Jones = Chad Pennington 2002?

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

Pennington might well have been the most accurate QB in NFL history.

Him, Ken Anderson, and Drew Brees would be the top tier, IIRC.

 

[mike_usagisan]

Him, Ken Anderson, and Drew Brees would be the top tier, IIRC.

That’s good company if Jones gets there.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

The West Coast offense that San Francisco 49ers head coach Bill Walsh pioneered was actually put together by Walsh when he was QBs coach at Cincinnati. It was to take advantage of the uncanny accuracy in short passes of QB Greg Cook. But three games into his career, Cook tore his rotator cuff and was never a decent player again. Then Walsh got Ken Anderson. Then Walsh went to SF and got Joe Montana, who would also be on the high accuracy short list.

 

[Pats2000]

Hell I'll take the Drew Brees comparison, he would probably have at least 3 rings if he played with BB.

 

[Deus Irae]

The West Coast offense that San Francisco 49ers head coach Bill Walsh pioneered was actually put together by Walsh when he was QBs coach at Cincinnati. It was to take advantage of the uncanny accuracy in short passes of QB Greg Cook. But three games into his career, Cook tore his rotator cuff and was never a decent player again. Then Walsh got Ken Anderson. Then Walsh went to SF and got Joe Montana, who would also be on the high accuracy short list.

Anderson, Montana, Young, Manning, Brady, Rodgers, Pennington, Brees, and I'm sure that I'm missing others...


All amazingly accurate, with some of their career comp% fluctuations coming down to system, some to risk/reward temperment, some to supporting cast, etc...

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

Bill Walsh always said that the most talented QB he ever saw was Greg Cook. It's amazing how many careers get wrecked by injury before they ever got off the ground. Greg Cook - Wikipedia

Cook, Pennington, and Brees had similar injuries. Cook's couldn't be fixed in the 70s, Pennington's was partly successful, and Brees recovered fully.

 

[Joey007]

Wasn’t that the Jets team that smacked Indy in the WC round like 41-0 or something crazy like that?

 

[Steve102]

Agree. Chad was a very good QB before his shoulder turned into junk.

Jones doesn't have a Josh Allen cannon but it's better than average. Should pick up a few MPHs with some mechanical improvements, weight and flexibility training.

Ya, it's all about flexibility. *best Hanz un Franz voice*

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

Wasn’t that the Jets team that smacked Indy in the WC round like 41-0 or something crazy like that?

Yes. Manning was a miserable 14-for-31 for 137 yards and two interceptions. Pennington was 19-25.

Box Score - Indianapolis Colts vs. New York Jets, January 4, 2003 | The Football Database

View the Box Score for the NFL football game between the Indianapolis Colts and the New York Jets on January 4, 2003.

www.footballdb.com

ESPN.com: 2002 NFL Playoffs - Recap - NY Jets vs Indianapolis

www.espn.com

 

[Brotherblues]

I posted about objective data in response to a poster who's response started off with



in order to demonstrate that I was not just making a joke. You're welcome to post about "It feels like....", if you want, but it's not really going to be relevant.

I haven't the foggiest clue why you'd tell me that.

 

[Deus Irae]

I haven't the foggiest clue why you'd tell me that.

Ok

 

[jdlboot14]

Mac Jones has better coaches than Chad Pennington ever did.

This, and health, is the biggest factor for QB's entering the NFL "making it". 75% have the skills, about 25% have the mental capacity, but very few get to stable teams with solid ownership and coaching. Mac has as much of a chance as anyone to become a solid, long term starter as anyone.

 

[Brotherblues]

Bill Walsh always said that the most talented QB he ever saw was Greg Cook. It's amazing how many careers get wrecked by injury before they ever got off the ground. Greg Cook - Wikipedia

Cook, Pennington, and Brees had similar injuries. Cook's couldn't be fixed in the 70s, Pennington's was partly successful, and Brees recovered fully.

That's nuts. One big hit and wham, from a sure fire legend to some obscure reference in the annals of wikipedia.

 

[cmasspatsfan]

That's nuts. One big hit and wham, from a sure fire legend to some obscure reference in the annals of wikipedia.

Also it happened in the 60's when medical care especially for athletes wasn't all that great. If Bobby Orr would have played 20 years later his career would have been longer, they used to slice up his knee like a thanksgiving turkey when today they would use a scope.

 

[KDPPatsfan85]

archive.ph

 

[RobertWeathers]

Seriously I think that's a very overlooked factor with Jones. People see the bit of extra fat in his body and focus only on him not having an athlete's physique. To me it just means that his arm strength and athleticism are not yet completely unlocked. I mean seriously, this guy has the mental part down, and you can't teach that. And his body shows that the weakest parts of his game (arm and athleticism) can be vastly improved by a bit of stricter training. Like seriously I was more excited for his prospects once I saw his body had such potential for improvement.

Jones may have a dad-bod but his arm is perfectly fine and so is his mobility.

I mean...these aren't bad numbers. The dude is a pretty decent athlete. Just looks like he eats meatloaf, mashed potatoes, Sam Adams and ice cream for desert every night.

• 40 yards: 4.82
• Bench (225): N/A
• Vertical jump:32.0
• Long jump: 9-8
• Shuttle:4.39
• 3-Cone: 7.04

 

[Brotherblues]

Jones may be a dad-bod but his arm is perfectly fine and so is his mobility.

I mean...these aren't bad numbers. The dude is a pretty decent athlete. Just looks like he eats meatloaf, mashed potatoes, Sam Adams and ice cream for desert every night.

• 40 yards: 4.82
• Bench (225): N/A
• Vertical jump:32.0
• Long jump: 9-8
• Shuttle:4.39
• 3-Cone: 7.04

Not saying they're bad-bad, just the weakest aspect of his game. And it's possible that losing the dad bod would bring maybe a 10% increase accross the board on those numbers. That's kinda exciting especially if it also adds a bit of arm power.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Not saying they're bad-bad, just the weakest aspect of his game. And it's possible that losing the dad bod would bring maybe a 10% increase accross the board on those numbers. That's kinda exciting especially if it also adds a bit of arm power.

Is that a Havanese for your avatar?

 

[VJCPatriot]

Pennington completed 68.9% of his passes in his 3rd season. He screwed up his wrist the next season, which permanently impacted him, but still completed 63.6 percent that year and 65.4 percent the year after. In that 2004 season, he screwed up his shoulder, and lost a lot of arm strength. Despite that, he was healthy enough to get percentages of 64.5, 68.8, 67.4 and 68.9 from 2006 to 2009, when he once again injured his shoulder. That was basically the end of Pennington, as he tried a come back in 2010 but just couldn't get it done anymore.

Brees didn't complete more than that 68.9% until 2009, his 9th season in the league. But Pennington's accuracy was greater than Brees' throughout his career period.

View attachment 32737

And Pennington

View attachment 32738

Quite a bit of cherry picking going on here.

You leave out all SIX of Drew Brees 70% completion seasons as if they didn't exist just to bolster your argument.

Chad Pennington never reached the 70% completion mark in his entire career, rotator cuff injury or not.

Drew Brees completion percentages Age 31-41. 71.2, 70, 72, 74.4, 74,3, 70.5. And those bolded percentages indicate he led the entire NFL in completion percentages 5 times.

Another factor you don't consider is pass attempts. The less times you pass, the easier it is to get a higher percentage. With larger volumes of passing you usually tend to get a lower pass percentage. Consider that Brees made over 500 pass attempts in 8 of his age 31-41 seasons. Meanwhile Chad Pennington never made over 500 pass attempts in a single season his entire career. Brees ended with a career pass completion rate of 67.7% in over 10500 pass attempts while Pennington ended up with 66.0% in just 2471 attempts. Both in terms of sheer volume and overall accuracy, Brees is far more impressive.

70.6	4388	34	6.6	11	2.1	210	75	8.5	8.9	12.1	292.5	109.6	82.0	20	135	7.96	8.31	3.7	2	4	16
2010*	31	NOR	QB	9	16	16	11-5-0	448	658	68.1	4620	33	5.0	22	3.3	238	80	7.0	6.5	10.3	288.8	90.9	70.8	25	185	6.49	6.01	3.7	4	5	14
2011*	32	NOR	QB	9	16	16	13-3-0	468	657	71.2	5476	46	7.0	14	2.1	279	79	8.3	8.8	11.7	342.3	110.6	82.3	24	158	7.81	8.23	3.5	3	4	20
2012*	33	NOR	QB	9	16	16	7-9-0	422	670	63.0	5177	43	6.4	19	2.8	266	80	7.7	7.7	12.3	323.6	96.3	68.7	26	190	7.17	7.17	3.7	1	2	15
2013*	34	NOR	QB	9	16	16	11-5-0	446	650	68.6	5162	39	6.0	12	1.8	246	76	7.9	8.3	11.6	322.6	104.7	69.1	37	244	7.16	7.51	5.4	2	2	17
2014*	35	NOR	QB	9	16	16	7-9-0	456	659	69.2	4952	33	5.0	17	2.6	259	69	7.5	7.4	10.9	309.5	97.0	74.8	29	186	6.93	6.77	4.2	2	2	16
2015	36	NOR	QB	9	15	15	7-8-0	428	627	68.3	4870	32	5.1	11	1.8	228	80	7.8	8.0	11.4	324.7	101.0	66.8	31	235	7.04	7.26	4.7	1	2	14
2016*	37	NOR	QB	9	16	16	7-9-0	471	673	70.0	5208	37	5.5	15	2.2	265	98	7.7	7.8	11.1	325.5	101.7	66.8	27	184	7.18	7.27	3.9	2	4	16
2017*	38	NOR	QB	9	16	16	11-5-0	386	536	72.0	4334	23	4.3	8	1.5	203	54	8.1	8.3	11.2	270.9	103.9	62.5	20	145	7.53	7.71	3.6	2	2	17
2018*	39	NOR	QB	9	15	15	13-2-0	364	489	74.4	3992	32	6.5	5	1.0	223	72	8.2	9.0	11.0	266.1	115.7	79.2	17	121	7.65	8.47	3.4	6	7	16
2019*	40	NOR	QB	9	11	11	8-3-0	281	378	74.3	2979	27	7.1	4	1.1	159	61	7.9	8.8	10.6	270.8	116.3	73.3	12	89	7.41	8.33	3.1	1	2	10
2020	41	NOR	QB	9	12	12	9-3-0	275	390	70.5	2942	24	6.2	6	1.5	149	52	7.5	8.1	10.7	245.2	106.4	74.6	13	89	7.08	7.60	3.2	1	3	9

 

[rochrist]

Quite a bit of cherry picking going on here.

You leave out all SIX of Drew Brees 70% completion seasons as if they didn't exist just to bolster your argument.

Chad Pennington never reached the 70% completion mark in his entire career, rotator cuff injury or not.

Drew Brees completion percentages Age 31-41. 71.2, 70, 72, 74,4, 74,3, 70.5. And those bolded percentages indicate he led the entire NFL in completion percentages 5 times.

70.6	4388	34	6.6	11	2.1	210	75	8.5	8.9	12.1	292.5	109.6	82.0	20	135	7.96	8.31	3.7	2	4	16
2010*	31	NOR	QB	9	16	16	11-5-0	448	658	68.1	4620	33	5.0	22	3.3	238	80	7.0	6.5	10.3	288.8	90.9	70.8	25	185	6.49	6.01	3.7	4	5	14
2011*	32	NOR	QB	9	16	16	13-3-0	468	657	71.2	5476	46	7.0	14	2.1	279	79	8.3	8.8	11.7	342.3	110.6	82.3	24	158	7.81	8.23	3.5	3	4	20
2012*	33	NOR	QB	9	16	16	7-9-0	422	670	63.0	5177	43	6.4	19	2.8	266	80	7.7	7.7	12.3	323.6	96.3	68.7	26	190	7.17	7.17	3.7	1	2	15
2013*	34	NOR	QB	9	16	16	11-5-0	446	650	68.6	5162	39	6.0	12	1.8	246	76	7.9	8.3	11.6	322.6	104.7	69.1	37	244	7.16	7.51	5.4	2	2	17
2014*	35	NOR	QB	9	16	16	7-9-0	456	659	69.2	4952	33	5.0	17	2.6	259	69	7.5	7.4	10.9	309.5	97.0	74.8	29	186	6.93	6.77	4.2	2	2	16
2015	36	NOR	QB	9	15	15	7-8-0	428	627	68.3	4870	32	5.1	11	1.8	228	80	7.8	8.0	11.4	324.7	101.0	66.8	31	235	7.04	7.26	4.7	1	2	14
2016*	37	NOR	QB	9	16	16	7-9-0	471	673	70.0	5208	37	5.5	15	2.2	265	98	7.7	7.8	11.1	325.5	101.7	66.8	27	184	7.18	7.27	3.9	2	4	16
2017*	38	NOR	QB	9	16	16	11-5-0	386	536	72.0	4334	23	4.3	8	1.5	203	54	8.1	8.3	11.2	270.9	103.9	62.5	20	145	7.53	7.71	3.6	2	2	17
2018*	39	NOR	QB	9	15	15	13-2-0	364	489	74.4	3992	32	6.5	5	1.0	223	72	8.2	9.0	11.0	266.1	115.7	79.2	17	121	7.65	8.47	3.4	6	7	16
2019*	40	NOR	QB	9	11	11	8-3-0	281	378	74.3	2979	27	7.1	4	1.1	159	61	7.9	8.8	10.6	270.8	116.3	73.3	12	89	7.41	8.33	3.1	1	2	10
2020	41	NOR	QB	9	12	12	9-3-0	275	390	70.5	2942	24	6.2	6	1.5	149	52	7.5	8.1	10.7	245.2	106.4	74.6	13	89	7.08	7.60	3.2	1	3	9

I'd be willing to bet that the league completion percentage was substantially lower when Pennington put up his numbers.