Owners including Kraft must turn over all cell phone records

[varjao]

If a 1-10 record reflects badly on him, than you have to work it the other way as well. 2012 and 2013 he was 17-6-1 in the regular season and 4-2 postseason including a very competitive SB appearance. It works both ways.

It might just be possible that losing a good coach and replacing him with Jim freaking Tomsula and the Chip Kelly might just possibly have been a more important factor.

As I've said before, I don't think he's great, but he's certainly way better than some of the clowns who have jobs in the league right now, and in the right system I expect he'd win his fair share of games.

Exactly, not to long ago he lead his team with authority to a SB (which many other talented guys never achieve) and playoffs in the next year through some great performances. Matt Cassel is still employed for what he did in freaking 2008.

As long as Matt Cassel and Drew Stantons of life are in this league he does have a case.

And I believe some of those injuries during the Chip Kelly tenure in SF were fake just to sit his ass on the bench until he couldn't anymore because Blaine Gabbert couldnt pass a 5 yards pass with accuracy. Impossible to prove though or he would have thrown the **** in the fan already.

I hope they find some dirty **** in some owners cell phones, this ****ing mafia.

 

[Clonamery]

Marty Schottenheimer was 14-2 as head coach of San Diego when he was fired in 2006. San Diego never again equaled that record and Marty never saw a head coaching job again. But ... he didn't sue the NFL over collusion.

No, but his son kept working. Maybe be it was ageism. Ask Tom Coughlin.

 

[patfanken]

Kapernick was a very good QB when he first entered the league
He did very well (1 superbowl appearance where he excelled in a loss, and one NFCCG where he also did well in a loss) He was fortunate to be developed in an offense that specifically suited his skill set. There is no question that when NFL defenses started to catch up to that offense he didn't respond and adapt. It is also true that during the same time his performance declined, so too did the rest of the SF organization declined too.

There is no question that his skill level, even during his last year with SF qualifies him to be among the 90 odd QB jobs that exist in the NFL. So I ask a few questions to to those wh.o would keep him from working strictly for his political beliefs.

Has there ever been a quote from Kapernick where he ruled out any job because he he wouldn't be guaranteed a starting position. I cant recall any, but its been used several times in this tread.

I recognize that Kapernick's skills aren't a good mix for certain offensive systems, like the one we have here in NE. But there ARE several where his skill set could be of value. Seattle, Carolina, and Houston to name 3 of the top of my head, would all be better teams with Kapernick on the roster, as well as Buffalo, the Jets, and Browns.

BTW- it should also be noted that the read- option offense that he did so well with, has had a bit of a resurgence around the league. (ie KC, Houston).

BOTTOM LINE- Colin Kapernick was never a good fit (schematically) with the Pats. So I doubt he was even a conversation over the past 9 months. However, there is no doubt that he SHOULD have been a serious consideration on several teams.

That being said, I find it repugnant that anyone can be kept from working simply because you don't like his peaceful political opinion. If it can be done to Kapernick then it can be done to everyone else. I don't look forward to an America where you have have to give up your right to an opinion in order to get a job. But the truth is that THAT is what we are gradually moving toward.

 

[Ring 6]

They indicate that the team might just possibly have had other, worse problems than the QB who was good enough to take them to the Super Bowl a few years earlier.

No they don’t.

 

[neuronet]

There is no way this stands.

 

[YOUGOTMOSSED]

So let me get this straight, a guy with a 1-10 record as a starting quarterback LAST YEAR is suing the NFL because he is believes his unemployment is due to reasons outside of his playing abilities?

The 1-10 record was clearly a result of institutionalized racism, white privilege, and the patriarchy. . . DUH!

 

[rochrist]

No they don’t.

Yes. They do.

 

[Simpelton]

No they don’t.

Yes they do, that 49ers team was a trainwreck. Good quarterbacks can languish on bad teams, Exhibit A rocks the leaderboards for individual performance year in year out in New Orleans. No one's denying that Drew Brees is a good quarterback despite the team he has around him and the fact that he's spent most of his career dragging his team to just-barely-over-.500 every year.

Brees is better than Kaepernick no doubt, but the point is, the team around you matters. By all rights Brees should be competing for Superbowls more often than not, if it came down to his own skill, but New Orleans doesn't know how to build a defense so he's only gotten to the big show as many times as Kaepernick has.

 

[Ring 6]

Kapernick was a very good QB when he first entered the league
He did very well (1 superbowl appearance where he excelled in a loss, and one NFCCG where he also did well in a loss) He was fortunate to be developed in an offense that specifically suited his skill set. There is no question that when NFL defenses started to catch up to that offense he didn't respond and adapt. It is also true that during the same time his performance declined, so too did the rest of the SF organization declined too.

There is no question that his skill level, even during his last year with SF qualifies him to be among the 90 odd QB jobs that exist in the NFL. So I ask a few questions to to those wh.o would keep him from working strictly for his political beliefs.

Has there ever been a quote from Kapernick where he ruled out any job because he he wouldn't be guaranteed a starting position. I cant recall any, but its been used several times in this tread.

I recognize that Kapernick's skills aren't a good mix for certain offensive systems, like the one we have here in NE. But there ARE several where his skill set could be of value. Seattle, Carolina, and Houston to name 3 of the top of my head, would all be better teams with Kapernick on the roster, as well as Buffalo, the Jets, and Browns.

BTW- it should also be noted that the read- option offense that he did so well with, has had a bit of a resurgence around the league. (ie KC, Houston).

BOTTOM LINE- Colin Kapernick was never a good fit (schematically) with the Pats. So I doubt he was even a conversation over the past 9 months. However, there is no doubt that he SHOULD have been a serious consideration on several teams.

That being said, I find it repugnant that anyone can be kept from working simply because you don't like his peaceful political opinion. If it can be done to Kapernick then it can be done to everyone else. I don't look forward to an America where you have have to give up your right to an opinion in order to get a job. But the truth is that THAT is what we are gradually moving toward.

A lot to address here. I’ll try to be brief.
He was effective before his gimmick offense was figured out. He was horrendous last year.
Many, many, many people are terminated for bringing their politics and divisive beliefs into the workplace. There are no civil rights or amendments to the constitution that require employers to allow you to disrupt their business to protest something that has nothing at all to do with their business. This is a very reasonable grounds to not want to employ a person.
As a business owner in a community how would you feel if one of your most public employees chose to where pig police clothing in front of cameras? Do you not feel that this is detrimental to your standing with the community, your relationship with law enforcement, who by the way are required to protect the crowds that attend your events, and is something an employee has no right to do in your name?
It could be conceivable that he is better than some QBs currently on a roster but he is clearly not a developmental prospect and you aren’t going to win with him. The next guy in line is not appreciably worse on any team so why would you bring in a guy who thinks his job is his platform to draw attention to himself, to the detriment of your business and it’s relatuons with the community, a guy who seems disinterested in football, a guy who opted out his contract and cancelled a trade because he would have had to only make 7 mill, to gain little or nothing at best?

 

[Ring 6]

Yes they do, that 49ers team was a trainwreck. Good quarterbacks can languish on bad teams, Exhibit A rocks the leaderboards for individual performance year in year out in New Orleans. No one's denying that Drew Brees is a good quarterback despite the team he has around him and the fact that he's spent most of his career dragging his team to just-barely-over-.500 every year.

Brees is better than Kaepernick no doubt, but the point is, the team around you matters. By all rights Brees should be competing for Superbowls more often than not, if it came down to his own skill, but New Orleans doesn't know how to build a defense so he's only gotten to the big show as many times as Kaepernick has.

Have you seen krapernick play?
He is not good. Citing statistic that were mediocre and built while getting pummeled that gave no relation to the statistics he would put up in a real competitive situation running a real nfl offense is ignorant.
By your argument every qb who loses is really good because you think Brees is held back by his team when in reality he accumulate stats and isn’t good enough to carry his team and translate thise stats into wins.

 

[GaryfromTO]

Oh No.

Kraft might have to sit out for 4 games.

 

[Ring 6]

Yes. They do.

Have you seen him play?
The only thing good in his stats is a low amount of ints that help his qb rating. This was done with an offense that ran and threw short passes when behind. The low int rate is actually a product of the fact he sucks bevause kelly knew better than to let him throw the ball downfield. No qb is throwing a lot of picks in a system like that which won’t allow you to throw a risky pass even down 30

 

[GaryfromTO]

are they going after the CFL too? No team in that league has offered him a contract either.

 

[Bombdog]

If they find collusion they can void the CBA and then get ready for a long protracted work stoppage

 

[Ring 6]

Yes they do, that 49ers team was a trainwreck. Good quarterbacks can languish on bad teams, Exhibit A rocks the leaderboards for individual performance year in year out in New Orleans. No one's denying that Drew Brees is a good quarterback despite the team he has around him and the fact that he's spent most of his career dragging his team to just-barely-over-.500 every year.

Brees is better than Kaepernick no doubt, but the point is, the team around you matters. By all rights Brees should be competing for Superbowls more often than not, if it came down to his own skill, but New Orleans doesn't know how to build a defense so he's only gotten to the big show as many times as Kaepernick has.

You know what brees and krapernick habe in common?
Pretty much nothing.

New Orleans 2016 #1 pass offense in nfl
Sam Francisco 2016 #32 pass offense on nfl

 

[Ring 6]

If they find collusion they can void the CBA and then get ready for a long protracted work stoppage

Not really. Collusion against one player wouldn’t void the cba.

 

[Simpelton]

Have you seen krapernick play?
He is not good.

No. He is average. 18 teams in this league have average starters right around Kaepernick's skill level. They'll excell with a good roster around them and can't elevate a bad one. Just like Kaepernick.

I would say that Kaep compares roughly in terms of raw skill to Matt Cassell. Put a good coach and roster around Cassell and he can get you to the playoffs, he did it in KC and just missed here in New England. But he's not going to take a bad team and make it a good one like Tom Brady, like Payton Manning, or even second tier guys such as Brees, Wilson, Eli and Cousins, because he's not a great quarterback like Brady, or a good quarterback like Cousins, he's an average quarterback.

Citing statistic that were mediocre and built while getting pummeled that gave no relation to the statistics he would put up in a real competitive situation running a real nfl offense is ignorant.

I believe the most appropriate possible response to this statement is that it is indeed a statement, possibly even in the English language.

By your argument every qb who loses is really good

Really love to know how you managed to knit that strawman together out of anything I actually said.

because you think Brees is held back by his team when in reality he accumulate stats and isn’t good enough to carry his team and translate thise stats into wins.

Congratulations, another alleged example of the English language.

At the end of the day, you're arguing intangibles and using as evidence the fact that the team loses. You're arguing from the conclusion and not providing any actual support for your argument.

You're not drawing an actual connection between the quarterback and his team's performance.

You're not even actually drawing a connection to quarterback's own intangibles -- you know, the ones that actually help teams win more games than they otherwise might..

Hell you're not even actually making an argument, you're just piling a bunch of condescending assumptions and outright superstitions on each other that it looks like an argument, and hoping nobody notices the difference.

 

[Ring 6]

Yes. They do.

So let’s talk about those stats.
27th in scoring. But that’s thanks to gabbart because in his 5 starts they averaged 22.2 points but in krapernick they averaged 18.
32nd ranked passing offense. Yup worst in the nfl. No better with krapernick than gabbart.
31st ranked total offense (despite a starting rb who averaged 4.6 per carry)
Rankings
3rd down conversions 30th
Time of possession 32
First downs 30
Yards per play 30
Avg yards per pass 27
Passing first downs 31
20+ passing plays 31
4o+ passing plays 27

So which of these stats say he played well and wasn’t the reason they lost?

 

[PatsDeb]

To be clear, you believe that Kraft's emails will show that he encouraged other owners to sign Kaepernick?

No. I believe if they do a search of Bob Kraft's e-mails & texts for the name "Colin Kaepernick" it will say, "No results matching this search."

 

[NashuaPats]

The Texans just lost their starting QB for the season. It might make sense for Kap to be a player they'd look into. However, several days ago Kaepernick tweeted out an article calling Bob McNair a stupid, ignorant, racist. I know a lot of people were upset by McNair's comment, but spreading around information that would clearly be offensive to a potential employer is not a good way to get hired.

The Ravens owner expressed interest in hiring him and Kap's girlfriend then tweeted out an image comparing Biscotti to a particularly evil slave owner and Ray Lewis to an evil house slave. Kap didn't apologize for it and shockingly the Ravens lost interest in him.

I don't know how he can complain about not getting hired when he keeps tweeting such offensive things about his potential employers. He has tweeted or retweeted many other things slamming the team owners.

He has also tweeted out many things that would offend many people which would make up a high percentage of the NFL's customers. Personally, I don't like the NRA. There are lot of fair criticisms to be made about them. But recently he tweeted about them being a white supremacist organization. That's dumb and offensive to many people, many NFL fans, and probably some of his potential teammates. He essentially called Mike Vick an Uncle Tom by his Stockholm syndrome tweet. The guy is toxic and it goes beyond him taking a knee.