Mike Lombardi on the Jamie Collins trade..

[condon84]

Minus just the tiny little fact that Belichick is the best coach of all time and Hillary one of the worst candidates of all time...

If BB thought Collin's play was hurting the team and couldn't get him to 'do his job' rather than just freelancing, then it's the right move. BB has more than proven that you need players that play as a team and follow the gameplan and coaching. Talent doesn't mean anything if you are ignoring the coaching. If BB thinks he was hurting the team, then it's a good trade. No one in the media or here on the forum knows better than BB. No one.

Agreed.

No matter how crazy this trade seems to be, BB has earned the right to pull this type of sh!t off and for us to trust him.

On to the bye week!

 

[Adam Seward]

I'm bummed for sure that Collins didn't fall in line and was looking for the moon as a payday. He had all the tools to be a legend and that wasn't a secret.

Bill has an acquaintance with, or has buddies who know Jack Welch and are familiar with his motivation tactics; turn over 10% every year to keep the remaining 90% hungry. I'm sure this is somewhere along the lines of removing a detriment to the team building aspect and letting everyone else know if you want to freelance have fun doing so in a winless doldrum like Cleveland.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

Wait....

You don't get the weekly survey calls from the Patriots?

I actually did get a call on this very subject from a polling company, a robocall. Here it is verbatim:
"The Patriots' BB has just traded away their most valuable player without regard for compensation or how the fans feel. This has diminished the Patriots' chances to win another SB. Tom Brady, who has deflated footballs, will now win less games and the players now hate their coach. Question, do you think BB should listen to the fans and media when making his player personnel decisions?" ((survey initiated and sanctioned by the ESPN-Roger Goodell polling company))

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

I'm bummed for sure that Collins didn't fall in line and was looking for the moon as a payday. He had all the tools to be a legend and that wasn't a secret.

Bill has an acquaintance with, or has buddies who know Jack Welch and are familiar with his motivation tactics; turn over 10% every year to keep the remaining 90% hungry. I'm sure this is somewhere along the lines of removing a detriment to the team building aspect and letting everyone else know if you want to freelance have fun doing so in a winless doldrum like Cleveland.

(If memory serves me) Tuna was a believer in this too. ****can a fan/media untouchable whose perceived value likely outstrips his true value to the team/winning. Send a message to the team that only those who do their job to a fanatic degree stay on this team -- only those who fully buy into the big dog's program and authority stay on this team.

I think where this veers off the norm for this kind of move is it was mid season. That tells me IF BB did this with that philosophy in mind -- certainly not an established fact -- it speaks volumes to how concerned and/or upset he or some on his staff must have been with JC. A conditional third is not a lot for someone of JC's perceived value (though given he was likely to depart at season's end, his known desire for the max market value, and with the season half in the books a first round pick was out of the question even from dopes like Snyder or Jones).

 

[Geezer Butler]

I think Mingo could do it, plus roberts was playing a lot of collins snaps anyways.

I agree but Mingo has to bulk up. We'll see where his speed is at after adding the pounds next year. As is he is situational on passing downs. Roberts seems to be an every down LB but we have a small sample size.

They will never replace Collins with one dude, going to be multiple guys doing multiple things for way less money and drama.

The way Hightower has been playing I really don't mind that. He was on point against the Bills. Sign him and Butler who both seem like "Patriot" guys and I am fine with this move.

 

[Love The Drake]

I agree but Mingo has to bulk up. We'll see where his speed is at after adding the pounds next year. As is he is situational on passing downs. Roberts seems to be an every down LB but we have a small sample size.

They will never replace Collins with one dude, going to be multiple guys doing multiple things for way less money and drama.

The way Hightower has been playing I really don't mind that. He was on point against the Bills. Sign him and Butler who both seem like "Patriot" guys and I am fine with this move.

What part of Butler makes you think he is a budget team friendly guy.

 

[Horace's Ivories]

Although I did appreciate Collin's highlights.... the tape replaying in my head right now is the missed Wilson QB scramble and the Beast's wheel route in the SB...

 

[Soul_Survivor88]

No matter how crazy this trade seems to be, BB has earned the right to pull this type of sh!t off and for us to trust him.

Well actually, he blundered badly trading Deion Branch. It left our Wide Receiver corps depleted in 2006, and might've cost us a Super Bowl that season.

For all its flaws, that 2006 Patriots team was a Top 5, elite defense.

 

[Gronkowski123]

still doesnt make any sense.

 

[Geezer Butler]

Shredded is an overstatement, as is any claim that the defense has been good or has played to anything resembling expectations.

But, speaking of yesterday, I do think the Pats' D played a pretty iffy game considering they were going against a Bills offense that was missing McCoy, Watkins, and Goodwin with Woods playing far below 100%.

After watching that game I thought it was the worst performance from the defense this year. That first drive was just so soft. They gave up a ton of plays the entire game, not just yards but crucial plays.

I'm not a guy to freak out about scheme and not understanding "bend don't break" but this was more than that. There were a lot of breakdowns this week.

I have yet to watch the all 22 though, that's when the rubber hits the road for me.

 

[Geezer Butler]

What part of Butler makes you think he is a budget team friendly guy.

All I know is it will be easier to sign him without having to worry about Collins now. I have no idea really where Butler and his agent fall as far as busting balls during negotiations. Being a home grown guy though I would hope that he is willing to buy in fully, football wise he has that's for sure. Time will tell about the contract.

 

[ivanvamp]

Getting rid of Collins may be a way for BB to put the screws to Hightower. As in, be reasonable with us or you're gone.

However, Hightower now has leverage too. You just gave up one of your best linebackers...you want me gone too?

BB is a genius in pretty much every aspect of the sport. But this is him walking a bit of a tightrope here.

 

[Joker]

When the Pats picked Collin in the 2nds round in 2013, I was ecstatic. I remember Deus hated the Collins pick. We went back and forth over it and as time proved, Collins turned out to be an All Pro player. Yes, as a fan it disturbs me that a player of Collins caliber has been traded. Just as the Milloy move and the Asante deal and the Seymour trade and the branch situation and letting Welker walk all disturbed my comfort zone as a fan.
I STOPPED jumping to knee jerk conclusions and crying like a little baby girl who just lost her favorite cabbage patch doll at the conclusion to the 2003-4 season, however. I LIKED the idea of winning the Super Bowl and I wanted MORE chances to win the Super Bowl and guess what...as long as Bill Belechick has been head coach of the NEP, we, the fans, have a very good chance EVERY FRIGGIN' YEAR to experience a Super Bowl.

You want to biatch and cry and moan and create dozens of crybaby threads over a goddamned personnel move, find another team that suits your damned selfish needs...or better yet, submit a resume to the other 31 teams and get a job so the rest of us poor slob peons can see how it's REALLY DONE. As it is, all you sheep are nothing more than soldiers in the Adam Jones Moron Army. Newsflash, no one owes you ANY explanation. You don't like what this team, as an organization, does to continue it's PROVEN SUCCESS, your alternative is simple...FIND ANOTHER TEAM TO FOLLOW.

 

[Deus Irae]

When the Pats picked Collin in the 2nds round in 2013, I was ecstatic. I remember Deus hated the Collins pick. We went back and forth over it and as time proved, Collins turned out to be an All Pro player.

Just a reminder for the record (and a note to the new people here):

My issue with the pick wasn't about Collins, although I didn't like his tackling problems. It was about need at safety. As I mentioned during the discussions, I'd have been fine with the team taking Collins if they'd gotten another pick to use for the process.

 

[JMC00]

After watching that game I thought it was the worst performance from the defense this year. .

46% pressure on Taylor's dropbacks
Held him to a career low completion percentage and under 200 yards
Last TD was an absolute gift from the ref. Rowe played it as perfectly as you can and Woods grabbed his arm and somehow he got called for PI.
Another TD probably shouldn't have happened had the punter actually punted the ball and then you had their C grabbed Collins by the facemask on the TD run. Should have made it 4th and 18 from the 41 if it was called.


The first drive was mainly because of Collins ditching his assignment and letting buffalo have a 30 yard run. After that drive they held buffalo RBs to 72 yards.

Might not have been the most sound game of the year but worst?

Worst game defensively was Miami. Dominated them in the 1st half and then went to sleep in the 2nd half allowing Tannenhill to throw for 300 yards and 2 TD and they were actually driving at the end to tie it up before Harmon picked it off in the end zone.

 

[n1997y]

that red shape reminds me of something I saw thrown on the field during the Bills game...

 

[NG Pats Fan]

Well actually, he blundered badly trading Deion Branch. It left our Wide Receiver corps depleted in 2006, and might've cost us a Super Bowl that season.

For all its flaws, that 2006 Patriots team was a Top 5, elite defense.

Yet that defense somehow blew a 21-3 lead in the afc championship game. I'll never forget that misery

 

[Todd Bradley]

My problem isn't so much that Collins was traded (even though I fully disagree with it), but the return.

We have the best team in the league and a GOAT QB, who even though he may be having one of the best seasons in his career, is still 39-years-old and we have no real idea how much time is left in his career.

You need to go all-in, right now, while you still have Brady playing. If you're going to cut bait with Collins, fine okay, but to not get a single player in return that can help this team, THIS SEASON, that to me is unfathomable.

You're telling me we seriously couldn't get a Joe Haden in return with say a 5th round pick? Instead we get a 2018 3rd? WTF?

I'm sorry, but that to me is indefensible. Trade Collins, fine, but get a player in return that will help this team win a Super Bowl this season, not a rookie two years from now, when Brady may be long gone.

 

[condon84]

Well actually, he blundered badly trading Deion Branch. It left our Wide Receiver corps depleted in 2006, and might've cost us a Super Bowl that season.

For all its flaws, that 2006 Patriots team was a Top 5, elite defense.

If he gave Deion the money he wanted, who knows what the ramifications would have been.

That elite defense couldn't stop Peyton one time in the second half. It blew a 21 point lead. It wasn't the offense's fault we lost that game. It was the D.

 

[SEA_Pat]

Getting rid of Collins may be a way for BB to put the screws to Hightower. As in, be reasonable with us or you're gone.

However, Hightower now has leverage too. You just gave up one of your best linebackers...you want me gone too?

BB is a genius in pretty much every aspect of the sport. But this is him walking a bit of a tightrope here.

Or, they had talks with both Collins AND Hightower prior to the season, so know the price for both was going to be too much to keep two, saw High playing great and hurt and being a team leader and Collins freelancing, and decided, okay, it's High. So they'll pay him market value and let Collins go.