Patriots Have Called on Jeudy

[TinhWoodhead]

OT: why is the Alabama mens basketball has a pic of the football team in the headline??

 

[PatsFan2]

OT: why is the Alabama mens basketball has a pic of the football team in the headline??

Motivation.

 

[Love The Drake]

Exactly. There’s no reason to trade 14 for one cheap year of Jeudy when you could use 14 yourself on a really good receiver and get four cheap years out of him. Maybe Jeudy is a little better than whoever that player is (unknown) but he’s not 3 years of rookie deal better.

Nkeal Harry, Aaron Dobson, Bethel Johnson, Taylor PrIce all day hi,
I know only Barry was first round but you see how no matter who to blame our receivers have come out.

 

[Ollie]

Nkeal Harry, Aaron Dobson, Bethel Johnson, Taylor PrIce all day hi,
I know only Barry was first round but you see how no matter who to blame our receivers have come out.

The point was that picking at 14 in the first round gets you a much better prospect than picking late 20's early 30s so giving up a a 14 for Jeudy when you only haver him one year on a cheap deal isn't as good as you think

 

[Ross12]

Nkeal Harry, Aaron Dobson, Bethel Johnson, Taylor PrIce all day hi,
I know only Barry was first round but you see how no matter who to blame our receivers have come out.

Go look at where Harry, Dobson, Johnson and Price were selected compared to #14.

 

[signbabybrady]

Nkeal Harry, Aaron Dobson, Bethel Johnson, Taylor PrIce all day hi,
I know only Barry was first round but you see how no matter who to blame our receivers have come out.

So give up? If you want an impact receiver this year you can pay huge prices on free agent market, you can overpay in a trade probably still have to shell out big money and your getting some one who's team is moving on, or you take the risk and try WR in the draft again.

Personally I want oline or dline at 14 but this WR market has me rethinking things. If it's between overpaying for Juedy or taking one at 14 I think I'm starting lean towards draft.

 

[patman52]

Sure they do. All the time. Ever heard of Kony Ealy? Moore will flame out - dude sucks.

all the time? And you go back 7 seasons ago to find a comp.

 

[50-yard-line]

So give up? If you want an impact receiver this year you can pay huge prices on free agent market,

There were NO impact receivers in this FA class. The highest rated was Meyers, probably the best-tooled WR out there was Juju. OBJ is a wild card, given his age and injuries of late. Personally, I think the Pats likely scored the most impactful WR in FA (with all due respect to Jakobi) in JJSS. Maybe a Lazard or someone (Davis? Chark? Hardman?) will break out, but to date, no one else out there stands above those two.

you can overpay in a trade probably still have to shell out big money and your getting some one who's team is moving on,

Doesn't look like that's happening much since the huge risks taken on trading for Brown, Hill, and the huge contracts handed to others like Deebo. Rarified air - there aren't many at that level in the NFL. Teams seem to be walking away from the overpays - Cooks was had more as a salary dump than a draft capital trade, reports are that the market dried up for Hopkins, and Jeudy hasn't had a nibble on that 1st-round demand - and especially after the Cooks trade, I doubt Denver will get anywhere near that.

or you take the risk and try WR in the draft again.

WRs are generally too hit/miss and the risk is huge. Worse, this year, who? Addison, JSN, and Johnston all have warts, big warts, Someone will grab at them, sure, but I don't see a first-round grade on ANYONE coming out this year.

Personally I want oline or dline at 14 but this WR market has me rethinking things. If it's between overpaying for Juedy or taking one at 14 I think I'm starting lean towards draft.

Hoping for one of the big CBs, or a trade back that nets an OT and maybe a BPA (Darnell Washington would be a nice get, as there's few in the league in that true in-line TE role).

 

[40yrpatsfan]

We have roughly equal need at OL, WR, and CB - assuming we move an existing corner to free safety. I doubt we satisfy any of these with remaining FA's - certainly possible but let's assume not.

Our top 3 picks are 14, 46, and 76 (plus three 4ths and four 6th's). The draft pool seems pretty deep at all 3 positions, and by just staying put we should fill two of those needs at 14 and 46. But in order to get 3 picks in the first 2 rounds, maybe we could trade with Seattle:
- in round 1, we trade down from 14 to 20
- in return we get their 2nd rounder #52
- we're then picking at 20, 46, and 52. We go CB, OT, and WR with those 3

 

[rabidfireweasel]

Nkeal Harry, Aaron Dobson, Bethel Johnson, Taylor PrIce all day hi,
I know only Barry was first round but you see how no matter who to blame our receivers have come out.

I like you Zappe, but this is a sad, sad post.
The “super amazing drafting” Eagles drafted Jalen Reagor in the first before Justin Jefferson. They also drafted Agholor in the first. Mistakes happen at WR in the draft all the time.

Bethel Johnson was drafted 20 years ago at pick 45. Taylor Price, more than 10 years ago in the late 3rd round at pick 90. Aaron Dobson, a decade ago, at pick 59.

Here is a list of guys picked at 59 in the years after Dobson
2014 Jack Mewhort
2015 Ty Sambrailo
2016 Roberto Aguayo (a kicker)
2017 Tano Kpassagnon
2018 Derrius Guice (5 career games)
2019 Parris Campbell (under 1000 career receiving yards and 5 TDS)
2020 Denzel Mimms (under 700 career receiving yards and 0 TD’s)
2021 Terrance Marshall Jr (628 career receiving yards and 1 TD)
2022 Ed Engram G - probably the best pick of the decade.

Most picks at 59 are a bust. End of story. You are like the older parent who is still complaining about what their 35 year old adult offspring did as a teenager or on spring break in college. You have to move on, instead of being rankled by poor picks in the 50’s a decade ago and picks in the 90’s more than a decade ago.

 

[hornetfb85]

We have roughly equal need at OL, WR, and CB - assuming we move an existing corner to free safety. I doubt we satisfy any of these with remaining FA's - certainly possible but let's assume not.

Our top 3 picks are 14, 46, and 76 (plus three 4ths and four 6th's). The draft pool seems pretty deep at all 3 positions, and by just staying put we should fill two of those needs at 14 and 46. But in order to get 3 picks in the first 2 rounds, maybe we could trade with Seattle:
- in round 1, we trade down from 14 to 20
- in return we get their 2nd rounder #52
- we're then picking at 20, 46, and 52. We go CB, OT, and WR with those 3

Like the plan, but I’d rather stay at 14 and take the best OT, CB or WR. Then use one of the 4ths with 76 and move up to get one of your targets. I’d probably use another 4th and the 46 to move up to secure an OT if we don’t draft one at 14.

 

[archstanton543]

I like you Zappe, but this is a sad, sad post.
The “super amazing drafting” Eagles drafted Jalen Reagor in the first before Justin Jefferson. They also drafted Agholor in the first. Mistakes happen at WR in the draft all the time.

Bethel Johnson was drafted 20 years ago at pick 45. Taylor Price, more than 10 years ago in the late 3rd round at pick 90. Aaron Dobson, a decade ago, at pick 59.

Here is a list of guys picked at 59 in the years after Dobson
2014 Jack Mewhort
2015 Ty Sambrailo
2016 Roberto Aguayo (a kicker)
2017 Tano Kpassagnon
2018 Derrius Guice (5 career games)
2019 Parris Campbell (under 1000 career receiving yards and 5 TDS)
2020 Denzel Mimms (under 700 career receiving yards and 0 TD’s)
2021 Terrance Marshall Jr (628 career receiving yards and 1 TD)
2022 Ed Engram G - probably the best pick of the decade.

Most picks at 59 are a bust. End of story. You are like the older parent who is still complaining about what their 35 year old adult offspring did as a teenager or on spring break in college. You have to move on, instead of being rankled by poor picks in the 50’s a decade ago and picks in the 90’s more than a decade ago.

I could accept this argument if the Pats didn't have the same coach/GM as 10 and 20 years ago but it's the same guy and he still has the same problem identifying WR's in the draft.

 

[Love The Drake]

I like you Zappe, but this is a sad, sad post.
The “super amazing drafting” Eagles drafted Jalen Reagor in the first before Justin Jefferson. They also drafted Agholor in the first. Mistakes happen at WR in the draft all the time.

Bethel Johnson was drafted 20 years ago at pick 45. Taylor Price, more than 10 years ago in the late 3rd round at pick 90. Aaron Dobson, a decade ago, at pick 59.

Here is a list of guys picked at 59 in the years after Dobson
2014 Jack Mewhort
2015 Ty Sambrailo
2016 Roberto Aguayo (a kicker)
2017 Tano Kpassagnon
2018 Derrius Guice (5 career games)
2019 Parris Campbell (under 1000 career receiving yards and 5 TDS)
2020 Denzel Mimms (under 700 career receiving yards and 0 TD’s)
2021 Terrance Marshall Jr (628 career receiving yards and 1 TD)
2022 Ed Engram G - probably the best pick of the decade.

Most picks at 59 are a bust. End of story. You are like the older parent who is still complaining about what their 35 year old adult offspring did as a teenager or on spring break in college. You have to move on, instead of being rankled by poor picks in the 50’s a decade ago and picks in the 90’s more than a decade ago.

I’m not saying this to say we are the only team who can’t draft WRs.
My point is my response was to our friend Ross who said the WR we take at 14 would be better value. Because they are on a controllable cap friendly rookie deal for 4 years.
He went on to say that the WR we could take at 14 may not be as good as Jeudy but it would be close and that with the cap friendly rookie deal thats better use of our resources.
My point is yes if you can guarantee that WR is at least 90 percent of what Jeudy could be that would be true. However we can’t guarantee that so taking a WR at 14 is a much bigger risk with a high percentage chance of being a bad pick added to our wr drafting woes.
The verdict isn’t out on Thornton yet I am hopeful.

 

[50-yard-line]

We have roughly equal need at OL, WR, and CB - assuming we move an existing corner to free safety. I doubt we satisfy any of these with remaining FA's - certainly possible but let's assume not.

Strong disagree. We have JJSS, Bourne, Parker, and Thornton - and now Gesicki, who's really a tall slot. If the Pats want to add another body, they should grab Corey Davis. That is not a terrible WR corp - all but Thornton are proven NFL-level talents. They should always be putting developmental WRs and TEs (would love a true in-line guy) in the pool, but it's not a glaring need right now.

I see no one as an obvious upgrade in the draft. Do you?
The most obvious picks would be OT or CB.

Our top 3 picks are 14, 46, and 76 (plus three 4ths and four 6th's). The draft pool seems pretty deep at all 3 positions, and by just staying put we should fill two of those needs at 14 and 46. But in order to get 3 picks in the first 2 rounds, maybe we could trade with Seattle:
- in round 1, we trade down from 14 to 20
- in return we get their 2nd rounder #52
- we're then picking at 20, 46, and 52. We go CB, OT, and WR with those 3

I think they will trade up into 2 or 3, maybe down from 14. I am also of the opinion that this year's WR class isn't very deep or very good. Certainly nothing like 2019. I wouldn't be surprised at all if the best WRs from this class wind up coming out of rounds 3 or 4.

 

[Real fan 02]

I'm in on Jerry Jeudy. Looked at his Denver game films. I'm in. Like him more for our Offense then Hopkins.

I'd be very upset with my team if we don't attain another impact WR.. Jeudy is everything you'd want to have going forward in a young play maker..

Yeah the draft is nice but what are the odds?.. 24 years old experienced, great team player.. I'm in on juedy all day..

 

[upstater]

Nkeal Harry, Aaron Dobson, Bethel Johnson, Taylor PrIce all day hi,
I know only Barry was first round but you see how no matter who to blame our receivers have come out.

You’re going back 23 years. No one else has that many busts because no one else has been around that long. I’ve said this in the past but over a span of 10 years, the Patriots spent exactly ONE pick in the first 3 rounds on a WR. It was Dobson. This is the 10 yrs prior to Harry. You’re not going to find WRs if you don’t spend resources. That being said, the Patriots record is not good but when you factor in the hits (Givens, Branch, Edelman, Mitchell) and compare it to all the busts from the meager resources expended, the % is not far off the league wide average of 33%. This doesn’t account for all the picks we traded for Moss, Welker, Sanu, Antonio Brown, Brandon Cooks. So the Patriots are not good at picking WRs but the bigger problem IMO is not spending a lot of picks on WRs. A lot of these teams with excellent WRs have also had a lot of busts. Looking back to Harry’s draft class, only 2 of the 9 taken in the 1st 2 rounds are with the teams that picked them. 4 of the 9 have turned out well (counting the 2 Browns who were traded) while the other 5 were busts. That’s par for the course in the NFL. A 40% hit rate in the 1st 2 rounds drops to 25% in the latter rounds.

 

[JMC00]

Bethel Johnson was drafted 20 years ago at pick 45. Taylor Price, more than 10 years ago in the late 3rd round at pick 90. Aaron Dobson, a decade ago, at pick 59.

Pats and drafting WRs is such an overblown thing since they barely spent heavy draft capital

2011- 0
2012- 7th rnd
2013- 2nd & 4th (traded out of the 1st after Hopkins was taken)
2014- 7th
2015- 0
2016- 4th (helped win a SB, was promising but a knee injury ruined his career) & 7th
2017- 0
2018- 6th
2019- 1st
2020- 0
2021- 7th
2022- 2nd


They've picked 9 WRs in the last 12 drafts, only 2 WRs in the draft that were earlier than the 4th round and 1 of them was Thornton who is still an unknown since he had such a terrible OC last year, so we really gotta see how he does with O'Brien as OC.

And the Eagles as an example are not very good look at them trying to hit on WRs since 2014

2014- Jordan Matthews in the 2nd rnd & Josh Huff in the 3rd
2015- Nelson Agholor at 20
2017- Mack Hollins 4th rnd
2019- JJ Arcega-Whiteside 3rd rnd
2020- Jalen Reagor 21
2021- Devonta Smith 10



It took the Eagles 11 years to finally hit on a WR (and they needed a top 10 pick to do it) after they had hit on Maclin in '09 (used a 1st on him) and Jackson in '08 (used a 2nd on him)

6 attempts at WR in the 3rd or higher for the Eagles. (3 attempts from 21st or higher) Meanwhile in the same time frame (since '14) Pats had only 2 attempts from the 3rd rnd or higher none above the last pick in the 1st

And like you said they could have had Justin Jefferson and picked Reagor. Vikings were actually stunlocked that Jefferson wasn't taken and fell to them.

 

[50-yard-line]

I'd be very upset with my team if we don't attain another impact WR.. Jeudy is everything you'd want to have going forward in a young play maker..

Yeah the draft is nice but what are the odds?.. 24 years old experienced, great team player.. I'm in on juedy all day..

I like Jeudy's highlights, but what is it about him that people think will separate him from, say, a Corey Davis?
He's younger, so there is potential, but where is he shown to be a cut above the 2021 FA class? Davis, Golloday, Samuel, Agholor all had equal or superior physical attributes. Jeudy's production has been good, similar to Davis and Golloday, better than Agholor (pre-Raiders) and Samuel (overpaid for his speed).
Don't get me wrong: I want him here. I like his film and he seems to play fast. I'm just trying to see what people see in him that would warrant a low 1st in a trade, let alone pick 14. I might do pick 46 for him - MAYBE.

 

[Real fan 02]

I like Jeudy's highlights, but what is it about him that people think will separate him from, say, a Corey Davis?
He's younger, so there is potential, but where is he shown to be a cut above the 2021 FA class? Davis, Golloday, Samuel, Agholor all had equal or superior physical attributes. Jeudy's production has been good, similar to Davis and Golloday, better than Agholor (pre-Raiders) and Samuel (overpaid for his speed).
Don't get me wrong: I want him here. I like his film and he seems to play fast. I'm just trying to see what people see in him that would warrant a low 1st in a trade, let alone pick 14. I might do pick 46 for him - MAYBE.

Great question, And I'm glad you asked and brought up the particulars. I'd say this I like Corey Davis alot and it appears he hasn't been released yet. ( I'm hoping he would be) knock on him has been injured alot. With juedy all the elements you would want for him to be successful as a patriots player are there.

He works hard, has a relationship with Mac, he's young, he actually fights for the ball he's from what I hear a team leader in the locker room he is accountable and didn't complain one bit on the offensive woes last season. Don't know that I'd do a 1st round pick.. I absolutely consider a 2nd for him definitely

 

[40yrpatsfan]

Strong disagree. We have JJSS, Bourne, Parker, and Thornton - and now Gesicki, who's really a tall slot. If the Pats want to add another body, they should grab Corey Davis. That is not a terrible WR corp - all but Thornton are proven NFL-level talents. They should always be putting developmental WRs and TEs (would love a true in-line guy) in the pool, but it's not a glaring need right now.

I see no one as an obvious upgrade in the draft. Do you?
The most obvious picks would be OT or CB.

I think they will trade up into 2 or 3, maybe down from 14. I am also of the opinion that this year's WR class isn't very deep or very good. Certainly nothing like 2019. I wouldn't be surprised at all if the best WRs from this class wind up coming out of rounds 3 or 4.

Not sure what you're disagreeing about, I feel OK about all 3 of these positions as they stand today: WR-OT-CB. They all could be better, but they're all as good or better than last year. No crises anywhere, we even picked up a punter. I guess CB/Safety is a concern cause we lost DMac, but there's a lot of depth there. WR/weapons are pretty solid. OT has good depth now. I think the team can take the best prospect available regardless of position, which is where you want to be going into the draft. I expect our first 3 choices to be at those positions, but you never know who might slip or whether Bill thinks we need a LB the most.