Gronk trade completed

[PatsBoy12]

Can't compare Lynch to Gronk IMO. Gronk is a 1st ballot HOF and lynch is massively overrated. If you expect fantasy numbers, that's one thing.. he will draw double teams on 3rd downs and should make some big play when it matters. On paper anyway. It's a damn shame we couldn't find a way to bring Brady back and somehow Gronk as well. The double team alone opens things up enough with the guys NE has to be 12-4 again.

I am talking effectiveness. I couldn't care less about fantasy or accolades. I'm looking for examples where a player took a year off and was effective, meaning he helped the team at least respectably, in his return. Lynch was just the most recent player who left at a high level and tried to come back after a year away.

 

[sb1]

We need to hit a home run in this area. We haven’t replaced the run blocking losses of Trent Brown, Gronk and Allen.

Hope we do. I think they’ll try for sure.

 

[pheenix11]

I have had some time to think about Brady and Gronk leaving and I think they will both learn a lesson when their careers are over. Most of us have worked for a boss or played for a coach that were tough and demanding. However, after leaving for another job or played for another coach, had time to reflect on the experience, realized the tough boss/coach had a very big impact on your career.

Tom & Gronk have never played for another coach or organization. BB is the hardest worker in the room and will push his players to the limit. Gronk had enough of the Belichick way after the 2018 Super Bowl. By all accounts he had a strained relationship with Bellichick in 2018 and it was confirmed when he said that it wasn't fun playing for BB. I think Brady realizes that his best chance to win a super bowl is with BB but after 20 years and frustration with the receiver situation, he thought it was best to move on to another team.

I have no idea how much success that Gronk & Brady will have playing for Arians. However,IMO they will look back when their careers are over and realize they were very lucky to play for Bill Belichick.

They’re both in for a rude awakening.

They’ve only known playing for the greatest coach of all time. The drop off to mediocre NFL coach is huge. There’s a reason why so many coaches have one good year and then struggle to replicate it. Some don’t even make it a full year. They’ll have a great regular season only to see the wheels come off in the pressure of the playoffs.

Maintaining success is almost impossible because the trappings of success are destructive.

As Bane so eloquently put it “victory has defeated you”.

 

[chris_in_sunnyvale]

Jules talking to BB on the phone last night...

Go sit in box for two minutes and feel shame.

Regards,
Chris

 

[Patsgofor4]

Losing Brady, and having a bad offensive roster, and losing defensive talent in the off-season, and having no cap space for quick fixes.

A lot of things are hitting at once to make 2020 look very sketchy.

1. The offensive roster isn't set. Not even close.

2. As has been pointed out MANY times, there a ways to quickly gain 10+ million in cap space. It is likely that the patriots have had discussions with agents for several players and have verbal agreements in place IF they need to restructure some contracts in order to make acquisitions.

3. You are assuming that losing the 2020 version of Brady will be a significant downgrade. I wouldn't be so sure that BB and McDaniels agree.

 

[PatsDeb]

This sucks and we are going to suck this year. We've lost too much, and it is going to burn me to see (if I can even watch) the friggin Tampa Bay Buccaneers waltz into the playoffs with what we should have playing here. Whomever said above that the Pats lost a Super Bowl to the Eagles with with Brady and Gronk inadvertently stated, in my mind, what was the beginning of the end. BB's inexcusable refusal to put Malcolm Butler in the game wasted Brady and Gronk's best Super Bowl performances ever. They were both pissed after that game, with Brady refusing to shake anybody's hand and Gronk ready to retire. They came back for one more, but after that they both wanted out. Why? Face it, they are tired of the way the Patriots "do business" and they are tired of playing for BB. He ****ed them around on money and treated them "just like any other player" one too many times. Now they have taken their talents south and we are all going to pay for it. Flame away.

 

[Tottie]

I am talking effectiveness. I couldn't care less about fantasy or accolades. I'm looking for examples where a player took a year off and was effective, meaning he helped the team at least respectably, in his return. Lynch was just the most recent player who left at a high level and tried to come back after a year away.

Ya it's for sure going to be tough and I wonder how this whole CBD thing is going to go. I guess he's not in the 'program' like Gordon so he'll be treated like all other players in regards to the new CBA policies. I agree though a year away has to be tough and I would think performance might not be the issue after the rust comes off, but staying on the field and recovering might be.

 

[Mack Herron]

I doubt Tampa will trade Howard but you never know.

 

[Patsgofor4]

I doubt Tampa will trade Howard but you never know.

What was the last story that La Canfora broke? I don't believe that he has any good sources and, frankly, I am shocked that he is still employed. He must have some juicy dirt on one of the NFL network executives.

 

[SVN]

They’re both in for a rude awakening.

They’ve only known playing for the greatest coach of all time. The drop off to mediocre NFL coach is huge. There’s a reason why so many coaches have one good year and then struggle to replicate it. Some don’t even make it a full year. They’ll have a great regular season only to see the wheels come off in the pressure of the playoffs.

Maintaining success is almost impossible because the trappings of success are destructive.

As Bane so eloquently put it “victory has defeated you”.

if brad childress can make it to the NFCCG with favre so can arians i think.

 

[PatsWSB47]

I was responding to the point that yes it was a SB champion team that started 3-1. We didn’t know that at the time. I did read lots of talk that they would start 0-4 without Brady. They didn’t. Facts.

I think my posts are being read as anti-Brady. They’re not. My posts here are pro Belichick. One doesn’t have to be the other.

Cassel and the 3-1 start is a track record of Belichick without Brady. How good would Brady have been without Belichick? WE don’t know. We have no history to go on.

We have Brady's will to win, his obsession to be best he possibly to be, his coolness in the highest stakes pressure anyone can be in, his clutch plays when game after game was on the line and his ability to get average players to step up and play great. Thats what we know. Furthermore how great were Mcdaniels's, Wies's and Obrien's teams and offenses when they disnt have Brady. Belichick is the greatest coach ever in a good part due to having Brady to coach. How he's done without him is far from known based on cassel and a 3-1 start. He went 5-11 with Bledsoe, he missed the playoffs with a solid Cassel and in my opinion would have been in another Superbowl had Brady not been hurt with the great players still on that team. I dont think we know as much as you think we do based on the limited data of 2 years and 4 games. What I think we all can agree on is neither Belichick or Brady would have been as good without each other.

 

[Brady_Moss]

I doubt Tampa will trade Howard but you never know.

I think this trade was possibly put on pause until BB figured out what he was going to do with Thuney, to create more cap space.

 

[sean10mm]

3. You are assuming that losing the 2020 version of Brady will be a significant downgrade. I wouldn't be so sure that BB and McDaniels agree.

2019 Brady wasn't 2017 Brady, but I really think you're glossing over how bad QB play can get. Hoyer is a career backup and Jarrett Stidham is an absolute unknown.

As great as Belichick is you can't make something out of nothing. At some point you need players who can play. Belichick has said as much himself. We have no idea what the Pats have at QB, good or bad.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I think this trade was possibly put on pause until BB figured out what he was going to do with Thuney, to create more cap space.

I think so as well. If they get Howard they not only need to clear space but also need to commit to his ~$6m 5th year option by May 5th.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

I wonder what

I think so as well. If they get Howard they not only need to clear space but also need to commit to his ~$6m 5th year option by May 5th.

Would not be surprised if the 4th we got from TB goes back to them for Howard. In effect Gronk and a 7th for Howard. I think most of us would do that deal.

 

[Coolade]

You can, but it just makes you not worth talking to on the subject.

Haha.. you got it backwards..

 

[borisman]

Which 4th did we get from Tampa, 117 or 139?

Ugh! We got 139. BIG difference in this talent pool.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Would not be surprised if the 4th we got from TB goes back to them for Howard. In effect Gronk and a 7th for Howard. I think most of us would do that deal.

Yea that deal feels right.

 

[PatsWSB47]

I don’t see why the Patriots can’t go 4-2 in the division. This division is not THAT good. To get to 9 then you’re looking for 5 wins among Cardinals, Seahawks, Ravens, Texans, Raiders, Chargers, Chiefs, Niners, Broncos, Rams. I don’t think that’s impossible.

And again... it’s April. This is not the final roster.

So many people want to think this team will fall off a cliff without a 43 year old Brady. It’s kind of funny actually.

Even Vegas puts us at about 500 with the loss of a 43 year old quarterback and a banged uo 31 year old unretired tight end. Why? Of course its only April but dont forget its only April for who we have to face this year. The notion that we're going be the team that make just the right moves while everyone is stagnant is lost on me. Don't get me wrong, if we make the playoffs with the bunch we have right now I'd be ecstatic, but what we just moved away from will never be repeated.

 

[Tottie]

I don't see TB doing the deal for a 4th because of how low Howard's cap hit is this year and they won't save a dime because of his dead money also. Obviously they would take a 2nd, but a 4th they might as well keep him for a year. I don't know a thing about this guy but I'm sure he would be an upgrade for us at this point. It's a shame we couldn't get him in the Gronk deal.