FCB02062
Pro Bowl Player
- Joined
- Jun 24, 2010
- Messages
- 14,191
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CLICK HERE to Register for a free account and login for a smoother ad-free experience. It's easy, and only takes a few moments.Player Team Cap hit Receptions Cap hit/reception
1 Demaryius Thomas Broncos $2,592,750 92 $28,182.07
2 Antonio Brown Steelers $3,120,000 110 $28,363.64
3 Harry Douglas Falcons $2,645,833 85 $31,127.45
4 Dez Bryant Cowboys $2,926,000 93 $31,462.37
5 Victor Cruz Giants $2,530,000 73 $34,657.53
6 Emmanuel Sanders Steelers $2,500,000 67 $37,313.43
7 Vincent Jackson Buccaneers $3,272,000 78 $41,948.72
8 Mike Wallace Dolphins $3,250,000 73 $44,520.55
9 Jordy Nelson Packers $3,975,000 85 $46,764.71
10 Delanie Walker Titans $2,950,000 60 $49,166.67
11 A.J. Green Bengals $5,369,481 98 $54,790.62
12 Wes Welker Broncos $4,150,000 73 $56,849.32
13 Marques Colston Saints $4,500,000 75 $60,000.00
14 James Jones Packers $3,750,000 59 $63,559.32
15 Davone Bess Browns $2,683,334 42 $63,888.90
16 Danny Amendola Patriots $3,543,750 54 $65,625.00
17 Hakeem Nicks Giants $3,705,000 56 $66,160.71
18 Dwayne Bowe Chiefs $4,000,000 57 $70,175.44
19 Anquan Boldin 49ers $6,000,000 85 $70,588.24
20 Jason Avant Eagles $2,710,000 38 $71,315.79
21 Pierre Garcon Redskins $8,184,375 113 $72,428.10
22 Greg Jennings Vikings $5,000,000 68 $73,529.41
23 Nate Washington Titans $5,100,000 58 $87,931.03
24 Steve Smith Panthers $5,750,000 64 $89,843.75
25 Brandon Marshall Bears $9,300,000 100 $93,000.00
26 Santana Moss Redskins $4,016,668 42 $95,634.95
27 Eddie Royal Chargers $4,500,000 47 $95,744.68
28 Andre Johnson Texans $10,727,918 109 $98,421.27
29 Nate Burleson Lions $4,031,641 39 $103,375.41
30 Calvin Johnson Lions $8,773,000 84 $104,440.48
31 Julio Jones Falcons $4,413,750 41 $107,652.44
32 Stevie Johnson Bills $5,650,000 52 $108,653.85
33 DeSean Jackson Eagles $9,000,000 82 $109,756.10
34 Justin Blackmon Jaguars $3,265,572 29 $112,605.93
35 Lance Moore Saints $4,568,750 37 $123,479.73
36 Larry Fitzgerald Cardinals $10,250,000 82 $125,000.00
37 Jacoby Jones Ravens $4,900,000 37 $132,432.43
38 Roddy White Falcons $9,125,000 63 $144,841.27
39 Miles Austin Cowboys $3,589,400 24 $149,558.33
40 Reggie Wayne Colts $8,166,666 38 $214,912.26
41 Josh Morgan Redskins $5,100,000 20 $255,000.00
42 Michael Crabtree 49ers $5,770,439 19 $303,707.32
43 Mario Manningham 49ers $2,800,000 9 $311,111.11
44 Mike Williams Buccaneers $8,334,562 22 $378,843.73
45 Santonio Holmes Jets $9,000,000 23 $391,304.35
46 Malcom Floyd Chargers $2,666,666 6 $444,444.33
47 Sidney Rice Seahawks $9,700,000 15 $646,666.67
48 Percy Harvin Seahawks $4,900,000 1 $4,900,000.00
49 Jeremy Maclin Eagles $4,553,000 0 #DIV/0!
50 Devin Hester Bears $2,940,858 0 #DIV/0!
1 Demaryius Thomas Broncos $2,592,750 92 $28,182.07 1430 $1,813.11
2 Antonio Brown Steelers $3,120,000 110 $28,363.64 1499 $2,081.39
3 Dez Bryant Cowboys $2,926,000 93 $31,462.37 1233 $2,373.07
4 Harry Douglas Falcons $2,645,833 85 $31,127.45 1067 $2,479.69
5 Victor Cruz Giants $2,530,000 73 $34,657.53 998 $2,535.07
6 Vincent Jackson Buccaneers $3,272,000 78 $41,948.72 1224 $2,673.20
7 Jordy Nelson Packers $3,975,000 85 $46,764.71 1314 $3,025.11
8 Emmanuel Sanders Steelers $2,500,000 67 $37,313.43 740 $3,378.38
9 Mike Wallace Dolphins $3,250,000 73 $44,520.55 930 $3,494.62
10 A.J. Green Bengals $5,369,481 98 $54,790.62 1426 $3,765.41
11 Hakeem Nicks Giants $3,705,000 56 $66,160.71 896 $4,135.04
12 James Jones Packers $3,750,000 59 $63,559.32 817 $4,589.96
13 Marques Colston Saints $4,500,000 75 $60,000.00 943 $4,772.00
14 Anquan Boldin 49ers $6,000,000 85 $70,588.24 1179 $5,089.06
15 Delanie Walker Titans $2,950,000 60 $49,166.67 571 $5,166.37
16 Wes Welker Broncos $4,150,000 73 $56,849.32 778 $5,334.19
17 Nate Washington Titans $5,100,000 58 $87,931.03 919 $5,549.51
18 Danny Amendola Patriots $3,543,750 54 $65,625.00 633 $5,598.34
19 Calvin Johnson Lions $8,773,000 84 $104,440.48 1492 $5,880.03
20 Dwayne Bowe Chiefs $4,000,000 57 $70,175.44 673 $5,943.54
21 Jason Avant Eagles $2,710,000 38 $71,315.79 447 $6,062.64
22 Pierre Garcon Redskins $8,184,375 113 $72,428.10 1346 $6,080.52
23 Greg Jennings Vikings $5,000,000 68 $73,529.41 804 $6,218.91
24 DeSean Jackson Eagles $9,000,000 82 $109,756.10 1332 $6,756.76
25 Eddie Royal Chargers $4,500,000 47 $95,744.68 631 $7,131.54
26 Brandon Marshall Bears $9,300,000 100 $93,000.00 1295 $7,181.47
27 Davone Bess Browns $2,683,334 42 $63,888.90 362 $7,412.52
28 Julio Jones Falcons $4,413,750 41 $107,652.44 580 $7,609.91
29 Andre Johnson Texans $10,727,918 109 $98,421.27 1407 $7,624.68
30 Steve Smith Panthers $5,750,000 64 $89,843.75 745 $7,718.12
31 Justin Blackmon Jaguars $3,265,572 29 $112,605.93 415 $7,868.85
32 Nate Burleson Lions $4,031,641 39 $103,375.41 461 $8,745.43
33 Santana Moss Redskins $4,016,668 42 $95,634.95 452 $8,886.43
34 Stevie Johnson Bills $5,650,000 52 $108,653.85 597 $9,463.99
35 Lance Moore Saints $4,568,750 37 $123,479.73 457 $9,997.26
36 Larry Fitzgerald Cardinals $10,250,000 82 $125,000.00 954 $10,744.23
37 Jacoby Jones Ravens $4,900,000 37 $132,432.43 455 $10,769.23
38 Roddy White Falcons $9,125,000 63 $144,841.27 711 $12,834.04
39 Miles Austin Cowboys $3,589,400 24 $149,558.33 244 $14,710.66
40 Reggie Wayne Colts $8,166,666 38 $214,912.26 503 $16,235.92
41 Malcom Floyd Chargers $2,666,666 6 $444,444.33 149 $17,897.09
42 Santonio Holmes Jets $9,000,000 23 $391,304.35 456 $19,736.84
43 Michael Crabtree 49ers $5,770,439 19 $303,707.32 284 $20,318.45
44 Josh Morgan Redskins $5,100,000 20 $255,000.00 214 $23,831.78
45 Mario Manningham 49ers $2,800,000 9 $311,111.11 85 $32,941.18
46 Mike Williams Buccaneers $8,334,562 22 $378,843.73 216 $38,585.94
47 Sidney Rice Seahawks $9,700,000 15 $646,666.67 231 $41,991.34
48 Percy Harvin Seahawks $4,900,000 1 $4,900,000.00 17 $288,235.29
49 Jeremy Maclin Eagles $4,553,000 0 #DIV/0! #N/A #N/A
50 Devin Hester Bears $2,940,858 0 #DIV/0! #N/A #N/A
Ok, so here's some quick analysis that should put the 'Amendola is overpaid' argument - even ignoring injury - to rest. Apologies for any formatting errors. Note that I did not remove any players on their rookie contracts here - only the top 50 highest cap hits are included, which is why a great deal like Edelman is not here.
Cap hit per reception:
Amendola is #16... and if you remove Thomas, Bryant, and Green who are all on their rookie contracts, in terms of receptions he was the 13th best value among the top 50 cap hits for receivers (#12 since Delanie Walker is oddly counted as a receiver here, but still).
Cap hit per receiving yard
Amendola is a little worse here, #18 (14 if you remove the 3 rookie contracts and Delanie Walker). But he still does pretty well.
And this is based on pure production. Of course, injured players are penalized tremendously. But of the players above Amendola in the 'value' rankings, only Welker and James Jones missed any games at all, and they missed fewer than Amendola and weren't dealing with a nagging injury the entire season.
Also makes you wish they had managed to sign Emmanuel Sanders.
Wow. Really?
I'm not really worried about how much Robert Kraft paid Danny Amendola - it's completely immaterial to me, you, and everyone else posting on this board. What matters is how much he cost against the cap.
A cap number is like the equator it's an imaginary basis point, when determining value the tangible investment is what matters. This is about Amendola's value vs. the Patriots investment not how financials are manipulated.
A cap number is like the equator it's an imaginary basis point, when determining value the tangible investment is what matters. This is about Amendola's value vs. the Patriots investment not how financials are manipulated.
You need to learn between fact and opinion. You have been stating your opinion. Do you know what the Patriots expected out of Amendola? Do you know for a fact that his groin was not still injured?
Amendolas value in 2013 to the team was $3.54m.
Cap value is what truly matters.
Oh ok do you think the government only taxed Amendola on the $3.54 million? Mortgage companies and loan agents must love you...
This is a very very awful position to have B6. It really shouldn't matter to any of us what Robert Kraft decides to do with his money. The ONLY thing that should matter to those who follow the NEP is whether or not there is cap room to go out and sign more players.
PERFECT EXAMPLE-----Does it make you pleased that even though Aaron Hernandez is not going to be on the team, but rather in prison, he will count $7.5 million against the cap? Robert Kraft does not have to pay him that money, so it is an imaginary basis point and not tangible. There is no actual tangible investment being paid to him, Robert Kraft will not lose any of those millions. So you are saying that you, as a fan and not one of Kraft's heirs, care only that he will not spend that money? That the dead money on the cap brings you relief because it will not actually have to be spent?
Try and explain to me how your position makes sense when framed that way. The ONLY thing that matters when discussing Amendola's pay is how it affects the cap now and in future years. How much he actually makes does not matter at all, not one iota. Only what the Pats can spend on other players.
Please please explain to me how you can dig in on this truly awful position in light of the awesome, excellent and profoundly smart example I just used concerning the murderer. I would love to read you spin this.
What does taxes have anything to do with salary cap value?
At no point did I, and probably not anyone rational, say they expected him to be equal to or better than Wes Welker. Welker is one of the most productive slot receivers in league history - and he was (and is) woefully underpaid relative to his production his entire career, rendering that line of argument moot.
The issue with your argument is the connection that you then make, taking his production and saying he's overpaid. Yet if you look at cap hits, if he is overpaid then so is just about every veteran receiver in the NFL. When presented with this fact, you instead point out that all of them are overpaid as well... that argument simply doesn't follow. Given his production relative to those other players paid comparably or more, one would say his cap hit is right in line with his production, which was over 50 catches in a season where he played injured. A player certainly does not need to be a superstar to justify a $3.5m cap hit.
Your reaction to these two arguments is to handwave it away then continue harping on the tired points you make over and over in machine-gun, wall of text, run-on sentence style... and then throw in some random assertion about replacing Wes Welker's value that I certainly never made and I suspect no one else did either.
And judging Amendola based on the AFCCG is just silly. Blount had 6 yards in that game. Chandler Jones was stonewalled all day. Should we just assume those guys weren't worth it? Heck, the Patriots spent a first round pick on Jones - what a waste. And earlier this season, between the Miami and Pittsburgh games in back-to-back weeks, Edelman had 3 catches for 17 yards total. Don't even think about re-signing that guy.
The thing is that Hernandez received the money that is counting against our cap in 2014 in 2012 when he received $12,740,000 in cash so the money is tangible and it was paid to him by Kraft.
I really honestly have no idea what you're talking about, or who you're talking about. I barely posted here in the spring or summer, and certainly never bashed Welker for his drops in the Super Bowl. Like I said, I wanted to see the Patriots bring back Welker and sign Amendola as well - I watch a great deal of Rams games because my roommate is a Rams fan, and have always been impressed with Amendola. I'll hazard a guess and say I've seen a lot more Amendola than you have.
Again, Welker was woefully underpaid while he was in New England relative to his production. It was a near-certainty that he resented the way he never received a contract commensurate with his value, and that was one reason he left.
Also, Amendola was injured all year. But I guess we're ignoring that again.
http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...le-homicide-charge-2014-cap.html#.UuHW-hDnbIU
Hernandez, per Miguel, is owed a guaranteed payment of $3.25mm in March of 2014. If the contract is voided, that automatically is wiped out - a portion of the huge $7.5mm cap fee due to Hernandez.
IIRC, here's what the Prisoner filed a grievance seeking:
* $3.25M of his signing bonus that was deferred
* $1.32M in guaranteed salary for 2013
* $1.14M in guaranteed salary for 2014
* $500K workout bonus for 2014(?)
The first of those is on the cap already, but the latter three are not.
Your post makes no sense. What about 2013? He was not paid by the team and still counted against the cap. You are saying that he is only being counted against the cap for money paid to him in 2012? That's a pretty screwy contract.
You didn't even answer my question. Carry on, keep hammering away, you have a legitimate chance at 100 posts in this thread if you keep up your breakneck pace.
you want me to look at a number and let that be the value at which I evaluate a players performance against the actual physical money that was paid to him. I cannot do that, every company manipulates numbers but investment vs. return on investment determines value. If Amendola is cut after 2014 he was paid $11,875,000 for 2 years of services rendered so far he has not earned that in my opinion and looking a financial metrics is not going to be the way that I kid myself into believing otherwise.
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