Official 2022 Tompa Bay Gronkaneers Thread

[skinnydog]

They should go no huddle every other drive to keep the defenses off balance but it won't happen. The 'head coach' has said he's worried about tiring out the defense. He's worried about TB12 throwing INTs with the game on the line so he won't use timeouts. He's so worried about making sure his side of the ball looks decent that he's hurting the already bad offense. The play sequencing and calling is bad on top of it. They are a bad team and the defense is mediocre. Once they play a real QB this team has about 0% chance.

No huddle does not always mean up tempo. The Pats used to do that a lot and let the play clock wind down while they were already at the line of scrimmage. It does mean that if you don’t substitute players the defense generally can’t either.

 

[VectorPrime]

I touched on this in the main forum but I'll add here about the Bucs rookie TEs. Firstly we can dispel any notion of Brady being unwilling to work with rookies (see production of White, Otton and Kieft). Secondly, look the TEs, their draft positions, and their production so far...

Cade Otton (4th rd) and Ko Kieft (6th rd)
38 receptions
378 yards
3 TDs

Compared with the TEs taken by Belichick in the 2020 draft...

Devin Asiasi (3rd rd) and Dalton Keene (3rd rd)
combined career totals
5 receptions
45 yards
1 TD

Who got that right? Licht or Belichick?

...

************ this is damning.

 

[RicoG]

I touched on this in the main forum but I'll add here about the Bucs rookie TEs. Firstly we can dispel any notion of Brady being unwilling to work with rookies (see production of White, Otton and Kieft). Secondly, look the TEs, their draft positions, and their production so far...

Cade Otton (4th rd) and Ko Kieft (6th rd)
38 receptions
378 yards
3 TDs

Compared with the TEs taken by Belichick in the 2020 draft...

Devin Asiasi (3rd rd) and Dalton Keene (3rd rd)
combined career totals
5 receptions
45 yards
1 TD

Who got that right? Licht or Belichick?

I can't remember who BB got to replace Gronk in 2019 but they were just as bad. Every time they were asked to block, the rushers ran right through them or around them giving Brady no time to throw.

 

[RicoG]

Interesting. It sure does sound like Payton wants to coach Brady.

Since NO has Payton's rights, allowing him to go to the Bucs is out of the question. But what if NO convinces Payton to come back to them. They don't have a set QB, so bringing in Brady is quite possible.

 

[TB12TheGoat]

Interesting. It sure does sound like Payton wants to coach Brady.

Since NO has Payton's rights, allowing him to go to the Bucs is out of the question. But what if NO convinces Payton to come back to them. They don't have a set QB, so bringing in Brady is quite possible.

I was thinking if Brady comes back

without Payton
49ers
Raiders
Titans

with Payton
Saints
Colts
Lions
Vikings

 

[gobesmug]

Which team has a need for a new HC and QB? Sounds like Payton might know something which indicates him and Brady want to pair up like it was rumored in Miami

 

[Deus Irae]

Which team has a need for a new HC and QB? Sounds like Payton might know something which indicates him and Brady want to pair up like it was rumored in Miami

I'm not sold on either Brady leaving or Brady pairing with Payton outside of the Miami spot, and Miami's no longer viable. But, to play along, both would want a team with sufficient surrounding talent and/or cap room. And it would need to be teams willing to move on from their coach/QB situation. So:

Colts
Seahawks



Off the top of my head, I don't think there's a fit with any other teams and both QB/coach. Some will point to New Orleans, but that would be a terrible look for Payton.

 

[Tottie]

I'm not sold on either Brady leaving or Brady pairing with Payton outside of the Miami spot, and Miami's no longer viable. But, to play along, both would want a team with sufficient surrounding talent and/or cap room. And it would need to be teams willing to move on from their coach/QB situation. So:

Colts
Seahawks



Off the top of my head, I don't think there's a fit with any other teams and both QB/coach. Some will point to New Orleans, but that would be a terrible look for Payton.

NO makes alot of sense. I think if Payton wanted to go there they would take him back, but I agree that it won't happen. They have a defense with a #1 pass rusher and a #1 CB, they have a real #1 RB who can catch, they have Olave and maybe Thomas if he can get healthy. They would win the division there with Brady and Sean. I think Brady retires and Payton goes somewhere with a good younger QB. If they team up they basically have 1 season? Brady already looks scared to get hit.

 

[venecol]

Brady will be 46 by the time 2023 season begins. No team is going out of their way to sign a 46 yo GOAT to learn a new system, regardless of what you all believe.

Then there's the kids that live in Florida with Mom. Brady isn't going to Indianapolis, Detroit, Vegas, Sanfran, LA, NY, NO, Foxboro (lol), or anywhere else that takes him more than a 45 minute plane ride to be with his kids during the week. He either returns to Tampa or retires & collects $50M per year sitting in the Fox booth.

I have no idea what he'll do, but if I had to put $$ on it, I'd say he retires. Hope I'm wrong. He's still got it.

 

[crawhammer]

I can't remember who BB got to replace Gronk in 2019 but they were just as bad. Every time they were asked to block, the rushers ran right through them or around them giving Brady no time to throw.

The TEs were wretched in 2019... Ben Watson, Matt LaCosse and Ryan Izzo. Belichick hasn't been able to sort out the TE position since Gronk left and he even tried to jettison Gronk a season too early. Those scrubs in 2019. Then the blatant whiffs on Asiasi and Keene. Hunter Henry was decent last season but his production is way down now like everyone else. Jonnu Smith has been an awful FA acquisition.

I was thinking if Brady comes back

without Payton
49ers
Raiders
Titans

with Payton
Saints
Colts
Lions
Vikings

Working nearly anywhere with Payton for a couple seasons would be ideal for Brady. I've been talking up Detroit as a remote landing spot for Brady but with the Lions actually winning some games now that dumb organization will probably retain meathead Campbell. Payton and Brady in New Orleans sounds like a formula for success... good young talent on offense and a stout defense. The Garoppolo injury is a significant boost to Brady getting to SF... they're not winning anything this season with the last pick of the draft at quarterback. The Raiders may be trending toward a wild card spot after their dismal start so if that were to happen then they likely won't move on from Carr (who Adams also likes).

 

[crawhammer]

I have no idea what he'll do, but if I had to put $$ on it, I'd say he retires. Hope I'm wrong. He's still got it.

Retirement seems very unlikely. I could see Brady staying in Tampa Bay but only if they remove Bowles as the HC. They can get rid of Leftwich too and bring in Payton as the HC/OC.

 

[venecol]

Retirement seems very unlikely. I could see Brady staying in Tampa Bay but only if they remove Bowles as the HC. They can get rid of Leftwich too and bring in Payton as the HC/OC.

I know a lot of you here decry the HC/OC but Brady doesn't seem to have an issue with them. Brady isn't like the rest of Patsfans, blaming everything on the Patriots coaches. He knows players have to execute better. They've left a ton of plays on the field. Are there dumb play calls or bad HC decisions? Sure. But how many times have we seen Evans not make a play that he should have. How many passes have we seen receivers drop? How many holding calls on the OL? How many passes thrown by Tom over wide open receivers.

Tom knows that once they click, they'll be unstoppable. They have to continue to try to run the ball. Bowles is right. Can't go into the playoffs being 1-dimensional or they'll get creamed. They are getting close.

Can't wait to see how they do against 9ers. That'll be a tough match, just like last night.

 

[VectorPrime]

I mean there is quite obviously something systematically wrong with the Bucs right now where their offense literally cant do anything until Brady seems to just go "f.uck it" and directs everything himself. Which is fantastic for late game situations but you can't do that all game every game, he needs an actual OC. And if the issue isn't the OC, or the HC, then what is it? Is it Brady himself then? Well then obviously he won't want to stay because he must just hate everyone there or something.

I mean I'm a Brady homer and proudly so. So don't be shocked that I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt on this one. Something around him isn't right, and maybe it's the entire organization fat and happy after the last two years and Brady knows they just aren't really invested. Hell if I know.

 

[Deus Irae]

I mean there is quite obviously something systematically wrong with the Bucs right now where their offense literally cant do anything until Brady seems to just go "f.uck it" and directs everything himself. Which is fantastic for late game situations but you can't do that all game every game, he needs an actual OC. And if the issue isn't the OC, or the HC, then what is it? Is it Brady himself then? Well then obviously he won't want to stay because he must just hate everyone there or something.

I mean I'm a Brady homer and proudly so. So don't be shocked that I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt on this one. Something around him isn't right, and maybe it's the entire organization fat and happy after the last two years and Brady knows they just aren't really invested. Hell if I know.

I know I've said this a bunch, but it remains true. Even the best QBs can only make up for so much (Just ask Mahomes about that SB game). In Tampa, even ignoring any coaching issues, Brady's dealing with:


Terrible OL play, both among starters and backups in due to injury
Injured and struggling WRs
Injured and rookie TEs
A RB1 who needs OL help to keep him clean long enough to build up steam
A Rb2 who's not a power guy and shouldn't be doing power runs on 1st or 3rd down, at least this year.
A lack of a FB to help a struggling line


And that's just on the offensive side of the ball.


Or, to put it another way, take Brady and swap him with the QBs on the Bills, Chiefs, Bengals, or Eagles, and the teams would have basically the same records they have now.

 

[crawhammer]

I know a lot of you here decry the HC/OC but Brady doesn't seem to have an issue with them. Brady isn't like the rest of Patsfans, blaming everything on the Patriots coaches. He knows players have to execute better. They've left a ton of plays on the field. Are there dumb play calls or bad HC decisions? Sure. But how many times have we seen Evans not make a play that he should have. How many passes have we seen receivers drop? How many holding calls on the OL? How many passes thrown by Tom over wide open receivers.

Tom knows that once they click, they'll be unstoppable. They have to continue to try to run the ball. Bowles is right. Can't go into the playoffs being 1-dimensional or they'll get creamed. They are getting close.

Can't wait to see how they do against 9ers. That'll be a tough match, just like last night.

Bowles is terrible. Does anyone disagree with that? He's hurting the team with his incompetence. They punted twice yesterday when they shouldn't have (both punts were hideous too)... the first time was egregious and the second one he got extremely lucky with Ingram inexplicably stepping out of bounds after a wide open reception and the Saints stupidly passing on 3rd-1 from the TAM44.

The play-calling has been putrid from Leftwich. Their best scoring drives of the season have been with Brady mostly calling plays at the LOS. And they were doing it again last night with all of these inept rushes on 1st down. I don't see this running game clicking by the end of the season, it's just been so bad for the majority of 12 games. They're going to win games offensively on Brady's arm.

SF obviously is going to present a stiff challenge for the Bucs offense. Statistically the best defense in the NFL. Very likely another game under 20 points for the Bucs offense.

 

[PatsWSB47]

I know a lot of you here decry the HC/OC but Brady doesn't seem to have an issue with them. Brady isn't like the rest of Patsfans, blaming everything on the Patriots coaches. He knows players have to execute better. They've left a ton of plays on the field. Are there dumb play calls or bad HC decisions? Sure. But how many times have we seen Evans not make a play that he should have. How many passes have we seen receivers drop? How many holding calls on the OL? How many passes thrown by Tom over wide open receivers.

Tom knows that once they click, they'll be unstoppable. They have to continue to try to run the ball. Bowles is right. Can't go into the playoffs being 1-dimensional or they'll get creamed. They are getting close.

Can't wait to see how they do against 9ers. That'll be a tough match, just like last night.

I'm not as optimistic because of the O line. Brady's throws are off. He has no confidence in the line so it's kind of a mental thing. He clearly hasn't lost much with his arm talent.

 

[venecol]

I mean there is quite obviously something systematically wrong with the Bucs right now where their offense literally cant do anything until Brady seems to just go "f.uck it" and directs everything himself. Which is fantastic for late game situations but you can't do that all game every game, he needs an actual OC. And if the issue isn't the OC, or the HC, then what is it? Is it Brady himself then? Well then obviously he won't want to stay because he must just hate everyone there or something.

I mean I'm a Brady homer and proudly so. So don't be shocked that I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt on this one. Something around him isn't right, and maybe it's the entire organization fat and happy after the last two years and Brady knows they just aren't really invested. Hell if I know.

I don't know what it is. I think it starts with the OL. It was a mistake to start Goedeke. That's on Bowles. They should've gone with the experienced back-up instead of the rookie. Yet, they won their 1st two games with the rookie. Obviously, Jensen being out. Now Wirfs. Smith has been a penalty machine.

We have 2 new skill players that were supposed to be starters. Julio wasn't available for several games. Gage then developed a nagging hamstring injury. They had to get Beasley off his couch for pete's sake. Godwin took time to come back. At one point Tom was throwing to Beasley, Darden, Perriman and Scooter. The biggest head scratcher is Evans. Like WTF?

The TE1 what's his name is crap. The imported TE is washed up. Thank god Otter is at least reliable.

Hicks was out for several games. Then they lose Barrett. The secondary has been constantly injured again this year. McCollum is terrible (which is disappointing). Delaney? SMB, Edwards, Winfield, Ryan, Neal all missed games.

I would say the #1 issue has been injuries. Fortunately, only Barrett & Jensen's have been season ending (so far).

Even Tom has been off at times, especially around the time before the divorce announcement.

I just hope everyone gets healthy for this last stretch and begin to click like they did at the end of 2020 season and go on a tear.

Edit: I see Deus said same thing while I was typing.

 

[venecol]

Bowles is terrible. Does anyone disagree with that? He's hurting the team with his incompetence. They punted twice yesterday when they shouldn't have (both punts were hideous too)... the first time was egregious and the second one he got extremely lucky with Ingram inexplicably stepping out of bounds after a wide open reception and the Saints stupidly passing on 3rd-1 from the TAM44.

The play-calling has been putrid from Leftwich. Their best scoring drives of the season have been with Brady mostly calling plays at the LOS. And they were doing it again last night with all of these inept rushes on 1st down. I don't see this running game clicking by the end of the season, it's just been so bad for the majority of 12 games. They're going to win games offensively on Brady's arm.

SF obviously is going to present a stiff challenge for the Bucs offense. Statistically the best defense in the NFL. Very likely another game under 20 points for the Bucs offense.

Yea, whatever man. You sound just like the Pats homers blaming everything on Patricia. I mean, I think he sucks but the players aren't executing the plays being called, their OL has been hampered with injuries and poor play. It is what it is.

I enjoy watching the players execute. I'm confident once they all click barring any more key injuries, they'll make it work. Unlike the Pats, the talent is there. No excuses.

I don't complain about coaches or refs. It's part of the game. The good teams find ways to win. The bad ones don't (regardless of coaching).

 

[crawhammer]

Yea, whatever man. You sound just like the Pats homers blaming everything on Patricia. I mean, I think he sucks but the players aren't executing the plays being called, their OL has been hampered with injuries and poor play. It is what it is.

I enjoy watching the players execute. I'm confident once they all click barring any more key injuries, they'll make it work. Unlike the Pats, the talent is there. No excuses.

I don't complain about coaches or refs. It's part of the game. The good teams find ways to win. The bad ones don't (regardless of coaching).

I'm critical of the players too. O-line sucks but it's riddled with injuries. Running backs have been bad at their primary responsibility... running. WRs have been inconsistent. Evans is weirdly having a bad season. Look, Brady sucked last night until he pulled off one of the greatest regular season comebacks of his entire career. Defense hasn't executed in a couple of critical late game situations.

But hell, Bowles is a bum. And Pats fans are blaming Patricia for applicable issues... like this mickie mouse he's put together and his play-calling. He's also the coach of the o-line. He deserves some blame. Belichick more because ultimately he's responsible for Patricia being in that position and he put together the roster.

I'll add this too, even good coaches find ways to lose. See Belichick in SB 51 as example 1a.

 

[VectorPrime]