OT: Official 2020 Tompa Bay Gronkaneers Thread

[Joker]

Instead of dancing in the Tampa dirt perhaps we can go over the absolute gushing about unstoppable" Jumpy Behind The Back Passer!" Magomes on this board...the lead up to the Bowl was absolutely ridiculous with IDIOCY on a scale I have not witnessed in a half centruy. You can't "GAA GAA GOONY!!!!" about Mahomes 24/7 like little friggin' 8 year old girls and then, post obliteration of all your syrupy accolades, switch gears to "let's tear Tampa Bay apart!!!". No...let's deal with this abhorrent, misplaced hero worship aimed at Can't Spell Cat Lamarred Jackson, Jumpin' Underhand Tosser Maslomes and the Discount Double Dork Disgrace.....NFL football is a team game not a fantasy geek pukefest of ridiculous idolatry.

 

[amfootball]

There was also a parallel narrative going around that the Bucs were a glass canon and Brady was choosing to go to Tampa just to pad his offensive stats while going 8-8 because he no longer cared about winning.

I think it was Wickersham who reported that winning a SB was not on the top of Brady's list for teams he wanted to join. Apparently wanting to have fun in the sun was number one. Guess he just fell over himself while tanning and picked up his 7th trophy.

 

[Joker]

Maybe Wickersham is a media punk bigmouth with a Brady/Patriots fixation that could use a well placed left cross right in his stupid friggin' mouth.

 

[Deus Irae]

Fun fact: Tom Brady has been in the NFL for 21 years, and has been his team's starter for 19 of those.

Much more fun fact: Tom Brady has been an NFL starter for 19 seasons. He has been to the Super Bowl as the starter 10 times.

Another fun fact: Tom Brady is now 2-0 against Pat Mahomes in the playoffs.

Yet another fun fact: No Tom Brady led team has won fewer than 10 games in a season since 2002, and only one Tom Brady team has ever won as few as 9 games.


So.....


Tom Brady gets to the Super Bowl more than half the time he starts for his team for a "full" season, Tom Brady beats Pat Mahomes in the playoffs, and Tom Brady doesn't win fewer than 10 games a season, yet people here continue to insist that there was no chance that he could have gotten to the Super Bowl this year, had he stayed in New England.

 

[RIpats88]

Fun fact: Tom Brady has been in the NFL for 21 years, and has been his team's starter for 19 of those.

Much more fun fact: Tom Brady has been an NFL starter for 19 seasons. He has been to the Super Bowl as the starter 10 times.

Another fun fact: Tom Brady is now 2-0 against Pat Mahomes in the playoffs.

Yet another fun fact: No Tom Brady led team has won fewer than 10 games in a season since 2002, and only one Tom Brady team has ever won as few as 9 games.


So.....


Tom Brady gets to the Super Bowl more than half the time he starts for his team for a "full" season, Tom Brady beats Pat Mahomes in the playoffs, and Tom Brady doesn't win fewer than 10 games a season, yet people here continue to insist that there was no chance that he could have gotten to the Super Bowl this year, had he stayed in New England.

He couldn't get past the wildcard round in 2019 and that is with a top defense and actual NFL receivers.

2020's team was even worse.

At some point the talent level is so bad brady can't cover up the holes.

 

[Deus Irae]

He couldn't get past the wildcard round in 2019 and that is with a top defense and actual NFL receivers.

2020's team was even worse.

At some point the talent level is so bad brady can't cover up the holes.

In 2019, the OL was gone by the time the playoffs came around, and that killed any chance the team had of fielding even a remotely functional offense. I know that gets ignored by more people than just yourself, so I'm pointing this out in general, but the playoff injury status of 2019 is not guaranteed to have been repeated in 2020.

Also, different situations often lead to different adjustments. So the idea that the Patriots would have made the exact same adjustments, or lack of adjustments, with a better QB and better record, as they did with this past season's squad is just self-serving dismissal of Belichick's history.

 

[PatsWSB47]

Such desperation to argue that Brady wasnt the missing ingredient in Tampa.

 

[Deus Irae]

Such desperation to argue that Brady wasnt the missing ingredient in Tampa.

In one of life's greater ironies, this place has apparently become populated by the likes of Chris Simms, Rob Parker, Thannon Tharpe, et al...

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

If we’re going to look at Tampa Bay coming into this season, we need the whole picture...

If you’re going argue about the big impact of an unspectacular running back averaging under 4 ypc, then gtfo of this thread. It’s 2021...we’re all pretty hardcore football fans here. It isn’t 1991. There are maybe 3 or 4 running backs in the league worth discussing about how they might provide some major advantage for a QB. Maybe just Henry and Kamara right now.

But here’s what was said going into this offseason about the offense:

• Great talent at WR, in the form of two stars, Evans and Godwin
• Huge question mark for offensive line...Donovan Smith terrible, most of the other guys pretty good overall but not as good as Brady’s lines in New England
• Tight ends (Howard and Brate) not meshing into the system.

The idea was this was a “splash” offense, all sizzle and no steak. And that perception makes sense because you can’t really overstate Winston’s suckiness and how much 30 INTs ruins the evaluation of the whole team.

Here’s what Brady added, in addition to the obvious upgrade at QB:

• Gronkowski, a great blocker and highly competent receiver, when needed.
• Brown, probably the best #3 option in the league.
• Vastly improved pass protection. Basically every guy on the offensive line “improved” so drastically.

Here’s what the Bucs added:

• Miller, a promising, fast WR who made a few huge catches
• Wirfs, probably the most important addition of all these players

Week 1

To begin the season, Brady’s options were:
1. Evans
2. Godwin
3. Howard/Gronk
4. Watson/Miller

It took a season of major changes and integration to get the product we saw in the Super Bowl. In addition, Evans has basically told people that he needed to learn to play the position the right way. There were obvious growing pains with Evans, and to a lesser degree, Godwin.

Bottom line is this offense was 100% not supposed to be elite prior to Brady taking over. Having a two great/good wide receivers isn’t that unique in the NFL. It’s easy to see all of these improvements with the blocking and skill players and say “it was going to happen” but it really wasn’t.

 

[Tony2046]

That is an exquisite turd cutter for sure. Wonder if it’s real?

Fournette's such an amazing runner that his previous team cut him over performance, and the Bucs DNC-CD'd him during the season.
According to people here, Gronk was done.
According to people here, AB was a head case who'd never last. He was also a guy who'd missed a lot of time, and who was aging.
According to people here, Evans is overrated, doesn't run good routes, and is a soft player.
According to people here, Godwin really isn't that good, doesn't deserve to get paid, and shouldn't even be a target for re-signing.
According to people here, Suh is, and has always been, wildly overrated.



But now, because Brady got the worst franchise in sports turned around, suddenly it was a monster team just waiting for any QB but Jameis Winston?


Come on, man. Stop with the nonsense.

Deus, I don't know what you did while you were on your little vacation but you have been on point and on fire lately except when you disagreed with me a few times. Haha

 

[carmelo15]

Fournette's such an amazing runner that his previous team cut him over performance, and the Bucs DNC-CD'd him during the season.
According to people here, Gronk was done.
According to people here, AB was a head case who'd never last. He was also a guy who'd missed a lot of time, and who was aging.
According to people here, Evans is overrated, doesn't run good routes, and is a soft player.
According to people here, Godwin really isn't that good, doesn't deserve to get paid, and shouldn't even be a target for re-signing.
According to people here, Suh is, and has always been, wildly overrated.



But now, because Brady got the worst franchise in sports turned around, suddenly it was a monster team just waiting for any QB but Jameis Winston?


Come on, man. Stop with the nonsense.

not just here on Twitter too all of a sudden the Bucs were the 16-0 Pats before Brady got there but of course that was said before even the Saints game let alone before the season.

remember the 4 weeks Brady’s deep shot went bad and people were saying that old man shouldn’t be playing

 

[amfootball]

If we’re going to look at Tampa Bay coming into this season, we need the whole picture...

If you’re going argue about the big impact of an unspectacular running back averaging under 4 ypc, then gtfo of this thread. It’s 2021...we’re all pretty hardcore football fans here. It isn’t 1991. There are maybe 3 or 4 running backs in the league worth discussing about how they might provide some major advantage for a QB. Maybe just Henry and Kamara right now.

But here’s what was said going into this offseason about the offense:

• Great talent at WR, in the form of two stars, Evans and Godwin
• Huge question mark for offensive line...Donovan Smith terrible, most of the other guys pretty good overall but not as good as Brady’s lines in New England
• Tight ends (Howard and Brate) not meshing into the system.

The idea was this was a “splash” offense, all sizzle and no steak. And that perception makes sense because you can’t really overstate Winston’s suckiness and how much 30 INTs ruins the evaluation of the whole team.

Here’s what Brady added, in addition to the obvious upgrade at QB:

• Gronkowski, a great blocker and highly competent receiver, when needed.
• Brown, probably the best #3 option in the league.
• Vastly improved pass protection. Basically every guy on the offensive line “improved” so drastically.

Here’s what the Bucs added:

• Miller, a promising, fast WR who made a few huge catches
• Wirfs, probably the most important addition of all these players

Week 1

To begin the season, Brady’s options were:
1. Evans
2. Godwin
3. Howard
4. Watson/Miller

It took a season of major changes and integration to get the product we saw in the Super Bowl. In addition, Evans has basically told people that he needed to learn to play the position the right way. There were obvious growing pains with Evans, and to a lesser degree, Godwin.

Bottom line is this offense was 100% not supposed to be elite prior to Brady taking over. Having a two great/good wide receivers isn’t that unique in the NFL. It’s easy to see all of these improvements with the blocking and skill players and say “it was going to happen” but it really wasn’t.

Add to this that Tampa did not look like a SB contender all season. It was bumpy especially in Nov. The defense looked like poop the second half the season especially the last 4 games when Ryan/Counsins were torching them. Taylor Heineke had his way with the defense in the first playoff game and if not for Brady having his best game of the season, they lose that game and it is a WC exit and no one is talking about the offense being star studded or the defense being elite. The switch flipped vs the Saints. Now people want to look back and say how great the team was but it was not clicking all season until the final 3 playoff games. Only SB1 predicted the team to never lose again when the playoffs began. So kudos to him. Lol

 

[Tony2046]

Maybe Wickersham is a media punk bigmouth with a Brady/Patriots fixation that could use a well placed left cross right in his stupid friggin' mouth.

Nothing worse than shytty wicker.

 

[Tony2046]

Fun fact: Tom Brady has been in the NFL for 21 years, and has been his team's starter for 19 of those.

Much more fun fact: Tom Brady has been an NFL starter for 19 seasons. He has been to the Super Bowl as the starter 10 times.

Another fun fact: Tom Brady is now 2-0 against Pat Mahomes in the playoffs.

Yet another fun fact: No Tom Brady led team has won fewer than 10 games in a season since 2002, and only one Tom Brady team has ever won as few as 9 games.


So.....


Tom Brady gets to the Super Bowl more than half the time he starts for his team for a "full" season, Tom Brady beats Pat Mahomes in the playoffs, and Tom Brady doesn't win fewer than 10 games a season, yet people here continue to insist that there was no chance that he could have gotten to the Super Bowl this year, had he stayed in New England.

Another fun fact. Brady is the first QB to win a Superbowl and receive his AARP membership in the same year.

 

[Tony2046]

If we’re going to look at Tampa Bay coming into this season, we need the whole picture...

If you’re going argue about the big impact of an unspectacular running back averaging under 4 ypc, then gtfo of this thread. It’s 2021...we’re all pretty hardcore football fans here. It isn’t 1991. There are maybe 3 or 4 running backs in the league worth discussing about how they might provide some major advantage for a QB. Maybe just Henry and Kamara right now.

But here’s what was said going into this offseason about the offense:

• Great talent at WR, in the form of two stars, Evans and Godwin
• Huge question mark for offensive line...Donovan Smith terrible, most of the other guys pretty good overall but not as good as Brady’s lines in New England
• Tight ends (Howard and Brate) not meshing into the system.

The idea was this was a “splash” offense, all sizzle and no steak. And that perception makes sense because you can’t really overstate Winston’s suckiness and how much 30 INTs ruins the evaluation of the whole team.

Here’s what Brady added, in addition to the obvious upgrade at QB:

• Gronkowski, a great blocker and highly competent receiver, when needed.
• Brown, probably the best #3 option in the league.
• Vastly improved pass protection. Basically every guy on the offensive line “improved” so drastically.

Here’s what the Bucs added:

• Miller, a promising, fast WR who made a few huge catches
• Wirfs, probably the most important addition of all these players

Week 1

To begin the season, Brady’s options were:
1. Evans
2. Godwin
3. Howard
4. Watson/Miller

It took a season of major changes and integration to get the product we saw in the Super Bowl. In addition, Evans has basically told people that he needed to learn to play the position the right way. There were obvious growing pains with Evans, and to a lesser degree, Godwin.

Bottom line is this offense was 100% not supposed to be elite prior to Brady taking over. Having a two great/good wide receivers isn’t that unique in the NFL. It’s easy to see all of these improvements with the blocking and skill players and say “it was going to happen” but it really wasn’t.

They were underdogs for every game during the playoffs. Out of 108 "Experts" , 81 picked KC to win the super bowl.

No one really expected Tampa to get past the Saints, the Packers and the Chiefs to win it all. I didn't either. But Damn.

That was a fantastic run and I couldn't be happier for the guy who refused to throw a couple of Ball boys under the bus and shoved deflategate right up Fraudger's ass.

There are no more GOAT arguments worth having. He's ended all of them.

 

[Joker]

They were underdogs for every game during the playoffs. Out of 108 "Experts" , 81 picked KC to win the super bowl.

No one really expected Tampa to get past the Saints, the Packers and the Chiefs to win it all. I didn't either. But Damn.

That was a fantastic run and I couldn't be happier for the guy who refused to throw a couple of Ball boys under the bus and shoved deflategate right up Fraudger's ass.

There are no more GOAT arguments worth having. He's ended all of them.

Rob Pecker...er...Parker..disagrees with you Tony. I think we should all respect and proliferate Rob's opinions across the sports interwebs and admit, no matter what our racial background is, what a pack of institutional RACISTS we, as in all Pats fans, are.

 

[Tony2046]

Rob Pecker...er...Parker..disagrees with you Tony. I think we should all respect and proliferate Rob's opinions across the sports interwebs and admit, no matter what our racial background is, what a pack of institutional RACISTS we, as in all Pats fans, are.

"Ve are'll patshriots now"

 

[Nehalem]

One could argue the 2020 Bucs talent-wise should be in the discussion as having been as talented as the 2004 or 2007 Patriots.

The one thing I'm interested in is... was there a reason besides talent as to why the Patriots from 2001-2019 always played in close super bowls? Was it because Belichick didn't prioritize an elite pass rush? Was it because we were too conservative in our offensive approach to begin the big games?

One of the reasons we were on the wrong end of some SB losses was because our pass rush couldnt get home to Eli or Foles.

The whole 9 SBs being close is certainly an intersting topic.

I think it might come down to

(1) Playing tight. Basically, after the first couple of SBs the Patriots had tremendous weight on themselves to win because they were the Patriots. The 1st Rams SB was close because the Rams were the better team.
(2) I wonder if it was be design. Basically BB chose a strategy of play that would keep the game close and then expected the Patriots would out execute in the 4th Q to win and/or Brady would be clutch.

Notice how while the Patriots never won big. They also never got embarrassed like the '13 Broncos or '20 Chiefs.

 

[carmelo15]

Also to the guys that are saying keep Godwin over Barrett. Tampa free agents next year are JPP, Vae, Davis, Whitehead, Jenson, D. Smith, and Cappa. I don’t understand how it could be justified to pay two WR’s 17+ mill a year when you got those guys to pay next year after giving Davis a contract this year. Pay Barrett and have he and Vae anchor the defensive line with David/White as linebackers

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Also to the guys that are saying keep Godwin over Barrett. Tampa free agents next year are JPP, Vae, Davis, Whitehead, Jenson, D. Smith, and Cappa. I don’t understand how it could be justified to pay two WR’s 17+ mill a year when you got those guys to pay next year after giving Davis a contract this year. Pay Barrett and have he and Vae anchor the defensive line with David/White as linebackers

He’s a pass rusher whose production is highly dependent on Vea dominating up front. Without Vea, his career production has been very underwhelming.

You don’t pay a guy $20M when he depends on someone else, is one dimensional, and doesn’t make other guys around him better.

I’m telling you this would be a terrible signing. Save the $$$ for Vea and a stud defensive tackle. I think you’ll be surprised at how easily some decent $8M OLB/DE could replace Barrett’s production. Check out his stats in Denver and also last year went Vea went out.

Check out Frank Clark’s contract, or Trey Flowers, or almost every pass rusher making over $17M. Almost all of them are horrible values, as they’re making almost as much as QBs. I don’t even think Khalil Mack is worth it, but I know Barrett is a far cry from Khalil Mack.

As for Godwin, at least he isn’t so dependent on scheme, and he’s versatile. When he went out last year, the Bucs offense really suffered. I’m not thrilled about his price tag/value, but at least they’d be paying for a very good player.