J.C. Jackson - "It's time to get Mr. INT paid."

[FreeTedWilliams]

Jackson is going to get paid, the only reason that he was a UDFA was that he was charged with some serious crimes in college, lost his scholarship, had to go to JUCO and then Maryland.

He was not some diamond found in the rough, BB took a chance that he has straightened himself out.

Can’t blame Jackson for wanting to cash in, NFL careers can end in an instant. As previous poster have said, not much out there aside from Jackson, so paying him might be the best option for the Pats.

 

[venecol]

No tag and trade deal can be done without Jackson’s approval because no team is going to give up a first round pick for a one year rental. That is probably the minimum the Pats will take for Jackson. A new contract will have to be negotiated before the trade is made. Jackson controls a lot of the process now.

The Pats will get a far better draft pick compensation if he has a long term deal in place with the team he is traded to than if he refuses to do a long term deal with that team. So it is in the Patriots' best interest to trade Jackson to a team where he would be willing to play.

In July after the ability to give him a long term contract has passed, Jackson loses all his leverage. Then the Patriots can send him to any team for a lower round pick with Jackson having no control of where he goes because there will be no long term deal to be made.

If the Pats are clear that they want to tag and trade Jackson, he has huge incentive to sign his deal and negotiate the best trade and deal for himself. He might end up being the highest paid CB in the NFL that way.

This isn’t the Pats trying to trade Gronk to Detroit for a first rounder. In that case, Gronk already had a multiyear contract in place. The Lions were trying to acquire that contract. No new contract was necessary to keep him multiple years.

Nope. He'll get a hefty multi-year contract in FAcy and Pats get a 3rd round comp pick.

 

[venecol]

I can only imagine the lobbying going on at the Belichick compound....
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"Daddy, Daddy....how can I coordinate a defense without a certified Pick Machine?"

"I'm not payin $17.3 million to a garbage collector, and don't delude yourself that you 'coordinate' anything"

"Please tell me you aren't seriously considering starting SloJuan next season at left corner"

"He's cheap, he's tall.......he's cheap..........and think of the team building moment if Slojuan ever actually intercepts a pass. The mouth-breathers in the cheap seats will get off on it for days, Jacobi style."

"Then please tell me you will draft a stud corner in the first so we can hit the ground running in September"

"Remember the last stud corner I picked in the 1st. I had to turn him into safety when he flamed out in man coverage. Besides, I'm trading down. Robert is a little prickly about last year's wage bill and Jonathon won't stop talking about how much the new video screens are costing the family."

 

[Rob0729]

Nope. He'll get a hefty multi-year contract in FAcy and Pats get a 3rd round comp pick.

If Belichick does that, he is a moron. He won't. If he is playing elsewhere next year, there is no way he won't be tagged and traded. The Pats can get far more than a 3rd round comp in 2023 in that scenario. I will stand by my first round pick prediction.

Either JC Jackson plays for the Patriots in 2022 or he will be tagged and traded. He is too valuable of a trade chip to just walk.

 

[venecol]

Matt Cassel got the Pats an early second round pick in a tag and trade situation. That should be the absolute lowest the Pats should get.

Frank Clark was tagged and traded in 2019 for a 1st and a second in 2020
Jared Allen was tagged and traded in 2008 for a 1st rounder and two thirds

Let's not act like what I said is unprecedented. If a team truly thinks Jackson is an elite CB, a first rounder is a value for compensation. I stand by my statement. I think the Pats will get a first round pick because I think there are enough teams that think Jackson is an elite player along with his age and position.

Cassell was traded as a package that included Vrabel!

 

[Family]

I'd rather invest in the offense.

Rebuild the defense through the draft while developing the next JC Jackson, and get Mac all the tools to help make the offense a top one.

I think Mac is good enough.

 

[Rob0729]

Cassell was traded as a package that included Vrabel!

Vrabel was a throw in. He had no real value. Belichick was going to get rid of him one way or another.

 

[XLIX]

Matt Cassel got the Pats an early second round pick in a tag and trade situation. That should be the absolute lowest the Pats should get.

Frank Clark was tagged and traded in 2019 for a 1st and a second in 2020
Jared Allen was tagged and traded in 2008 for a 1st rounder and two thirds

Let's not act like what I said is unprecedented. If a team truly thinks Jackson is an elite CB, a first rounder is a value for compensation. I stand by my statement. I think the Pats will get a first round pick because I think there are enough teams that think Jackson is an elite player along with his age and position.

My comment was "A first rounder for a CB not even under contract? Don’t get your hopes up." and you responded with a QB (who didn't even get a 1st rounder) and 2 defensive ends.

So yeah, it seems that getting a 1st rounder for a CB would be unprecedented, unless you have more examples up your sleeve.

Also, your entire thesis depends heavily on Jackson himself going along with it. We don't know where his true priorities lay, but he may simply refuse to sign anything until he is a UFA, at which point his trade value becomes less than a compensatory pick.

 

[TheRainMaker]

For people wanting to convince themselves JC is not among the best and should be paid, Jalen Ramsey got torched in the playoffs and Super Bowl. He makes $20M per year. WR’s in today’s game are much faster and you can’t rough them up passed 5 yards. DB’s are going to get beat. Only difference is, JC leads the league in INT’s since entering the league. But, any time JC would get beat, the board would try to convince themselves he’s not elite in hopes his value comes down.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Cassell was traded as a package that included Vrabel!

As Rob said, Vrabel was awful by that point and just a throw in. Not sure why KC took him.

Think Jonathan Cooper in the horrendous Chandler Jones trade.

 

[Vatahala]

I'd rather invest in the offense.

Rebuild the defense through the draft while developing the next JC Jackson, and get Mac all the tools to help make the offense a top one.

I think Mac is good enough.

Were 3 weeks away from March 16th NFL free agency opening, what kind of prices will Karras and Brown demand? How much money will the Pats have to spend after all the trades and cuts?

 

[Rob0729]

My comment was "A first rounder for a CB not even under contract? Don’t get your hopes up." and you responded with a QB (who didn't even get a 1st rounder) and 2 defensive ends.

So yeah, it seems that getting a 1st rounder for a CB would be unprecedented, unless you have more examples up your sleeve.

Also, your entire thesis depends heavily on Jackson himself going along with it. We don't know where his true priorities lay, but he may simply refuse to sign anything until he is a UFA.

There hasn't been a top CB who has been tagged and traded in recent years. Why? Because in today's pass happy NFL, CBs are arguably the second most important position in football.

And I gave you two DEs who got far more than a first rounder. I used them because they were the closest comps to Jackson. Was I supposed to use Jarvis Landry as a very good, but not top WR? Or Jadeveon Clowney who came with a lot of baggage when he was tagged and traded?

And I used Matt Cassel because he was a career back up QB who had a respectable year replacing Brady, but nothing spectacular.

Unfortunately, there is no apples to apple comparisons. Tag and trades are rare in the NFL. They haven't happened with CB in decades that I can find. If you can find one, let me know.

And Jackson wants to get paid. If he gets paid top dollar by another team that doesn't completely suck, he is likely to go along with it. If he can get a Jaylen Ramsey deal elsewhere in a tag and trade, he isn't going to block the trade to play on the franchise tag with the Pats because he doesn't like the team offering the money. Hell, Richard Seymour was willing to take the money from the Raiders after the Pats traded him. He is likely to get a deal worth $18-19 million a year in a tag and trade deal. You really think he will reject that to play for the Pats for one year and $17 million?

And also, you do realize the "not even under contract" part is irrelevant in comparing tag and trade deals because no player that is tagged and traded is under contract other than the franchise tag tender? There is no difference in that area with Jackson or any other player I mentioned.

 

[TheRainMaker]

There hasn't been a top CB who has been tagged and traded in recent years. Why? Because in today's pass happy NFL, CBs are arguably the second most important position in football.

And I gave you two DEs who got far more than a first rounder. I used them because they were the closest comps to Jackson.

This is the exact reason you tag and allow him to find a trade partner.

 

[sb1]

This was JCJ this year when targeted. These stats have the look of someone who won't be that hard to replace rather than an elite shutdown corner that ought to get paid.

He was atrocious in the wild card game. Davis Mills also cleaned his clock.

 

[Rob0729]

This was JCJ this year when targeted. These stats have the look of someone who won't be that hard to replace rather than an elite shutdown corner that ought to get paid.

He was atrocious in the wild card game. Wasn't all that in either Dolphins game. Davis Mills also cleaned his clock.

He is a very good CB. He will be hard to replace. Not impossible. And using the money allocated to him to sign several players could potentially be a better move for the Patriots especially if the Pats can get a first round or second round pick for him in a tag and trade. But who knows?

 

[sb1]

He is a very good CB. He will be hard to replace. Not impossible. And using the money allocated to him to sign several players could potentially be a better move for the Patriots especially if the Pats can get a first round or second round pick for him in a tag and trade. But who knows?

Yeah not impossible for sure. I think there are other good corners like him that can be had with production like this for cheaper.

 

[venecol]

Belichick has tag & traded twice in 21 years: a QB (2009) and a Safety (2003).

If this was so obvious, why didn't he T&T Thuney in 2020?

Not going to happen.

 

[Family]

Were 3 weeks away from March 16th NFL free agency opening, what kind of prices will Karras and Brown demand? How much money will the Pats have to spend after all the trades and cuts?

I"m bad at projecting salaries, but think you can sign Karras for less than David Andrews and he only cost 1.7 from last years cap.

I'm not sure Trent Brown is back. Omwenu will likely slip into his spot.

 

[lancerman]

Just extend him. We can’t lose him and Gilmore in less than two seasons and he’s 26. He can be a key piece for 4-5 years. They can’t afford to get weaker at secondary

 

[venecol]

Were 3 weeks away from March 16th NFL free agency opening, what kind of prices will Karras and Brown demand? How much money will the Pats have to spend after all the trades and cuts?

Well if they tag JC, they'll have $17.5M less.

Raiders may go after both Karras and Brown. They've got $19M in cap space and need a better OL. Zeigler knows exactly what Bill is willing to offer these guys.