J.C. Jackson - "It's time to get Mr. INT paid."

[Sicilian]

The 3rd compensatory pick for Jackson is iffy assuming NE signs new UFAs that are good.

I think that's unlikely this year due to their cap situation and the number of positions they need to fill. I could see them bringing in a lot of low to mid level FA's, but I really doubt they'll bring in a guy who would offset Jackson. We'll see though, they've surprised me before.

 

[nextsuperstar]

With (likely) no JCJ - the secondary has gone from a strength to a major liability.

Unless BB plans to completely reinvent this defense like he did in 2003. Which might be the plan.

Just remember 2014. The Patriots let Talib go (who had been a game changer in the secondary). What did they do? Brought in Browner and Revis and brought back Chung. Secondaries can be repaired.

 

[slash83]

I guess that is true. Scratch that then. He does still upgrade the starting CB corp, but the #2 spot would stay the same.

Realistically, with Jackson all but gone, the team is needing two starting outside corners. It’s pretty bad, a lot of work needs to get done.

 

[Rob0729]

Realistically, with Jackson all but gone, the team is needing two starting outside corners. It’s pretty bad, a lot of work needs to get done.

To clarifiy, I meant Jones upgrades the corp that was there without Jackson. I didn't mean he was an upgrade to Jackson.

Mills is good enough to be the #2. But this team was only as good as the pass rush last year. I don't care who your starting CBs are if the opposing QB has 4-5 seconds to throw on a consistent basis. There are maybe one or two CBs in the league who can consistently cover a receiver for that long. If the Pats can have the pass rush they had for most of the year prior to the bye, they can certainly do well in the secondary with Mills and a decent #1 CB covering outside.

 

[slash83]

To clarifiy, I meant Jones upgrades the corp that was there without Jackson. I didn't mean he was an upgrade to Jackson.

Mills is good enough to be the #2. But this team was only as good as the pass rush last year. I don't care who your starting CBs are if the opposing QB has 4-5 seconds to throw on a consistent basis. There are maybe one or two CBs in the league who can consistently cover a receiver for that long.

Yeah but even Mills was playing out of position last season, and I agree, he was good. It’ll be fun to see how the roster build up goes this off-season.

 

[Wozzy]

To clarifiy, I meant Jones upgrades the corp that was there without Jackson. I didn't mean he was an upgrade to Jackson.

Agreed, they missed Jon Jones in the slot last season badly.

 

[Wozzy]

I think that's unlikely this year due to their cap situation and the number of positions they need to fill. I could see them bringing in a lot of low to mid level FA's, but I really doubt they'll bring in a guy who would offset Jackson. We'll see though, they've surprised me before.

There's a cutoff date for vets, where if they're signed after this date they no longer count against the NFL's arbitrary compensatory equation.

Very often what the Pats have done is agree to terms with veteran free agents like Jason McCourty, but waited until after this date to sign them.

Last year they had to lock up big name guys early, make a splash to attract other big names. But this year they can let free agency run wild, then pick up bargain value vet free agents on the back end.

 

[venecol]

Not one of the UFA CBs was tagged. I don't see much there to replace JC at a lower cost. Maybe Ward who is a man coverage guy can be had for under $15M apy but he's more of a #2 CB. Looks like draft is the likely option, though there's no guarantee of success there as we well know.

 

[bresna]

I think that's unlikely this year due to their cap situation and the number of positions they need to fill. I could see them bringing in a lot of low to mid level FA's, but I really doubt they'll bring in a guy who would offset Jackson. We'll see though, they've surprised me before.

True, but that's still only a 3rd round comp pick. I would think they could have tagged & traded him for more than that. He should have garnered at least a 2nd round pick.

 

[Triumph]

Agholor is in the last year of his deal, they could trade him easily. They could extend him and lower his cap hit significantly. Not signing or tagging Jackson had zero to do with Nelson and everything to do with the mountain of money Jackson will receive on the open market which the Patriots would never match.

At some point paying top of the market money is overpaying. I like Jackson, very good player... he's not a shutdown CB who deserves shutdown CB money... he's simply not. The Patriots should clear up cap space and go after some value vet free agents to get younger on D rather than overpay for one "good" cornerback.

Who in their sane mind would trade for Agahlor? He costs the Pats 10 million whether he plays for the Pats or not. No way is this dude worth what he is being paid. Bourne exceeded his contract worth. Tagging Jackson gives the Pats 1 season to draft his replacement and groom him for the job.

The Pats HAD one of the best secondary's in the NFL. Malcom Butler to Gilmore to JC Jackson, it was a good run.

 

[Give Kraft A Hand]

Who in their sane mind would trade for Agahlor? He costs the Pats 10 million whether he plays for the Pats or not. No way is this dude worth what he is being paid. Bourne exceeded his contract worth. Tagging Jackson gives the Pats 1 season to draft his replacement and groom him for the job.

The Pats HAD one of the best secondary's in the NFL. Malcom Butler to Gilmore to JC Jackson, it was a good run.

I'm not worried about Bill finding a corner. If theres a HC/GM in the league that can do it its Bill. Thats what he does best. I'm more concerned about Wide Receivers than the Secondary.

 

[Wozzy]

Who in their sane mind would trade for Agahlor? He costs the Pats 10 million whether he plays for the Pats or not. No way is this dude worth what he is being paid. Bourne exceeded his contract worth. Tagging Jackson gives the Pats 1 season to draft his replacement and groom him for the job.

The Pats HAD one of the best secondary's in the NFL. Malcom Butler to Gilmore to JC Jackson, it was a good run.

The Raiders are a good option, they lost their deep threat in Henry Ruggs this season. Carr and Agholor already showed good chemistry. They have cap money, McDaniels has familiarity with the player and Nelson is in the last year of his deal. If they thought he was too expensive this year they could extend him.

Agholor wasn't "bad" last season or the problem... we had a rookie QB.

Assuming Mac improves as he should, the Pat's passing numbers and Agholor's stats should be vastly improved with the exact same set of receivers.

 

[mgteich]

Not exactly. You can remove the tag and let him walk.

The 3rd

True, but that's still only a 3rd round comp pick. I would think they could have tagged & traded him for more than that. He should have garnered at least a 2nd round pick.

I don't why so many of you wanted the team to use $17M on the franchise task, and use the money in July when they traded Jackson. Belichick decided to use the $17M for players now, rather than in July.

 

[mgteich]

Who in their sane mind would trade for Agahlor? He costs the Pats 10 million whether he plays for the Pats or not. No way is this dude worth what he is being paid. Bourne exceeded his contract worth. Tagging Jackson gives the Pats 1 season to draft his replacement and groom him for the job.

The Pats HAD one of the best secondary's in the NFL. Malcom Butler to Gilmore to JC Jackson, it was a good run.

In my very personal opinion, naming Butler in the same category as Gilmore and Jackson is ridiculous.

 

[mgteich]

I'm not worried about Bill finding a corner. If theres a HC/GM in the league that can do it its Bill. Thats what he does best. I'm more concerned about Wide Receivers than the Secondary.

Yes, Bill will "find" a corner, perhaps an UDFA that might be ready to contribute in a year or two.
=======================
We need a #1 corner. It is NOT easy to find a #1 CB. FULL STOP.

We will likely take a chance and draft a corner in the first round, and expect him to start as a rookie. We ill also bring in a FA or two.

We also need with issue of possibly losing our starting free safety.
=====================

 

[Rob0729]

We need a #1 corner. It is NOT easy to find a #1 CB. FULL STOP.

It isn't easy, but Belichick has done a great job going from one #1 CB to the next to the next. He went from Talib to Revis to Butler to Gilmore to Jackson without skipping a beat. The Pats really haven't had a below average #1 CB since McCourty in 2012 (and McCourty was a great CB two years earlier as a rookie). That is a decade with five different #1 CBs who were all above average #1 CBs to elite #1 CBs. And two of these CBs were signed as UDFA and Talib was traded away from Tampa because he was considered a disappointment.

I mean this could be the year that Belichick breaks the trend on this. But finding or developing #1 CBs seems to come easier to Belichick than any other position and better than any other team.

 

[Triumph]

In my very personal opinion, naming Butler in the same category as Gilmore and Jackson is ridiculous.

He is better than what we are going to have when JC leaves and Butler basically won a Super Bowl for the Pats with the Wilson INT.

Who knows what would have happened in the Eagles Super Bowl if Butler wasnt benched.

 

[bormio]

Trade the beast. In today's no defense, NFL CB's are overrated. Tag and trade.

The sad truth is good corners have been neutered by the rules. The Pats have won without a #1 corner (2016). Doubled Jones in the SB and singled the others. Pressure is the name of the game in today’s NFL.

 

[Stu Pidassle]

The sad truth is good corners have been neutered by the rules. The Pats have won without a #1 corner (2016). Doubled Jones in the SB and singled the others. Pressure is the name of the game in today’s NFL.

Another way to think about this is that the ability of a shutdown corner to be impact the outcome of a game has been neutered by the rules. Ramsey is an example of someone who has elite talent at the position who commanded a huge contract ala Gilmore at the time of his signing. This years playoffs were a good example of how things have changed. As others are saying, it may not be a bad thing to have a few #2 talent CBs as opposed to a Revis style #1 from the game plan and salary cap perspectives. I still hope that we can retain JC assuming he is willing to sign a reasonable contract.

 

[slash83]

Not sure how realistic it is, but wish they could pull off a trade for Lattimore from N.O.