Game Day Thread Official Post Game Thread- Bills beat the Pats

[Sfpat]

I'm sure BB thinks the good news is that by making the playoffs, the Pat's won't be on Hard Knocks next summer.

 

[BTTA]

Dead money is a complete misnomer. It’s all spent anyway, it’s a sunk cost.

The question is - is that extra $5m better spent by having Agholor on the roster or using it on someone else? If the answer is Agholor, you keep him. If the answer is someone else, you cut him. You don’t decide to keep someone because you might have a $10m dead cap charge if you don’t. That’s how you perpetuate bad decisions.

You are right of course although research has shown that a large majority of people can't organize their thinking with sunk cost as a guiding principle. The emotional disappointment is far more potent than the logic of sunk cost.

 

[NE_Zealot]

The only thing slower than our defense was this site's server. Both need some serious work this off season.

Ian does a great job here and this site is among the best I’ve seen for fans. I do have to agree that last night the boards were unusable but I’m sure the server was slammed, nature of the beast. I kick my $$$ towards the site even though I don’t post here often because it’s a great forum overall.

 

[Steve102]

@Kontradiction @RobertWeathers

I really feel that little Steven might be the problem. This D has played flat for a few games now. Tells me the championship level leaders are not bought in to what they are doing. Looking back, Slate was talking about guys stepping up. Perhaps that’s what he’s talking about ?

I dunno. Just how I feel. Something is amiss on that side of the ball. There’s still vet leadership there, but something just ain’t right. I’d like to hear your opinions.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

You are right of course although research has shown that a large majority of people can't organize their thinking with sunk cost as a guiding principle. The emotional disappointment is far more potent than the logic of sunk cost.

I personally went through a textbook case of it last week.

I wanted to sell my second car, since we rarely use it. 2008 Volvo, not great condition.

Got two offers: CarMax offered 2,400; a company called Shift offered 1,900.

CarMax required that I first renew the registration (Shift did not). We had pulled the car off the road…the registration fees were outrageous and were 400, but it would still be a better deal. I paid the fee online, expecting an instant registration update. I wanted to just get it done with, and also CarMax is a more established company and cuts you a check in-store, whereas Shift has to come to your house and takes more time.

Anyway, I ****ed it all up because I then had to do one last step: Smog check. Drove it to a place right by CarMax, but I had no idea that replacing the car battery (as I had done a month ago) leads to a computer system reset and the car was unable to pass the smog until it had been driven hundreds of more miles. I’ve done dozens of smog checks and never had an issue.

Anyway, now we had an offer for $2,400, where I had already sunk $400 into the registration fees. And an offer for $1,900, which didn’t even require a registration and would be embarrassing for wasting the money trying to get the other offer. Ultimately, I had to just swallow my pride and take the $1,900 offer and eat the $400.

It wasn’t worth the $500 to drive the car hundreds of more miles over many months, getting insurance, missing more work time, and delaying other things. But the biggest thing was the psychological hit of knowing I burned the $400 and ultimately categorizing it as a sunken cost, one that was just a bad decision.

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

Ian does a great job here and this site is among the best I’ve seen for fans. I do have to agree that last night the boards were unusable but I’m sure the server was slammed, nature of the beast. I kick my $$$ towards the site even though I don’t post here often because it’s a great forum overall.

Ian had a family function last night, so he wasn't around. He spends alot of his time and money on this site, so lets cut him a break, and he really didn't miss much!

 

[NE_Zealot]

He just runs and never pays a price. I know he’s big and elusive but he needs to get hit and hit hard.

I agree 100%. Somebody needs to pop him and make him think twice, problem is he’s as big as a TE and can take on LBs. He’s as dangerous as any tailback when he gets to the 2nd level. Allen looked like a bust early but year 3 he had an epiphany and is a stud, you have to give him that. I’ll take a QB like that in a heartbeat, perfect combination of size, arm talent and smarts.

 

[long distance]

They gain nothing by dumping Agholor. $5 million savings...$10 million dead money. So, basically, Agholor next year at $5 million is value - forget the other $10, because it's gone either way.

Its actually c. 4M saving (51/53 rule)

One item I haven't seen touched on much is Wynn. Herron actually looked fine out there last night. Is he excellent? No, but he wasn't a problem. I'm curious if the team explores trading Wynn. Even if they don't get much draft capital in return, trading him would give them almost $11M in cap space.

Yep, Herron looked serviceable unless you count run blocking. He's a nice backup piece though.
Nevertheless Wynn will be discussed one way or another. If nothing else he was missing in most important game of the season again.
It might be a tough sell for a trade on 10.4M guaranteed despite his capabilities esp. with another strong OL class coming cheap.

Don't forget the Pats have about $3 million left in cap for 2021 that will be pushed to 2022. So that will cover most of McCourty's voidable bonus cap hit if he doesn't re-sign.

They don't. They used it on incentives and Phillips extension.

 

[goheels22002]

I think we have a great future. Time to clean house and build around Mac and Mondre. The D is too slow. Special teams needs a better coach. Overall I would give this season a B+. Hope we have another great draft.

Looking at the box score, the offense had a decent night, good enough to win, actually. I love the fact that the Patriots went 4-4 in converting 4th downs. The defense got embarrassed, forced no punts and and gave up five passing TDs on a 21-25 passing performance by a very good QB, but with zero sacks.

Man, if Agholor had come down with that first quarter TD pass in the end zone on the first drive.... That was a terrific pass by Mac Jones and would have quieted that crowd. Instead, they let the Bills drive down for a quick 14-0 lead and it was over.

We don't need to clean house, exactly. This is a playoff caliber team in need of upgrades, especially on defense.

The area in need of improvement is the defense. Bill needs to seriously consider bringing in an experienced Defense Coordinator to give him the same level of support as Josh McDaniels. That's a tall order for Bill Belichick with his son in a leading role, but they're not getting it done. There's lots of talent at all three levels - Judon, Barmore, JC Jackson, Guy, Dugger, Phillips, Wise, etc. Interior DL needs another upgrade in 2022, and LB needs an overhaul. But last night we saw a defense get off to a slow start. The coaching staff did not put the guys in a position to win.

 

[NE_Zealot]

Ian had a family function last night, so he wasn't around. He spends alot of his time and money on this site, so lets cut him a break, and he really didn't miss much!

When did I take a dig at him??

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

Looking at the box score, the offense had a decent night, good enough to win, actually. I love the fact that the Patriots went 4-4 in converting 4th downs. The defense got embarrassed, forced no punts and and gave up five passing TDs on a 21-25 passing performance by a very good QB, but with zero sacks.

Man, if Agholor had come down with that first quarter TD pass in the end zone on the first drive.... That was a terrific pass by Mac Jones and would have quieted that crowd. Instead, they let the Bills drive down for a quick 14-0 lead and it was over.

We don't need to clean house, exactly. This is a playoff caliber team in need of upgrades, especially on defense.

The area in need of improvement is the defense. Bill needs to seriously consider bringing in an experienced Defense Coordinator to give him the same level of support as Josh McDaniels. That's a tall order for Bill Belichick with his son in a leading role, but they're not getting it done. There's lots of talent at all three levels - Judon, Barmore, JC Jackson, Guy, Dugger, Phillips, Wise, etc. Interior DL needs another upgrade in 2022, and LB needs an overhaul. But last night we saw a defense get off to a slow start. The coaching staff did not put the guys in a position to win.

Seriously???

The offense scored ten points, the last TD came against the Bills second stringers, the Pats were done when it was 14-0. The offense did nothing, they threw two picks, and didn't run the ball at all, didn't control the clock. Not sure what game you watched.

Terrific passes don't get intercepted, granted it was a great play by Hyde, but still, Hyde had the range to get there and break up the play.

Jones may develop into a decent QB, but he will never be anything close to Brady.

 

[goheels22002]

Actually it is.

Your previous post was completely on point. The defense did not stop Buffalo from doing whatever it wanted. No forced punts, no sacks, and a Buffalo rushing game that averaged 6.0 yards per carry. None of this was Mac Jones' fault. He could nothing about the Bills goin 6 for 6 in the Red Zone.

Bill Belichick the GM has to be looking at his defensive coaching staff and wondering if he has the right people there. Tough off-season for the Belichick family.

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

When did I take a dig at him??

Just speaking generally, not pointing any fingers

 

[RobertWeathers]

The only thing I'd question is this oft-repeated notion of Mac hitting the proverbial wall. There's no objective way to actually quantify that; I would suggest his late-season rough patch could just as well be attributed to (A) tougher competition vs. teams in the playoff hunt, (B) opposing DCs getting a firmer handle on his tendencies and (C) the ongoing learning curve of a rookie QB navigating his first full NFL campaign.

Point taken. Other QBs and players have said the rookie wall is real so I'm going off of that.

I do agree the competition Mac has faced has stiffened.

 

[goheels22002]

Seriously???

The offense scored ten points, the last TD came against the Bills second stringers, the Pats were done when it was 14-0. The offense did nothing, they threw two picks, and didn't run the ball at all, didn't control the clock. Not sure what game you watched.

Terrific passes don't get intercepted, granted it was a great play by Hyde, but still, Hyde had the range to get there and break up the play.

Jones may develop into a decent QB, but he will never be anything close to Brady.

No one who ever walked the Earth is close to Brady.

The pass to Agholor in the first quarter was a perfect throw. The defender made a great play.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Frankly I think the way we couldn't stop the Bills anyways, might as well have had both of them in there to put a good licking on Josh Allen a few times.

Josh Allen is playing with reckless abandon because he hasn't taken those hits yet. I don't know. Maybe his frame helps him avoids those.

The positive is because of his style of play Allen's career prime will not be longer than 12 years if that

 

[Toofy]

Four factors contributing to this poor loss

Rock solid veterans like mccourty finally showing their age and regressing .

Flop show from free agent signings and the biggest rockstar on defense Judon becoming human again.

The ever guaranteed special teams becoming non special or ordinary

And lastly most importantly the horrible drafts of 2015-2019 catching on to us.

We were relatively lucky on injury this year. Hence playoff bound .

I hope bill realizes this and does not think we can contend again and go for back loaded contracts. Get a Wr1 and we should be all set. We can play from front.

Cam we tender a second rounder on JC Jackson so that we get a second rounder when he leaves? Is that possible?

 

[MrBigglesWorth]

Question.

How many run yards a game did the defense give up in 2020 and 2019?

This has been an ongoing issue

 

[sb1]

Question.

How many run yards a game did the defense give up in 2020 and 2019?

This has been an ongoing issue

Run D hasn’t been good since 2016. Ranked in the bottom third or quarter of the league every year except for 2019 when they were 14th and played nobody for the first half of the season.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I’m going to say the 2021 Patriots were one of the most identity-less teams I’ve ever seen. No, it isn’t a negative moniker. I just have absolutely no idea how good they actually were.

• They had one of the best point differentials in the NFL but went just 10-8.
• They annihilated ****ty teams like the Jets and Jags, and they won easily against middle-lower class teams, but they went 3-8 against teams with winning records.
• It seemed they underachieved much of the season. But during their 7-game winning streak, their overachieving was on a historic level, as they played way above themselves.

It seems like for every statement you make about this team, there’s a counter statement.