafting demonstrating that.

Doesn't mean he doesnt draft some guys to get that same ROI and core via the draft (he absolutely will (and has) re-sign some of those guys he develops!), but those tend be #1) high picks (i.e. top ten or fifteen) and #2) more often than not defenders.

He also is VERY specific in what he values - both in terms of the player and how they might fit in the Patriots' culture. Maybe those fits weren't available in those drafts at the pick value level he placed on them? Should he just pick guys that aren't good fits for that culture? We see around here how well the cultural differences mesh (the Brady vs BB arguments) even in an unstructured environment.

In short however - he doesnt approach it the way you do.


Or as the 90s slogan went -
Why ask why? Try Bud Dry.

 

[Ring 6]

I don't disagree... But then why hasn't Bill drafted another CB for the pipeline since SloJuan? And Kenny Webster does Not count.

The lack of a young CB1 of the Future - and Jalen Mills' suckiness - has given Gilmore most of the leverage in his contract standoff with Bill.

Because you can’t draft a high round player at every position every year.

 

[captain stone]

Because you can’t draft a high round player at every position every year.

He can be a Day 3 pick too...

 

[Ring 6]

He can be a Day 3 pick too...

Then he wouldn’t be a “young cb1 of the future”.

 

[JMC00]

 

[Joey007]

Wow. I didn’t realize the players thought so highly of JC.

 

[slash83]

Hoping Gilmore is back soon, wonder if a pay raise will get him back on the field sooner.