National Championship GDT: Bama/OSU

[DropKickFlutie]

Don't forget that Waddle is also an electrifying kick returner.

Damn we're gonna waste our first rounder again for sure then. Pats falling off a cliff.

 

[PaulThePat]

Damn we're gonna waste our first rounder again for sure then. Pats falling off a cliff.

I'd take Mac Jones in the first round. Replaced Tua and for me is a better NFL fit than Tua.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Make your case as to why Waddle is not worthy of a 1st round pick based on his on-field performance, technique, ability, etc.

Doesn't seem good-faith to keep arguing he's not a 1st round player based on some stats/production in a vacuum that another poster clarified/contextualized for you in light of his injury.

Production is one variable but there are plenty of others. Not all productive collegiate players make good pros, and vice versa, not all unproductive collegiate players make bad pros. There are a lot of factors to weigh and consider.

The question I would ask you is:

Waddle's production clearly concerns you and leads you to believe he will not be a good player in the NFL. What about his technique/ability causes his production to suffer in your opinion? What about his technique/ability is holding him back from producing at a higher level? Genuine questions.

It's draft season. Everyone has there crushes and Smith is everyone's favorite rn. I stopped paying attention to it years ago. Can't rain too much on people's parades but this where you have to be objective and look at real analysis. Not just someone's new crush. Also sounds like someone got around to reading Jeremiah's report on Smith where he comp'd him to Marvin Harrison from July.

Counter: How many guys under 6'1/180 have been drafted in round one went on to have great careers in the NFL? Now forget round one and pick any round. It's a small list and uninspiring one. I'm sure Smith will come in over 180 for the combine but no matter he's a small WR and there's nothing in the past for teams to grab onto. You're betting entirely on Smith. NFL teams will have to be in love with him bc he is a gamble. That's not up for debate. There are a lot more guys that didn't produce in college to go on to have successful NFL careers than guys his size to do the same. Again in terms of profile he doesn't have any trends in his favor there. Teams & GM's like to be reassured by film, testing, size etc and he's on an island by himself essentially.

Anyway he isn't without concerns just like any other prospect.


For the record I love Smith. I think he'll be a good player but how much better than his peers? Is he going to consistently outproduce his peers? The draft is about value and need meeting and right now I believe Smith is overvalued as a top 5-10 overall pick.

 

[PF_SU]

It's draft season. Everyone has there crushes and Smith is everyone's favorite rn. I stopped paying attention to it years ago. Can't rain too much on people's parades but this where you have to be objective and look at real analysis. Not just someone's new crush. Also sounds like someone got around to reading Jeremiah's report on Smith where he comp'd him to Marvin Harrison from July.

Counter: How many guys under 6'1/180 have been drafted in round one went on to have great careers in the NFL? Now forget round one and pick any round. It's a small list and uninspiring one. I'm sure Smith will come in over 180 for the combine but no matter he's a small WR and there's nothing in the past for teams to grab onto. You're betting entirely on Smith. NFL teams will have to be in love with him bc he is a gamble. That's not up for debate. There are a lot more guys that didn't produce in college to go on to have successful NFL careers than guys his size to do the same. Again in terms of profile he doesn't have any trends in his favor there. Teams & GM's like to be reassured by film, testing, size etc and he's on an island by himself essentially.

Anyway he isn't without concerns just like any other prospect.


For the record I love Smith. I think he'll be a good player but how much better than his peers? Is he going to consistently outproduce his peers? The draft is about value and need meeting and right now I believe Smith is overvalued as a top 5-10 overall pick.

What's your opinion on Waddle? Because from a size perspective, Waddle seems to be even smaller at around 5-10 and 180 (and also because dreighver was specifically asking about Waddle).

 

[Ras-IR Dowling]

Sounds like Bill O’Brien is expected to take over for Sarkisian as Bamas new OC.

 

[nextsuperstar]

So Jones is out of reach now right?

If He goes before the Patriots pick, Wilson or Fields would likely fall.

 

[Triumph]

Mac Jones our next QB. Get him bill and put some weapons around him.

Another guy pointed out Mac in reverse is Cam.

Jones will be a bust without that Bama supporting cast. Bama just keeps reloading and every Tide QB is the best in the country.

 

[Triumph]

If He goes before the Patriots pick, Wilson or Fields would likely fall.

Fields would be a mistake.

 

[borg]

Both from Jacksonville area. Jones went to Bolles, Tebow to Nease and Trinity Christian

Mac's Bolles HS highlight reel is tremendous. Just toyed with the opposition.
Bolles is quite a sports school. Their swim team is essentially USA Swimming's farm team

 

[jdlboot14]

I thought Pats had a chance to get Jones in the lower 1st round, but such is the knee-jerk league - he'll be going in the top 10 now, just based on that championship game. Also, Devonta looks like a superhero out there, but he won't last in the NFL with that frame.
Fields probably dropped himself to at least the 4th QB taken. But, I want nothing to do with him.

 

[notex]

I like Waddle

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

What's your opinion on Waddle? Because from a size perspective, Waddle seems to be even smaller at around 5-10 and 180 (and also because dreighver was specifically asking about Waddle).

They're both small, no doubt. This is where it gets tricky. Waddle is 185, thicker and looks like he has a frame that can handle a few more pounds. Smith was rumored to be around 175-179. Again it's not so much the 4-5 pounds but the #'s telling me there's risk involved with Smith. So I'm just acknowledging it considering I might be buying stock in this investment. Will post specific thoughts on Waddle in my thread in a few to keep it in there.

Waddle is the guy that will change a look on defense. Get them in bad matchups, make them declare their intentions early. Big play, decoy for others, field stretcher in every way. Smith should always be more consistent. Security blanket. Chain mover but needs help in terms of who's around him. Like not sure he can handle outside duties full-time. Smith is a QB's favorite target. One of the best r/r on the team. Waddle gets the whole team fired up through returns on ST, reverses and deep bombs. Smith might get an opposing teams CB1 while a DC brackets Waddle.

Ideally you want one of each on your team. You want a well-rounded wr Corp.

 

[nextsuperstar]

I thought Pats had a chance to get Jones in the lower 1st round, but such is the knee-jerk league - he'll be going in the top 10 now, just based on that championship game. Also, Devonta looks like a superhero out there, but he won't last in the NFL with that frame.
Fields probably dropped himself to at least the 4th QB taken. But, I want nothing to do with him.

I’m not sure on game ever really affects QB rankings that much to cause someone like Fields to drop that much. NFL teams have over 20 games of tape and two years of production to go on.

Fields probably would not have thrown at the combine, even if this was a normal year.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

I’m not sure on game ever really affects QB rankings that much to cause someone like Fields to drop that much. NFL teams have over 20 games of tape and two years of production to go on.

Fields probably would not have thrown at the combine, even if this was a normal year.

Some games stick out for good or bad. No serious person making decisions or just someone who takes this serious, is in or out on a prospect over a game or a play. Not happening.

Twitter is terrible with this and become terrible in general when it comes to draft stuff. So minute by minute. Looking and worrying about the wrong things.

I was taught a while back to always seek out a prospects bad film. Especially on QB's. You want to see how bad someone is. What kind of bad, there's level to it. You can work with some bad but the wrong kind of terrible will go nowhere. Almost a bad litmus test of sorts. It's a must for QB's with me. I'm not even worrying about it in terms of + or - but again rather a threshold thing. Some prospects just don't have it and there's no need to waste anyone's time. I don't pay too much attention to but want to see deal breakers.

 

[captain stone]

Fields would be a mistake.

Yep.

Dear 8-pound, 6-ounce Baby Jesus, with your golden fleece diapers...Please have the J-E-T-E hire Dougie Peterson as their next HC and then draft Justin Fields with the #2 overall pick...Thank you for all your power & grace, Amen.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

It's draft season. Everyone has there crushes and Smith is everyone's favorite rn. I stopped paying attention to it years ago. Can't rain too much on people's parades but this where you have to be objective and look at real analysis. Not just someone's new crush. Also sounds like someone got around to reading Jeremiah's report on Smith where he comp'd him to Marvin Harrison from July.

Counter: How many guys under 6'1/180 have been drafted in round one went on to have great careers in the NFL? Now forget round one and pick any round. It's a small list and uninspiring one. I'm sure Smith will come in over 180 for the combine but no matter he's a small WR and there's nothing in the past for teams to grab onto. You're betting entirely on Smith. NFL teams will have to be in love with him bc he is a gamble. That's not up for debate. There are a lot more guys that didn't produce in college to go on to have successful NFL careers than guys his size to do the same. Again in terms of profile he doesn't have any trends in his favor there. Teams & GM's like to be reassured by film, testing, size etc and he's on an island by himself essentially.

Anyway he isn't without concerns just like any other prospect.


For the record I love Smith. I think he'll be a good player but how much better than his peers? Is he going to consistently outproduce his peers? The draft is about value and need meeting and right now I believe Smith is overvalued as a top 5-10 overall pick.

Body type is overrated. We draft busted on Chad Jackson, NKeal Harry, and trade busted on Sanu due to body type. Meanwhile our best receivers have been short Welker, Edelman, and Meyers is also slim.

To answer your question, Marvin Harrison had a similar body type as Devonta.

 

[PaulThePat]

Mac Jones first took over from Tua on the road against Auburn. After a couple of picks he eventually settled down and slung it as good as Tua could have done. Couple of pinpoint drops over the defenders into the endzone for TDs showed both poise and accuracy under intense pressure. He then won a bowl game and has now had an unbeaten season. I'm no draftnik but this kid is for real and will have a solid NFL career. Think it's easy to dismiss him as just another Alabama QB but that's a lazy out. For me he's a better NFL prospect/fit than both of his predecessors i.e. Hurts and Tua.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

Sounds like Bill O’Brien is expected to take over for Sarkisian as Bamas new OC.

Wish O'Brien came back as OC here.

 

[bormio]

Mac Jones first took over from Tua on the road against Auburn. After a couple of picks he eventually settled down and slung it as good as Tua could have done. Couple of pinpoint drops over the defenders into the endzone for TDs showed both poise and accuracy under intense pressure. He then won a bowl game and has now had an unbeaten season. I'm no draftnik but this kid is for real and will have a solid NFL career. Think it's easy to dismiss him as just another Alabama QB but that's a lazy out. For me he's a better NFL prospect/fit than both of his predecessors i.e. Hurts and Tua.

With Smith out in the second half and Harris not that effective rushing, Jones continued to light it up in the second half. People will want to see him make the 20 yard throw into tight windows (Smith was 5 yards open all night and most of the year), but nothing about his mechanics suggests he can’t.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

Any word on Ohio State's request that the NCAA "find" 29 more points for them in last night's game?