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NFL QB situations are sad

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Oct 24th

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farn

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NFL QB value rankings: Who do you want most at current cost?

I know they offer several different ways of judging what teams are in the best positions. But you only need to go down a few spots on the list to see how bereft the League is at « quality QB ».

Wants being so high, even after injuries and lack of success outside of one 3/4 SB season (thanks to Foles) is all you need to know.
 

Vatahala

In the Starting Line-Up
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After Goff and Wentz signed $30 plus million a year 4 year extensions after their 3rd year and then did little to justify the contract you would think other teams would take notice and slow their roll.

It seems Mahomes will get a $40 million a year extension this year.

It just doesn't make sense to me, what's the hurry.

A 1st round QB belongs to the team for 7 years why not wait longer to make sure injuries or poor play don't effect the value of a QB's next contract.
 

Ice_Ice_Brady

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After Goff and Wentz signed $30 plus million a year 4 year extensions after their 3rd year and then did little to justify the contract you would think other teams would take notice and slow their roll.

It seems Mahomes will get a $40 million a year extension this year.

It just doesn't make sense to me, what's the hurry.

A 1st round QB belongs to the team for 7 years why not wait longer to make sure injuries or poor play don't effect the value of a QB's next contract.

I'd be very interested in seeing a team refuse to pay QB money and go with rookie contract QBs. In fact I wonder if the Patriots might be thinking along those lines. Sure, there's a lot of risk, but it's near impossible to get a real advantage over other teams when your QB makes $35M. We've seen all of these franchises fall into mediocrity, or even below mediocrity, despite having a franchise QB.
 

farn

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I'd be very interested in seeing a team refuse to pay QB money and go with rookie contract QBs. In fact I wonder if the Patriots might be thinking along those lines. Sure, there's a lot of risk, but it's near impossible to get a real advantage over other teams when your QB makes $35M. We've seen all of these franchises fall into mediocrity, or even below mediocrity, despite having a franchise QB.
Risky, but when you look at the choices... yikes. Ryan ? Wentz ? The two QBs I’d think are worthwhile : Mahomes & Wilson. But even there, I think Mahomes $ will be huge. And while he does produce, I wonder if KC will be able to build a team around him. I’m guessing “no”.
 

fxmallon

On the Game Day Roster
Except for Mahomes, I wouldn't pay any QB over 30m, and I'd want to wait a little longer even on him. The big money just leaves a team too thin, and overworked, overstretched... which means more injuries... and now in 17 games to boot.
 

Pape

In the Starting Line-Up
It seems Mahomes will get a $40 million a year extension this year.

there was some discussion on pft that Mahomes might go for a cap percentage instead of a constant dollar contract ... interesting concept ...

still though, 40 million is a **** ton of money ... Wilson is at 35m, which is the high water mark so far... thats a big jump up, 35 to 40
 

Ice_Ice_Brady

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Risky, but when you look at the choices... yikes. Ryan ? Wentz ? The two QBs I’d think are worthwhile : Mahomes & Wilson. But even there, I think Mahomes $ will be huge. And while he does produce, I wonder if KC will be able to build a team around him. I’m guessing “no”.

If you have a prime Brady, Mahomes or Wilson, this wouldn’t apply. I mean, you just can’t pass on that and just have to hope the QB takes less to win more. But for the other 90% of teams who don’t have true all-time great QB, then I think it makes sense. I mean, these guys aren’t getting it done at that salary. They aren’t good enough to overcome the other roster problems it causes:

Goff
Ryan
Wentz
Carr
Cousins
Stafford
Tannehill (you’ll see soon - fluke)
Rivers
Prescott (you’ll see soon - lol)
 

mgteich

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I'd be very interested in seeing a team refuse to pay QB money and go with rookie contract QBs. In fact I wonder if the Patriots might be thinking along those lines. Sure, there's a lot of risk, but it's near impossible to get a real advantage over other teams when your QB makes $35M. We've seen all of these franchises fall into mediocrity, or even below mediocrity, despite having a franchise QB.

All the teams with the top 10 quarterbacks are in contention for the playoffs. I guess I don't understand why it is wrong to have a top quarterback. Yes, I understand that these team will eb in cap hell, or so posters here always seem to think. How long did Manning and Wilson have their teams in cap hell while they were 2 of the top 2 teams in the league?
 

farn

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All the teams with the top 10 quarterbacks are in contention for the playoffs. I guess I don't understand why it is wrong to have a top quarterback. Yes, I understand that these team will eb in cap hell, or so posters here always seem to think. How long did Manning and Wilson have their teams in cap hell while they were 2 of the top 2 teams in the league?
Wilson’s only one once. Both times Manning has won, it was “despite” not because... so I guess (1) Wilson only won the SB when his salary was low and hasn’t been that close to the big game since making major $ (2) both Indy and Denver were able to surround Manning with a good team, one each, despite Manning’s contract.
 

FreeTedWilliams

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Just on an off note, how does the guy who traded up to take Trubisky over both Mahomes and Watson still have a job?
 

farn

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Just on an off note, how does the guy who traded up to take Trubisky over both Mahomes and Watson still have a job?
Should be a very tough pill to swallow for the owner. Even if they had bypassed Mahomes and snagged Watson, there'd be much more hope...

Bears had the cast to contend - and they blew it.
 

Pat the Pats Fan

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Ravens come to mind. While they still had killer and reed, flacco played out of his mind in the playoffs and got them the harbawl bowl win. Then the ravens paid him huge bucks, biggest qb contract at the time if I recall. Killer and reed moved on and the ravens started struggling, and they moved on to a rookie contract qb.
 

bresna

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All this talk about Mahomes getting this huge contract extension... are you all forgetting that KC has a whole $177.00 in cap space? :)
 

jah

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After Goff and Wentz signed $30 plus million a year 4 year extensions after their 3rd year and then did little to justify the contract you would think other teams would take notice and slow their roll.

It seems Mahomes will get a $40 million a year extension this year.

It just doesn't make sense to me, what's the hurry.

A 1st round QB belongs to the team for 7 years why not wait longer to make sure injuries or poor play don't effect the value of a QB's next contract.

If you wait that long, you run the risk of disgruntling that QB and even a potential holdout. Mahomes' agent almost certainly knows they can get $40M/year from someone sooner than that. It's an act of good faith that could pay off for the team long term in abstract ways such as increased effort from not just that one player, but all of them who see they could be taken care of similarly. It could also pay off long term concretely by the player potentially being more willing to extend for less later on.

Your post also brings up a point that, while valid, also goes both ways: anything can happen between year 3 and year 7. The team might be worried about extending after year 3 because the player could lose motivation; why, then, would the player be wrong to worry about what happens if he doesn't sign that extension and immediately gets a career altering injury? We as fans tend to only care about what's best for the organization's chances of winning games, but we're talking about people's livelihoods.

Could that put the Chiefs in cap hell and make them no longer competitive? Sure, I hope so at least. But I understand why they'd pay him sooner rather than later.
 

Vatahala

In the Starting Line-Up
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If you wait that long, you run the risk of disgruntling that QB and even a potential holdout. Mahomes' agent almost certainly knows they can get $40M/year from someone sooner than that. It's an act of good faith that could pay off for the team long term in abstract ways such as increased effort from not just that one player, but all of them who see they could be taken care of similarly. It could also pay off long term concretely by the player potentially being more willing to extend for less later on.

Your post also brings up a point that, while valid, also goes both ways: anything can happen between year 3 and year 7. The team might be worried about extending after year 3 because the player could lose motivation; why, then, would the player be wrong to worry about what happens if he doesn't sign that extension and immediately gets a career altering injury? We as fans tend to only care about what's best for the organization's chances of winning games, but we're talking about people's livelihoods.

Could that put the Chiefs in cap hell and make them no longer competitive? Sure, I hope so at least. But I understand why they'd pay him sooner rather than later.

Mahomes agent has no leverage with what other teams might pay him.

KC owns him for 7 years and although the last 2 would be costly as a franchise player it would still be less than if he was on the open market.

Its a question of the needs of 1 over the needs of many.

Is there anything preventing KC offering Mahomes a piece of the ownership in addition to salary?
 

jah

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Mahomes agent has no leverage with what other teams might pay him.

KC owns him for 7 years and although the last 2 would be costly as a franchise player it would still be less than if he was on the open market.

Its a question of the needs of 1 over the needs of many.

Is there anything preventing KC offering Mahomes a piece of the ownership in addition to salary?

I imagine giving him part of the team would be very much considered circumventing the cap, which is good news for us.
 

mgteich

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All this talk about Mahomes getting this huge contract extension... are you all forgetting that KC has a whole $177.00 in cap space? :)
I believe that they have $3.5M after extending their WR. In any case, his new contract will be in 2021.
 

borg

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Can’t let a rookie contract stud QB reach the franchise tag ever.
Once that happens.....
the team faces a huge 1 season cap hit
the team will also be negotiating based on significantly higher tag $$$ in years 2 and 3 of tags. (120%, 144%).
Lost leverage, massive cap hits, less money for rest of roster.....installing a long term roster game plan gets handcuffed
 

STUB STUB

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A $30M QB in 2019 would account for 15.1% of the salary cap, which would easily be the highest percentage ever on a team to win a superbowl in the modern NFL.

Superbowl winning QBs by % of salary cap:
Year Name Cap %
1994 Young 13.10%
1995 Aikman 6.70%
1996 Favre 10.20%
1997 Elway 5.20%
1998 Elway 5.00%
1999 Warner 1.30%
2000 Dilfer 1.60%
2001 Brady 0.47%
2002 Johnson 9.60%
2003 Brady 4.40%
2004 Brady 6.30%
2005 Roethlisberger 4.90%
2006 P. Manning 10.40%
2007 E. Manning 9.20%
2008 Roethlisberger 6.80%
2009 Brees 8.30%
2011 E. Manning 11.70%
2012 Flacco 6.60%
2013 Wilson 0.56%
2014 Brady 10.64%
2015 P. Manning 11.66%
2016 Brady 8.62%
2017 Foles 0.91%
2018 Brady 11.3%
2019 Mahomes 2.7%

1994-2017 Source
 
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