Just me or defensive scheme seem way better?

[Nunchucks]

I get what you're saying, and your point is valid. But, if you think the only problem with this DL has been health (and that's a general "you" that's not specific to you personally), you need lasik.

I hope that the DLs problem right now is a technique issue. Because they are getting pushed around and not holding their gaps.

 

[Angelpats]

It just looked like the whole team didn’t come to play the jags. The defense was bad, except for a few players. Same with the offense, it was a fail trying Sony and the run offense against that defense early. Should have passed and then clear out room for the run.

 

[mgteich]

The front six needed help. We added Shelton, Clayborne, Hightower, Bentley, Davis and Rivers. Belichick has certainly made changes. IMHO, it takes time for a new group to develop together, at least a few games.

And yes, I agree that we should trade for a linebacker.

I get what you're saying, and your point is valid. But, if you think the only problem with this DL has been health (and that's a general "you" that's not specific to you personally), you need lasik.

 

[Ring 6]

The front six needed help. We added Shelton, Clayborne, Hightower, Bentley, Davis and Rivers. Belichick has certainly made changes. IMHO, it takes time for a new group to develop together, at least a few games.

And yes, I agree that we should trade for a linebacker.

I think this is a case where the “things get sorted out in the first 4 weeks” dynamic is important to recognize.
We have a lot of new players on the front 6 and a lot is happening now with evaluating these players, determining their roles, and putting together a unit, personell groupings and gameplans.
This organization has had the success it has had by having a structure intelligent approach and a willingness to accept that a team is a work in progress. What you see today is probably not going to be what you see in January and along the way there will be personal successes and failures that shape what the unit will turn into.
All of that is almost always a positive growth under this coaching staff, but it is also counteracted to whatever degree by injuries.

 

[Soliel]

Right. You can’t really expect post season form from new players in September. That’s one thing. I say that because on all the sports shows, they seem to believe brady and the rest should look , now as they did in the super bowl and if not, this somehow proves the party is over in New England. This is illogical and dumb because they say it every year.

 

[mcmurtry86]

The front six needed help. We added Shelton, Clayborne, Hightower, Bentley, Davis and Rivers. Belichick has certainly made changes. IMHO, it takes time for a new group to develop together, at least a few games.

And yes, I agree that we should trade for a linebacker.

Hightower looks old and slow. Until (unless?) he rebounds, the front 7 is a disaster. Relying on a 3rd rounder who missed his whole rookie year and can't even get into the active 47, an UDFA who also missed his whole rookie year, a castoff coming off a mediocre year from an awful team and a 5th round pick to improve is a stretch

Its not like they packed in 2-4 high end or long time proven commodities. It's a unit lacking high end skill or (in the case of Shelton and Clayborn) inconsistent and/of mediocre levels of play. There's no reason to think the unit will "come together".

DE who can't beat their man one on one is a talent issue not a cohesion issue. A DT pushed backwards routinely isn't a cohesion issue. A rusher who runs past the QB and plays with terrible awareness/discipline is not a cohesion problem. Having a group of holdovers (Van Noy, Brown, Wise, Butler, Guy) who max out at "serviceable stop gap role player" talent levels is not a cohesion issue

Will playing together make them better? Maybe. It didn't really help the front 7 last year with many of the same guys. A lot of their problem is a lack of talent. Coaches dress it up as "failure to execute". You know what guys who fail to execute regularly are? Players who aren't good enough.

 

[maineman209]

Hightower looks old and slow. Until (unless?) he rebounds, the front 7 is a disaster. Relying on a 3rd rounder who missed his whole rookie year and can't even get into the active 47, an UDFA who also missed his whole rookie year, a castoff coming off a mediocre year from an awful team and a 5th round pick to improve is a stretch

Its not like they packed in 2-4 high end or long time proven commodities. It's a unit lacking high end skill or (in the case of Shelton and Clayborn) inconsistent and/of mediocre levels of play. There's no reason to think the unit will "come together".

DE who can't beat their man one on one is a talent issue not a cohesion issue. A DT pushed backwards routinely isn't a cohesion issue. A rusher who runs past the QB and plays with terrible awareness/discipline is not a cohesion problem. Having a group of holdovers (Van Noy, Brown, Wise, Butler, Guy) who max out at "serviceable stop gap role player" talent levels is not a cohesion issue

Will playing together make them better? Maybe. It didn't really help the front 7 last year with many of the same guys. A lot of their problem is a lack of talent. Coaches dress it up as "failure to execute". You know what guys who fail to execute regularly are? Players who aren't good enough.

It's been two games.

 

[Uptown]

Uh oh. Here we go with Rowe’s groin again..

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Guy has probably been our best player in the entire front 7 so far,not even close in terms of IDL. He's been great. Vg at reading, beating his man/block.

I'd say Flowers a close 2nd.

Conversely Shelton hasn't impressed at all. Teams understand how to beat him, it's been no secret. Get him moving, esp if he has to make a lateral move. He's reached & cut off too easy.

Hightower has stood out for the wrong reasons. Was pancaked in Jax a few times I believe.

It's only week 2 though. I have a ton of faith in our pass rushers. We have to find the right combo & work a few things out but the talent, bodies are there. It's getting that right mix on the same field, same page, right situation.

The IDL is a bit concerning but again it's early. During or right after the Jax game I brought the interior pass rush & it just hasn't been there at all.

 

[Uptown]

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Seeing Akiem Hicks on that list hurts. Maybe we can find another Hicks with a trade. I think the secondary will be OK, feels like we are 1 guy short in the front 7.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Do any of the other top 5 players make no difference in the overall line play?

 

[Kontradiction]

Guy has probably been our best player in the entire front 7 so far,not even close in terms of IDL. He's been great. Vg at reading, beating his man/block.

I'd say Flowers a close 2nd.

Conversely Shelton hasn't impressed at all. Teams understand how to beat him, it's been no secret. Get him moving, esp if he has to make a lateral move. He's reached & cut off too easy.

Hightower has stood out for the wrong reasons. Was pancaked in Jax a few times I believe.

It's only week 2 though. I have a ton of faith in our pass rushers. We have to find the right combo & work a few things out but the talent, bodies are there. It's getting that right mix on the same field, same page, right situation.

The IDL is a bit concerning but again it's early. During or right after the Jax game I brought the interior pass rush & it just hasn't been there at all.

I mean, it hasn't even been as if teams have needed to get Shelton moving laterally. He's pretty much gotten blown completely off the line of scrimmage on designed runs right at him through the A- and B-gaps. He's been what he was in Cleveland prior to coming here, which is a disappointment thus far. Hard to overreact before mid-October (when the unit usually starts to gel a bit), but my fear is that the coaching staff will have to scheme around personnel issues again this year instead of taking advantage of talented personnel on-hand as they did in 2013-2016. As we've seen time and again, it's only a matter of time before that catches up to you.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

I mean, it hasn't even been as if teams have needed to get Shelton moving laterally. He's pretty much gotten blown completely off the line of scrimmage on designed runs right at him through the A- and B-gaps. He's been what he was in Cleveland prior to coming here, which is a disappointment thus far. Hard to overreact before mid-October (when the unit usually starts to gel a bit), but my fear is that the coaching staff will have to scheme around personnel issues again this year instead of taking advantage of talented personnel on-hand as they did in 2013-2016. As we've seen time and again, it's only a matter of time before that catches up to you.

Overall I'd agree w that. I noticed some of that for sure but he just hasn't been able to work around any bodies in front of him when he's on the move.

Ive heard some talk about the issues being correctable & I see that but haven't heard any analysis as to how it'll actually get fixed.

I have faith in some areas & concerns in areas from what I've seen but I'm definitely not panicking at all. Only 2 games & this team is concerned about the big picture.

No secret we treat the first few games like an extension of the preseason

 

[Deus Irae]

...

Conversely Shelton hasn't impressed at all. Teams understand how to beat him, it's been no secret. Get him moving, esp if he has to make a lateral move. He's reached & cut off too easy....

I mean, it hasn't even been as if teams have needed to get Shelton moving laterally. He's pretty much gotten blown completely off the line of scrimmage on designed runs right at him through the A- and B-gaps. He's been what he was in Cleveland prior to coming here, which is a disappointment thus far. Hard to overreact before mid-October (when the unit usually starts to gel a bit), but my fear is that the coaching staff will have to scheme around personnel issues again this year instead of taking advantage of talented personnel on-hand as they did in 2013-2016. As we've seen time and again, it's only a matter of time before that catches up to you.

These posts bring back memories of Shelton discussions during the offseason.

 

[Soliel]

There’s what, 4 mill left in cap?

And they talk about kaepernik comming here, I hope he can play linebacker

 

[PatsfanTN]

Can we pilfer Collins back from the Browns or is the Browns bridge bunrned?

 

[JPPT1974]

Browns will never win as really Hue Jackson seems like a nice guy but a lousy coach.