How does the 2019 team NOW compare to the 2007 team?

[TheRainMaker]

affirmative

I’d say no, but he caught the NFL off guard by the way he played boxing guys out like a power forward which paved the way for Antonio Gates.

Gronk for me.

 

[Bruins29]

I’d say no, but he caught the NFL off guard by the way he played boxing guys out like a power forward which paved the way for Antonio Gates.

Gronk for me.

Me too. although some would say TG because his career is like Rice albeit without the hardware (and stickum lol)

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Your main argument neglects the stickum and HOF quarterbacks for the majority of his career (not to mention having Bill Walsh as a coach helps too).

Imagine if Randy Moss had stickum, Joe Montana/Steve Young, and Bill Walsh. Or if he had stickum, Tom Brady, and Belichick for the majority of his career. Randy would easily have an extra 7,000 yards and 40 TDs.



Randy Moss came into the league in 1998. He set the single season rookie TD record with 17 and was the main reason the 98 Vikings broke the record for most points in a season. Your pre-2004 argument holds no weight.



Who hasn't seen Jerry play? I swear people only resort to comments like this when they don't actually have any points to back up their arguments.

He did admit to using stick em, but you have no idea how many games he actually used it. One thing that Rice has over Moss is heart. Randy at times gave up and was the reason why he was traded in 2009.

 

[glm]

lol..!! I destroy your thesis with the fact that Rice has 7,000 more yards and 40 more TD’s.

All you have is your lame “but... but... stickum! Stickum!” I swear people only resort to comments like this when they don't actually have any points to back up their arguments.

In my reply I not only had stickum but also HOF QBs and a HOF Head Coach for the majority of his career.

I repeat if Randy Moss had Tom Brady/Joe Montana/Steve Young and Bill Walsh/BB for the majority of his career while also using stickum then he would've equaled those stats

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

As awesome as Moss was, I would take Rice in his prime. No reliance necessary on good pass protection to setup deep passes and very few bust games. Rice is a guy who gives you 10 receptions and runs every route, whereas Moss breaks a defense over the top. I think Rice's skill set would ultimately lead to more wins, as its more flexible, though he could certainly beat you deep as well.

 

[glm]

He did admit to using stick em, but you have no idea how many games he actually used it. One thing that Rice has over Moss is heart. Randy at times gave up and was the reason why he was traded in 2009.

1. We both have no idea, but we do know he used it. Now I'm not saying that's the reason for all his success. I'm saying it's enough to bump him down to number 2.

2. Jerry Rice did have a lot of heart.

3. Randy Moss was traded in 2010, not 2009. Also BB has gone on record saying he didn't trade Randy for any disciplinarian reasons. So no, he didn't get traded because he "gave up." BB said it was a combination of factors and Randy said it was purely business.

 

[glm]

As awesome as Moss was, I would take Rice in his prime. No reliance necessary on good pass protection to setup deep passes and very few bust games. Rice is a guy who gives you 10 receptions and runs every route, whereas Moss breaks a defense over the top. I think Rice's skill set would ultimately lead to more wins, as its more flexible, though he could certainly beat you deep as well.

I agree that Jerry is better at running the route tree than Randy, but I would like to point out that Randy can also run the whole route tree and in the 2002 and 2003 seasons when he was literally the only receiving threat on the Vikings that's what he had to do. Those two seasons where he played a more complete role as a receiver he averaged 108.5 catches, 1489.5 yards, and 12 TDs.

So while I agree that Jerry is better in the role as a complete receiver, when Randy plays that role he's also a monster.

 

[rads2005]

Woah.

The 2007 OL is one of the best all around units of the free agency era. This is some serious disrespecting of that unit. The 2007 unit would win at LT LG and C by a lot. RT would be a push, and while RG would go to 2019, Stephen Neal was a great player in his own right.

As far as WR -- none of these guys are as good as 2007 Moss or Welker. Whether or not the offense matches up as a whole is another issue. The one edge I would give to 2019 here is that they don't need to be as one dimensional as the 2007 team -- Gordon and Brown both have way bigger route trees than Welker or Moss, but they're also just worse.

I think time has made us underrate that 2007 team. They were one more play from being considered probably the 2nd greatest team in sports history after the 92 Dream Team. 2019 might be amazing, but c'mon.

The RB is way way way better in 2019 though. Sammy Morris and Laurence Maroney wouldn't even make this roster.

This offense won't be as explosive as 2007. It can't be. But it might be more versatile/consistent.

I agree 2007 o-lime was awesome. I remember multiple times watching where Brady felt comfortable holding the ball with all day to survey the field. As an average fan watching, not capable of film analysis. I feel like Shaq Mason gets beat badly more than he should in pass protection for an elite guard. Maybe stats don’t bear that up, but I feel like I’ve seen some bad pass protection from him that are puzzling, like major whiffs or getting bull rushed unlike other good o-lineman I’ve seen.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

The 2019 offense is TBD right IMO. Of course they are obviously very talented as a group. We know about the offensive line depth, particularly at tackle. Then there are three elite receivers in Edelman, Gordon, and Brown, though Gordon and Brown are both risky due to possible suspensions. The Patriots lack of a dual threat TE or even a solid blocking TE could be a problem against good defenses, since right now you are about 85% sure if they are running or passing.

The 2007 defense doesn’t really compare to this one, but again it’s early and injuries can change things. But this defense looks to have truly special potential. The number of formations and versatility is downright scary, like a plan that’s been hatching for about 15 years in Belichick’s mind and finally a reality. It’s almost like you’re never going to see the same defense twice...so much depth and different combinations.

 

[Deus Irae]

It's 2 freakin' games.

 

[supafly]

It's 2 freakin' games.

Versus opponents with a combined 0-4 record, with three of those four losses amounting to blowouts of 30+ points.

Yes, the team looks very good in certain areas, but we’ll need to wait at least two months before attempting to answer this question.

 

[neali]

It's 2 freakin' games.

It's 2 freaking games, but... 2019 Pats 1.5 pts per game, 85 Bears, I think, 12 pts a game. 14 to go.

 

[TommyD4207]

Moss was the greatest Flanker of all time.
Jerry Rice, who could play any receiver position, was the best Wide Receiver of all time.

 

[mgcolby]

To be generic and simple: Better defense, less explosive offense (thus far)

@TommyD4207 so you think the current offense is more explosive and the 2007 defense was better to this point? That's a head scratcher

 

[wizwor]

They have played a lot less games.

 

[BobDigital]

Simply put: Better defense. Worse (but more diverse/dependable) offense.

While the offense will technically be worse IMO, I think it will be more sustainable and consistent. Unlike 2007, which outside of Moss/Welker had few truly dependable things going for it, this offense has a lot more ways to attack you and a lot more players that can be depended on in a pitch to make a play outside of 1-2 star guys.

 

[Deus Irae]

It's 2 freaking games, but... 2019 Pats 1.5 pts per game, 85 Bears, I think, 12 pts a game. 14 to go.

It's 2 freakin' games.

They beat a Steelers team that is trying to learn how to play without 2 of its 3 best players (and, now, without all 3 of them), and is currently 0-2, and they beat a Dolphins team that has lost two games by a combined score of 102-10.

And, now that we know what the Steelers were at the start of the season, we know that the Patriots won't play their first game against an even sort of significant opponent until at least game 8. And, because of the way the schedule falls, we're not really going to know what this team is until somewhere around week 14, unless they prove to be a disappointment by dropping multiple games against decidedly inferior opponents. Or, to put it another way, take a look at the QBs that they are scheduled to play up until that Browns game.

That's not the team's fault, but it's the reality of the 2019 NFL.

 

[Sicilian]

WAY too early for anything like this, but I get why the comparison is being made. Both teams have offenses that are wide receiver centric, defenses that have multiple players who have already won 3 Super Bowls, and came out of the gates blazing. It'll be a fun thing to look at once the season gets some legs under it, but for now it's a week one game (which regardless of opponent, is weird and random) and a game against Miami... a team that has a chance to be historically bad.

I love what we've done, because even against bad teams in bad situations you're not guaranteed 30+ point victories. But that 2007 team was special, first and foremost because of how they just kept doing it all season, AND I feel like they played a lot of playoff teams that year. This team needs to prove their longevity before they're even remotely in that category.

 

[glm]

WAY too early for anything like this, but I get why the comparison is being made. Both teams have offenses that are wide receiver centric, defenses that have multiple players who have already won 3 Super Bowls, and came out of the gates blazing. It'll be a fun thing to look at once the season gets some legs under it, but for now it's a week one game (which regardless of opponent, is weird and random) and a game against Miami... a team that has a chance to be historically bad.

I love what we've done, because even against bad teams in bad situations you're not guaranteed 30+ point victories. But that 2007 team was special, first and foremost because of how they just kept doing it all season, AND I feel like they played a lot of playoff teams that year. This team needs to prove their longevity before they're even remotely in that category.

They played every team with 10 or more wins besides the Titans, Seahawks, and Packers.

 

[PatsDeb]

I'm with Tom Brady. Let's just try to get to 3-0 this week.