Game Day Thread Official Post Game Thread- Bills beat the Pats

[StockingAnarchyNumber12]

The “curse” of having the GOAT as your QB. Mac could develop into Carl Yastrzemski and people would be *****ing that he wasn’t Ted Williams. Because that actually happened around these parts.

No, Mac is not that good right now. But he’s shown nothing that indicates that he’ll be a bad NFL QB. Just need to see what happens the next couple of years with his development.

He hit the rookie wall imo. It happens.

He just wasnt ready yet and no rookie qb has ever been.

 

[Patnation21]

It wasn’t a perfect throw. It was short and on the wrong shoulder. That is what allowed Hyde to make a great play

It wasn't under thrown at all, it was a pretty damn good throw, Hyde just made a ridiculously good play and catch. I'll watch it again for a 3rd time but looked like an almost perfect toss if Hyde didn't make a great play.

 

[RobertWeathers]

@Kontradiction @RobertWeathers

I really feel that little Steven might be the problem. This D has played flat for a few games now. Tells me the championship level leaders are not bought in to what they are doing. Looking back, Slate was talking about guys stepping up. Perhaps that’s what he’s talking about ?

I dunno. Just how I feel. Something is amiss on that side of the ball. There’s still vet leadership there, but something just ain’t right. I’d like to hear your opinions.

This is what I believe.

I believe the in-prime talent and quality depth on the defense is not where it needs to be. If this was the 01, 03, 04,14, 16 or 18 defense we aren't having this discussion. That is THE root of the problem. More talent on D improves your chances for victory and success....and covers up for coaching misses.

I still have full confidence BB is a defensive mastermind but he's playing with a short hand.

I think it's important to look at the DC job here historically and who gets it and when.

BB draws a clear distinction between when a coach has earned the "DC" title and when he hasn't. He has said what makes a DC is his ability help him with the game plan, make in-game adjustments, call the game, marry personnel to the game plan, etc.

Let's look at the DC history.

No DC in 2000. It was BB and in 2001 got RAC to do the job.

In 2005 after RAC left, the official title went to Mangini. Bill felt he was ready. Fine.

Bill felt Pees was qualified to be DC and was from 06-09.

In 2009 after Pees left, a DC was not named and Fat Matt was ultimately given that title 2 years later in 2012

When Fat Matt left after the 2017 season, BB did not name Flo as DC. Had he stayed I believe Flo would have been named DC.

When Flo left after 2018, BB named no one DC and that has not changed. Schiano declined the job and we are going on 3 years w/o a DC and it was reported BB named himself DC.

What we can conclude is for whatever reason BB does not think his son has earned the title. Also maybe he thinks he has earned it but for other reasons he won't give it to him. I don't know.

I can't sit here and say BB Jr sucks b/c for all intents and purposes the DC is BB and BB Jr is calling plays I believe BB has told him to call and executing the game plan BB put together.

With that said, does that take extra load take away from BBs ability to oversee other aspects of the team and fix what is needed to be fixed (like those maddening pre-snap penalties, special teams snafus or dumb mistakes that have popped up at the worst possible moments?)

So, does getting someone senior been there-seen that kinda guy like RAC, Pees, Fat Matt to take the load off so BB has the bandwidth to fix other areas during prep week?

Only he can answer that. Tough situation for BB.

 

[jdlboot14]

#1 - this year was a great learning experience for the young guys, Mac primarily, of what it takes to win and be consistent, and getting a taste of playoff football expectations.
#2 - we still have good talent on this team. next year will be 2nd/3rd year in the system for a lot of guys. and some returning off IR (White, McMillan, J. Jones)
#3 - some old guys moving on might allow new generation of leaders (Phillips, Andrews, Bentley, Mac, Henry, Harris)
#4 - Other guys that could step up next year (Perkins, Wade, Ross, Bledsoe, Agholor, J. Smith)

 

[gitgronked82]

Something weird happened last night. I don’t know how to rationalize it. This defense isn’t THAT bad. It really didn’t make sense. They looked absolutely horrendous. That was quite literally the worst defensive performance in nfl history.
But if they truly were way too slow and old, etc… there’s simply no way they could have been that effective this year. If they were so slow and old, they would have had to have been a very bad defense.
I get that a mediocre defense can unravel against great competition in the playoffs.
I don’t think you can get exposed as being the worst defense in the nfl if you were a good defense.
If I’m to believe they’re close to as bad as last night looked, it doesn’t make sense that they didn’t struggle way more this year. It’s difficult to know how to view them going into the offseason

 

[StockingAnarchyNumber12]

Something weird happened last night. I don’t know how to rationalize it. This defense isn’t THAT bad. It really didn’t make sense. They looked absolutely horrendous. That was quite literally the worst defensive performance in nfl history.
But if they truly were way too slow and old, etc… there’s simply no way they could have been that effective this year. If they were so slow and old, they would have had to have been a very bad defense.
I get that a mediocre defense can unravel against great competition in the playoffs.
I don’t think you can get exposed as being the worst defense in the nfl if you were a good defense.
If I’m to believe they’re close to as bad as last night looked, it doesn’t make sense that they didn’t struggle way more this year. It’s difficult to know how to view them going into the offseason

Combination of allen playing lights out and at the times the defense almost seeming disinterested in the game once we were down 20-0.

We just werent good enough.

 

[Steve102]

This is what I believe.

I believe the in-prime talent and quality depth on the defense is not where it needs to be. If this was the 01, 03, 04,14 or 16 defense we aren't having this discussion. That is root of the problem. More talent on D improves your chances for victory and success....and covers up for coaching misses.

I still have full confidence BB is a defensive mastermind but he's playing with a short hand.

I think it's important to look at the DC job here historically and who gets it and when.

BB draws a clear distinction between when a coach has earned the "DC" title and he hasn't. He has said what makes a DC is his ability help him with the game plan, make in-game adjustments, call the game, marry personnel to the game plan, etc.

Let's look at the DC history.

No DC in 2000. It was BB and in 2001 got RAC to do the job.

In 2005 after RAC left, the official title went to Mangini. Bill felt he was ready. Fine.

Bill felt Pees was qualified to be DC and was from 06-09.

In 2009 after Pees left, a DC was not named and Fat Matt was ultimately given that title 2 years later in 2012

When Fat Matt left after the 2017 season, BB did not name Flo as DC. Had he stayed I believe Flo would have been named DC.

When Flo left after 2018, BB named no one DC and that has not changed. Schiano declined the job and we are going on 3 years w/o a DC and it was reported BB named himself DC.

What we can conclude is for whatever reason BB does not think his son has earned the title. Also maybe he thinks he has earned it but for other reasons he won't give it to him. I don't know.

I can't sit here and say BB Jr sucks b/c for all intents and purposes the DC is BB and BB Jr is calling plays I believe BB has told him to call and executing the game plan BB put together.

With that said, does that take away from BBs ability to oversee other aspects of the team and fix what is needed to be fixed (like those maddening pre-snap penalties, special teams snafus or dumb mistakes that have popped up at the worst possible moments?)

So, does getting someone senior been there-seen that kinda guy like RAC, Pees, Fat Matt to take the load off so BB has the bandwidth to fix other areas during prep week?

Only he can answer that. Tough situation for BB.

Interesting. Hadn’t thought of those points:

 

[Lagaffe_07]

It wasn't under thrown at all, it was a pretty damn good throw, Hyde just made a ridiculously good play and catch. I'll watch it again for a 3rd time but looked like an almost perfect toss if Hyde didn't make a great play.

Hyde was in a position to make a play because Mac threw it late in the wrong spot. The throw was on Agholor inside shoulder. That’s not where you want to throw it with a safety coming in on the play. You want to throw it on the outside should and a little bit more over the top so your receiver is the only one who can make a play on it.

Mac threw it to the only spot where Hyde could make a play. Even being inside of the throw was more over the top of Agholor Hyde wouldn’t have been able to make a play

 

[mb6592]

Mac's taking the hit for his WR.


Agholor didn't bother fighting for the ball, choosing to just go for an over-the-shoulder basket catch. Had he reached for the ball, he'd have gotten it, and gotten the TD.

not to disagree or be a contrarian, but I've read where receivers talk about Mac throwing very easy to catch balls and he just floated it up there with too much air allowing Micah to make that great play. NFL safeties are fast and can close the gap quickly. Don't know if this speaks to Mac's arm strength or choice of delivery but while I agree with your take on Agholor not fighting for the ball, I do think it floated too much for the NFL.

 

[Patnation21]

Something weird happened last night. I don’t know how to rationalize it. This defense isn’t THAT bad. It really didn’t make sense. They looked absolutely horrendous. That was quite literally the worst defensive performance in nfl history.
But if they truly were way too slow and old, etc… there’s simply no way they could have been that effective this year. If they were so slow and old, they would have had to have been a very bad defense.
I get that a mediocre defense can unravel against great competition in the playoffs.
I don’t think you can get exposed as being the worst defense in the nfl if you were a good defense.
If I’m to believe they’re close to as bad as last night looked, it doesn’t make sense that they didn’t struggle way more this year. It’s difficult to know how to view them going into the offseason

The Bills when on are just really really good and can match up any receiver to any of our corners and win that battle. If Allen is on point, it's really hard to stop. They didn't even really have to go to Diggs but when they did he was open. McKenzie is a match up nightmare for us with his speed, that's why they use him against us so much. Will get better.

 

[gitgronked82]

Combination of allen playing lights out and at the times the defense almost seeming disinterested in the game once we were down 20-0.

We just werent good enough.

Yeah, I mean it’s hard to just chalk the bills’ performance up to Allen when we were inept against the run

 

[Patnation21]

Hyde was in a position to make a play because Mac threw it late in the wrong spot. The throw was on Agholor inside shoulder. That’s not where you want to throw it with a safety coming in on the play. You want to throw it on the outside should and a little bit more over the top so your receiver is the only one who can make a play on it.

Mac threw it to the only spot where Hyde could make a play. Even being inside of the throw was more over the top of Agholor Hyde wouldn’t have been able to make a play

Maybe so but it wasn't under thrown. It might have been to the wrong shoulder, I'll have to watch it again. Either way I think it was a good throw that would have been easily caught if not for a great play by Hyde.

 

[Rob0729]

Its actually c. 4M saving (51/53 rule)



Yep, Herron looked serviceable unless you count run blocking. He's a nice backup piece though.
Nevertheless Wynn will be discussed one way or another. If nothing else he was missing in most important game of the season again.
It might be a tough sell for a trade on 10.4M guaranteed despite his capabilities esp. with another strong OL class coming cheap.



They don't. They used it on incentives and Phillips extension.

According to Over the Cap, they still have $3.5 million even after factoring in Phillips' extension.

 

[StockingAnarchyNumber12]

Yeah, I mean it’s hard to just chalk the bills’ performance up to Allen when we were inept against the run

What bothers me the most is the lack of energy that came from our defense. Where was the passion?

Its ok to lose and yes its fine to get beaten down if you just arent good enough, but show some fight. They seemed so disinterested yesterday.

 

[Patriot Missile]

Meh, was gonna do some kind of post but just not in the mood. Not so much that they lost the game, better team won, but just looking into the future seems so uncertain.

Need a LT. thought they had one the whole time with Trent Brown but I defer to the coaches. Wynn could be a great guard imo. Onwenu is a head scratcher, from one of the most promising rookie campaigns to a backup that plays 18 snaps? It will never be addressed to fans just like the Butler benching I guess. So I’ll just assume Michael kicked Nike and slept with Linda in the offseason.

LB’s went from a strength to a detriment in a hurry. Great season by Judon but his lst 5 gameswere fizzled out. Teams running straight at him, getting swallowed up on the edge. Still the best defender on the team. He needs help, Hightower is done.Van Noy and Collins are nearing the end. My biggest hope for the offseason is McGrone and Perkins redshirt years pay off. That is the best and quickest way to fix this group and a long shot at best that it will happen. But one can hope.

Barmore is draft gold. Gonna need a lane stuffer like Tyler Shelvin in this draft. He didnt pan out so far for Cinci but is a work in progress. You get that body type and you coach him up.

Not so worried about McCourty departure, team has good safety depth. JC Jackson leaving would be a death blow regardless whether you consider him elite 1, just a 1 or a elite 2. There’s no-one else.

 

[oldrover]

I tend to doubt it since we haven't forced a BUF punt since Biden took office

 

[Rob0729]

It wasn’t a perfect throw. It was short and on the wrong shoulder. That is what allowed Hyde to make a great play

It was a good throw. It was a 34 yard pass and he threw it to the right area. Receivers are responsible to make adjustments on routes on deep passes because the QB throws the ball before the receiver is remotely close to the spot where the ball comes down. That is on Agholor.

 

[Patriot Missile]

Good is not good enough when you play good teams. The difference between a perfect and a good throw was 7 point and a tie game in the 1st quarter of a playoff game

Please, he’s still a ****ing rookie and gets no slack from anyone. You can look at a bunch of rookie seasons including Josh Allen and see mediocrity at its finest. Mac’s gonna be ok despite throwing a ball 12 inches too short.

 

[ashley]

He hit the rookie wall imo. It happens.

He just wasnt ready yet and no rookie qb has ever been.

Mac was the least of our problems last night....he'll be fine going forward....he actually played well last night.

 

[ashley]

Something weird happened last night. I don’t know how to rationalize it. This defense isn’t THAT bad. It really didn’t make sense. They looked absolutely horrendous. That was quite literally the worst defensive performance in nfl history.
But if they truly were way too slow and old, etc… there’s simply no way they could have been that effective this year. If they were so slow and old, they would have had to have been a very bad defense.
I get that a mediocre defense can unravel against great competition in the playoffs.
I don’t think you can get exposed as being the worst defense in the nfl if you were a good defense.
If I’m to believe they’re close to as bad as last night looked, it doesn’t make sense that they didn’t struggle way more this year. It’s difficult to know how to view them going into the offseason

Good post......just something about this defense all year, we were never able to get that big stop when we needed it...cost us a few games early on.....Allen was again the best player on the field last night...sometimes you have to tip your hat...but agree, this defense was very weird last night.