Pats considering Butler trade to Saints for Brandin Cooks

[AtomicDawg]

They're giving away too much for cooks. That's my point. This ain't randy moss in his prime.

Is cooks that much better than butler? Butler has made big plays for this team.

Don't be ridiculous dude. NO ONE is Randy Moss in his prime. Period.

 

[Pats1989]

BB will be crucified if this happens. No number two CB ( Ryan leaving).

 

[shmessy]

Well not every team has nearly yearly intramural scrimmages with the Patrs where NE coaches can get an eyeful of their young talent.

And only one team in the NFL has Bradin Cooks on the trade block.

Who else should the Patriots be talking to if they are looking to unload Butler for a crucial piece?

unoriginal, my post was in RESPONSE to your post saying the Pats were trying to "Patriots are putting pressure on Butler to re-up."

Pray-tell, what kind of pressure would Butler feel going closer to home? Do you think he would miss the winters? The Red Sox? Lobster season? He loves Governor Baker?

I'll put pressure on my kids to no goof off this afternoon - - otherwise I will make them eat ice cream sundaes!

????

.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I don't feel optimistic in either Amendola or Hogan in that position. Amendola will not hold up over a full year, Hogan hasn't demonstrated that skillset. The Buffalo passing offense was much more vertical than what the Pats run, and Hogan has been used mostly as a vertical threat here.

Thats kinda my point. I dont think the Patriots have a 100% full time slot guy anymore and no longer beholden to that position being the end all be all to success in this offense. Instead, they have WRs , RBs and TEs who run some of the routes that the traditional slot receiver does here. I agree DA has a year left. Hogan is more of an intermediate threat and not an underneath guy.

I kinda view Cooks as able to do all of it and not just the slot. I see MM as an intermediate guy.

 

[Uptown]

Not going to be happy if our top chef trades a great butler for a cook.

YOU MY FRIEND ARE A WINNER...!

 

[unoriginal]

unoriginal, my post was in RESPONSE to your post saying the Pats were trying to "Patriots are putting pressure on Butler to re-up."

Pray-tell, what kind of pressure would Butler feel going closer to home? Do you think he would miss the winters? The Red Sox? Lobster season? He loves Governor Baker?

I'll put pressure on my kids to no goof off this afternoon - - otherwise I will make them eat ice cream sundaes!

????

.

If you give them 30 seconds to make a decision you've put pressure on them to make a decision. You're reading it like I said the Patriots are trying to corner Butler into one decision or the other. They just want him to make a decision now. Then they will do what is best for the team after Butler has done what is best for himself.

As other posters have made explicit, quoting Michael Lombardi, Butler doesn't actually have to decide now. He has till April 22nd to sign that tender. This story is leaking because the Patriots are pressuring Butler to make a decision instead of waiting.

OTHERWISE he won't be traded to New Orleans, and he probably won't be part of NE's plans going forward at all.

EDIT: You know, it may well have sounded like that due to the emphasis in my first sentence. My apologizes for the misunderstanding, but I had to start my train of thought somewhere.

In fairness my thought did end with:

The Patriots are telling him he must make his decsion today, they aren't going to go with a holdout or a 1-year rental, if they can get a longer term asset in exchange.

 

[IllegalContact]

why can't we pay both. Gronk is cheap next year, Brady is taking a lot less money, our D-Line is cheap and we have a good amount of picks (in addition to possible more with the Jimmy G trade)

maybe cuz they should spend it on hightower first

paying 2 #1 CBs is not sound cap management

 

[luuked]

Nope. Both @Miguel and Mike Lombardi say Butler can't be traded until he signs some sort of contract with NE.

So Butler would work out a deal with NO, then he'd sign the NE tender, be traded to NO, then rip up the tender contract and sign the agreed-to deal.

That's what I said. No clue why you are quoting me and saying no.

The Saints will have to deal with the RFA tender. Obviously we can't trade him until he actually signs it but afterwards he will still be a restricted FA that could theoretically be signed away by another team until he actually signs an extension with the Saints.

 

[unoriginal]

Thats kinda my point. I dont think the Patriots have a 100% full time slot guy anymore and no longer beholden to that position being the end all be all to success in this offense. Instead, they have WRs , RBs and TEs who run some of the routes that the traditional slot receiver does here. I agree DA has a year left. Hogan is more of an intermediate threat and not an underneath guy.

I kinda view Cooks as able to do all of it and not just the slot. I see MM as an intermediate guy.

It's a good point and you are right I was being simplistic.

However: all of that is complimentary to having what you call an "underneath guy" and what I rather lazily called the slot receiver. Cooks by all accounts can stress defenses no matter who is matched up on him horizontally (and vertically). The people we have on this team can only do that if they have a matchup advantage (LB on a RB in the slot, TE/WR on a S, etc.)

Edelman (and Cooks) beat slot CBs.

This offense needs at base that guy who beats the best defender, beats him horizontally, and beats him quickly. Then he draws the doubleteam, and the offense opens up for matchup advantages elsewhere.

 

[NG Pats Fan]

That's what I said. No clue why you are quoting me and saying no.

The Saints will have to deal with the RFA tender. Obviously we can't trade him until he actually signs it but afterwards he will still be a restricted FA that could theoretically be signed away by another team until he actually signs an extension with the Saints.

What do you think of Gilmore deal? 14 million per year?

 

[bbobbo]

Like with Gilmore, why not just extend Butler who has been a soldier for you? Why trade Butler away and pay an outsider? Gilmore is a pretty good corner, but I don't think he's better than Butler... I still need to read the Gilmore thread and find out what we paid him... maybe Butler wants Revis money or something

i wrote this in the gilmore thread:

so the (hypothetical) options are:

1) butler for 5 years @ $14m/year

2) gilmore for 5 years @ $14m/year + butler for 1 year @ $3.9m + possible compensatory pick when butler leaves in free agency

3) gilmore for 5 years @ $14m/year + 1st-round pick if butler gets signed to another team

and if the butler/cooks trade goes through

4) gilmore for 5 years @ $14m/year + cooks for 2 years @ ~$4.6m/year + possible compensatory pick when cooks leaves in free agency

i think it's a no-brainer that you would do the gilmore deal even if you liked butler better, because there's no way to match the additional extras you get with the gilmore deal.

 

[PatriotsPimp136]

Are they just looking at cooks? Why not see if maybe the eagles are interested in a guy like butler. I heard they where looking to move jordan matthews.

 

[QuantumMechanic]

That's what I said. No clue why you are quoting me and saying no.

The Saints will have to deal with the RFA tender. Obviously we can't trade him until he actually signs it but afterwards he will still be a restricted FA that could theoretically be signed away by another team until he actually signs an extension with the Saints.

No, he will not be an RFA. To be any type of free agent, even an RFA, you have to not be under contract. Once he signs NE's tender he is under contract to NE and cannot be signed by anyone else unless NE releases him or trades him.

 

[BobDigital]

Butler not signing his tender is making this trade less likley. I think the Saints rightly want this done today. If Butler doesn't sign the Pats can't do it.

If the happens the Pats will hope to hope for someone to pick up the tender if they want to get value for him this year.

Personally I am fine having him on a 1 year deal for fairly cheap. Him Gilmore and Rowe? Good luck passing on us. That would make our D better than last year without doing anything else to big.

 

[patsbrasilpatriotas]

BB will be crucified if this happens. No number two CB ( Ryan leaving).

Draft one

 

[catent]

Right. So if a team pays Butler 30 million a year, that's worth it?

You'll have to be a bit more specific than "that's worth it". What do you mean by this?

Is it a financially intelligent investment on behalf of a team itself, to dump a lot of money into Butler? I suppose I'll leave that to smarter minds than mine.

Your initial post, however, stated specifically that *Butler* isn't worth some hypothetical, large sum of money -- and that simply isn't true. He's worth as much as a team is willing to pay him.

 

[manxman2601]

Don't know how much stock to put in this, especially the last part

 

[luuked]

No, he will not be an RFA. To be any type of free agent, even an RFA, you have to not be under contract. Once he signs NE's tender he is under contract to NE and cannot be signed by anyone else unless NE releases him or trades him.

As an RFA he can be signed to an offer sheet by another team. And the Pats (or the Saints) would have the right to match. Obviously, if the trade happens the Saints would want Butler to first agree to an extension so it doesn't even come to this but technically that's how it is. Isn't it ?

 

[bbobbo]

Butler not signing his tender is making this trade less likley. I think the Saints rightly want this done today. If Butler doesn't sign the Pats can't do it.

If the Happens the Pats will hope to hope for someone to pick up the tender if they want to get value for him.

even if no one picks up the tender, $3.91m for another year of butler's services is a good deal for the patriots.
.

 

[AtomicDawg]

Don't know how much stock to put in this, especially the last part

This makes it even more jarring to me.