Official Post Game Thread - Seattle beats the Pats

[Brick27]

Nobody is blaming Harry for the loss. There’s a difference between saying he needs to do some things better and saying he caused a loss. He was probably one of the top 5 players on the field. The defense in total was atrocious

Yeah let’s go ahead and pretend this guy gets no heat on these boards lol..

 

[DaBruinz]

and that one good play apparently only had like a 6% probability of happening, so could be classified as a fluky play

But @lancerman wants us to believe that Moore humiliated everyone who covered him tonight.

 

[lancerman]

Yeah let’s go ahead and pretend this guy gets no heat on these boards lol..

Oh he totally does. But the discussion in this thread has more to do with him going down right at contact all game when that should be something his skill set prevents. Not that he’s bad or costing anyone things. Harry realistically shouldn’t be judged off last season. He was a rookie and injured.

Comparisons to guys line DK Metcalf are in poor taste. DK is a physical freak and he had some serious question marks (fast as **** but his come drills were worse than Brady’s) the fact that he worked out was blind luck. Multiple WR’s were taken away was of him. Isabella and Arcega-Whiteside who have done nothing since being drafted. Hardman who did ball out but is on a stacked offense where he’s like the third best WR and 4th best passing target so he doesn’t get premium coverage. Then I guess AJ Brown and Dee o Samuel have done well. Marquis Brown who was the only guy selected before Harry has largely underwhelmed outside like 3 games.

It’s kind of a crapshoot and Harry was the only one missing time. He’s shown some development this year. But it’s noticeable that he’s not really showing what was supposed to be his skill set

 

[Delicate Genius]

Damn, just watched the final play again after reading Cam's comments. He would have walked in if he went outside. Too bad.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

Damn, just watched the final play again after reading Cam's comments. He would have walked in if he went outside. Too bad.

Jacob got blown up at FB. Could have scored if it was a better play. Bringing in 2 extra OL and both TEs, using zero receivers, basically telegraphs the play.

.

 

[JMC00]

Statistical facts through 2 weeks

Pats offense is statistically better than Chefs and ratbirds
Pats have averaged 410 yards per game, Chefs and ratbirds have averaged 391 and 394

Pats are only 1 of 3 teams to be top #10 in passing offense and rushing offense, the other 2 are the Packers & Rams

Pats offense is #1 in 1st downs gained and #4 on 3rd down.

 

[Chevy]

it's sad when Jules is your only deep threat..go get a WR Bill

Maybe so, but now every upcoming defender is thinking "How do I know Edelman's first cut isn't part of a double-move go route?". They field-tested an addition to his game (or re-addition), and it had results.

Also - the D out thought themselves, Wilson is for real (again), Harry may not show up on the RAC stats but he was tough today, James White - love ya and have said a prayer for you and your's - was really missed tonight, Cam is going to carry this team as long as he needs to.

 

[Flash]

I think this team has shown that it's a Playoff team. I don't know about winning the SB but I expect this team to be one of the four best teams in the AFC.

 

[luuked]

Pleasantly surprised with Cam and the receivers. Nice to see a QB throwing to Harry and the other young receivers.

Defense against the run is a dumpster fire,though. How many times did they fail to set the edge?? Not great in the middle, either..

I think dumpster fire is too strong. We had one game where the run defense look very solid and now this vintage "mobile QB" gameplan where the fronts were much more a response to Wilson than towards the run. As the season goes on -- and hopefully our players stay healthy -- hopefully players like Uche and Jennings will grow into bigger roles. But it is clear how much they miss Hightower in there.

I do not understand not calling a timeout at 0:30 or so. Likewise, I don’t understand that final playcall and would have said so even if they had scored

I think preserving the TO was not a bad decision, but you just can't lose so much time lining up and snapping the ball. I think the teaching point for everyone on the field is just more awareness, faster lining up and a quick spike. Edelman got tackled right at the boundary at 0:28 and the clock kept winding, they were lined up at 0:15 and the ball was finally snapped at 0:12. There was easily room to preserve at least another 4-5 seconds in there with a little more urgency from everyone. And that's one (or maybe two) additional plays.

It comes down what you prefer situationally.. a first down from the 13 with 0:28 remaining without a TO, or with 0:16 remaining but with a TO. Personally I'd go for the latter. Unfortunately, they were just not efficient enough after Edelman's play and ended up with 0:12.

 

[luuked]

#1. Hightower is sorely missed. The front 7 has lost its bite, its spear head. Rewatching some plays..the front 7 just gets swallowed up... I know if Zeus was in there a guard or TE is bettingv flattened. Bentley is not that. I don't know if we have someone in the front 7 right now with that physicality current day. Id certainly start putting some feelers on traded for a linebacker capable of blowing up blockers and make open field tackles.

Bentley is certainly no Hightower but this was his second game as defacto starter. We were lucky enough that HT stayed healthy in the last two years so his chance few.

It might sound weird to say this about a player in his fourth (EDIT) third year but I expect Bentley to grow a lot through the season just due to actual game reps. Sure if you get a chance at another KVN-esque reclamation project it would be great to stock up but chances are slim that anyone you get will actually be an efficient starter over Bentley.

The chances to get more from the LB group will come from Jennings and especially Uche.

 

[Lagaffe_07]

I am really exited from what I saw in this game but like the first game, I will temper my exitement after this game. Is it a fluke or is it really this team this year?

The Seattle D is not great, they allow last week like 500 yards too. Even with this production, they scored only 23 points on O. Will Edelman catch for 180 yards every game?

seatlle put linebacker at time on Edelman. It is crazy too me. The running games was non existent. I’m for now still in the camp of, stop the running game, double Edelman and we are some kind of trouble.

but I am really exited by Cam’s level of play. I hope we can extend him but i don’t think BB will pay Deshaun Waston money to Cam.

 

[luuked]

and that one good play apparently only had like a 6% probability of happening, so could be classified as a fluky play

The way Wilson completed those two deep TDs reminded me a lot of Nick Foles in the SB. Just perfectly thrown balls that landed exactly in the right spot. How do you defend the Metcalf and Moore TD any better ?

According to next gen stats Gilmore was right there with Metcalf through the entire route.



The ball landed right where it needed to be.

 

[Triumph]

To me, BB goofed the clock management up at the end.

IMPORTANT - Before you start throwing feces at me from your primate cages think about this.

(Play # 7) 1 - 10 SEA 31 yard line NE @ :36 at the beginning of the play when Cam hit Edelman down the left sideline for 18 yards. Edelman was stopped inbounds and the clock kept running.

NO TIMEOUT BY BB.

We can safely assume that :07 seconds ran off to complete the Cam to Edelman play. Perhaps it was a few seconds more but not much.

(Play # 8) 1 - 10 SEA 13 yard line NE now @ :13. at the beginning of this play. Incomplete pass to Edelman. :04 seconds run off this play.

Instead of (Play # 8) 1 - 10 SEA 13 yard line and NE @ :27 - :29 if BB had called the last TO at the conclusion of Play # 7. :14 seconds elapsed by not calling a TO. You cant get the time back once its gone, but you can stop the clock by other means.

(Play # 9) 2 - 10 SEA 13 yard line NE @ :09 at the beginning. Cam to Harry middle for 12 yards. :06 seconds elapse on this play.

The NE offense could have easily ran 13 yards and spiked the ball to stop the clock,

(Play # 10) 1 - Goal SEA 1 yard line NE @ :03 seconds.

You have only 1 play when Im 99% certain that youd have at the very least 2 plays if BB had spent the last TO at play # 7.

https://nflcdns.nfl.com/liveupdate/gamecenter/58198/SEA_Gamebook.pdf

 

[luuked]

To me, BB goofed the clock management up at the end.

IMPORTANT - Before you start throwing feces at me from your primate cages think about this.

(Play # 7) 1 - 10 SEA 31 yard line NE @ :36 at the beginning of the play when Cam hit Edelman down the left sideline for 18 yards. Edelman was stopped inbounds and the clock kept running.

NO TIMEOUT BY BB.

We can safely assume that :07 seconds ran off to complete the Cam to Edelman play. Perhaps it was a few seconds more but not much.

(Play # 8) 1 - 10 SEA 13 yard line NE now @ :13. at the beginning of this play. Incomplete pass to Edelman. :04 seconds run off this play.

Instead of 1 - 10 and NE @ :27 - :29 if BB had called the last TO at the conclusion of Play # 7. :14 seconds elapsed by not calling a TO. You cant get the time back once its gone, but you can stop the clock by other means.

(Play # 9) 2 - 10 SEA 13 yard line NE @ :09 at the beginning. Cam to Harry middle for 12 yards. :06 seconds elapse on this play.

The NE offense could have easily ran 13 yards and spiked the ball to stop the clock,

(Play # 10) 1 - Goal SEA 1 yard line NE @ :03 seconds.

You have only 1 play when Im 99% certain that youd have at the very least 2 plays if BB had spent the last TO at play # 7.

https://nflcdns.nfl.com/liveupdate/gamecenter/58198/SEA_Gamebook.pdf

I said it just before to me the issue here had much more to do with how much time the team lost between when Edelman was down at 28 seconds , when they were all lined up at the line at 15 seconds and when the ball was finally snapped with 12 sec left.

I understand preserving the TO but then your team needs to be more efficient getting back to the line and spiking the ball. A little bit more urgency and we could have easily been left with 16-17 seconds on the clock AND the timeout.

I will take 28 seconds without a TO over having only 12 with a TO. But if you crank this up to 16 or 17 I think I'd change my stance and much rather have the TO. Especially because it keeps Seattle honest and is a emergency reprieve from some silly penalty that might cause a run off.

 

[Triumph]

NE might need a RB

Sony is back to being 2.5 yac Sony. I dont understand why Taylor only had 1 carry after last week.

 

[Triumph]

I said it just before to me the issue here had much more to do with how much time the team lost between when Edelman was down at 28 seconds , when they were all lined up at the line at 15 seconds and when the ball was finally snapped with 12 sec left.

I understand preserving the TO but then your team needs to be more efficient getting back to the line and spiking the ball. A little bit more urgency and we could have easily been left with 16-17 seconds on the clock AND the timeout.

I will take 28 seconds without a TO over having only 12 with a TO. But if you crank this up to 16 or 17 I think I'd change my stance and much rather have the TO. Especially because it keeps Seattle honest and is a emergency reprieve from some silly penalty that might cause a run off.

If Cam scored a TD and won the game BB is a genius which he is.

I wanted a pass play at 1st and goal.

 

[luuked]

If Cam scored a TD and won the game BB is a genius which he is.

I wanted a pass play at 1st and goal.

Even if he scored on the throw that went through Edelman's hands it was still too much time ticking down between the plays. On the plus side this is something totally situational that they can practice and hopefully be better in the future. It sucks that the game came down to Edelman getting tackled a couple inches away from being out of bounds and the clock not stopping. But that is football and it was one of those bounces that didn't go our way.

As I said I am ok with the call and won't get into the pass/throw debate any further. I think the reaction of a lot of people is driven by its outcome. If they had gone pass and failed I am sure we would have heard how Josh got cute again instead of ramming it in with Newton using a play that essentially had not been stopped in the previous 7 quarters.

 

[Triumph]

McDaniels had his moments of terrible play calling last night.

Some of the run plays were atrocious. Who is in charge of putting JJ Taylor in for a shot in the arm for the NE run game? Taylor got 1 carry all night after last weeks stellar performance. In my opinion he would really be effective late in the game out in space on pass plays ala Kevin Faulks role.

 

[NashuaPats]

NE might need a RB

Sony is back to being 2.5 yac Sony. I dont understand why Taylor only had 1 carry after last week.

Sony looks mediocre running the ball and isn’t a pass catching threat. I’m hoping Harris can be an upgrade.

 

[Lagaffe_07]

NE might need a RB

Sony is back to being 2.5 yac Sony. I dont understand why Taylor only had 1 carry after last week.

it was not on Sony tonight. He had 7 carries for 19 yards but the rest of te RB got 7 carries for 1 yards! The RB group had 14 carries for 20 yards. When it is that bad it is not on one player.

It is not like every running back average 4 yards a carry and Sony 2