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Giardi: Patriots Players are Miserable


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The whole Brady/Belichick, Belichick/Brady thing has reached the chicken/egg point. They are both all time greats but together they are greater than the sum of their parts.
 
The whole Brady/Belichick, Belichick/Brady thing has reached the chicken/egg point. They are both all time greats but together they are greater than the sum of their parts.
This basically.

But I'd definitely argue for Brady being the most important piece in the Patriots success.

He would have had success wherever he landed given how insanely driven and poised the guy is. With a decent team and adequate coach, Brady would still win at least two Super Bowls and be a Hall of Fame QB.

It's more difficult to assess how Belichick's career would have turned out.
 
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I would be willing to wager, Brady feels he's done enough, at 40 years old, after 17 years, 8 trips to the SB and 5 rings, that he's earned the right to be treated more like a peer to BB than a 24 year old kid fresh out of college.
He's not a peer. He's a player, and BB is his coach and his boss.
 
Cute.

In the real world though Brady needs the Patriots as much as they need him. If he walks out, he walks straight into a new OC, new offensive system, all new receiving crew and so on. After hearing for years how notoriously difficult it is to get into his circle of trust and see things the same way he does on the field I am sure it will be just awesome for him to transition into something completely new at the age of 41.

If he walks out of here he is essentially done with competing and becomes a circus attraction for whoever wants him (which will not be many teams).

You homers really need to look more realistically at Brady and his value outside NE. This idea that he has some kind of leverage over walking out is laughable..

Wait, so the reigning MVP becomes a clown show if he plays for any other offense than NEs? Man, put me down as one of the "homers" and I will gladly wear it as a badge of honor. Not many teams would want him? Did Sam Bradford get signed? Case Keenum? Josh McCown? AJ MacCarron? Did a team just trade for Tyrod Taylor?
 
Wait, so the reigning MVP becomes a clown show if he plays for any other offense than NEs? Man, put me down as one of the "homers" and I will gladly wear it as a badge of honor. Not many teams would want him? Did Sam Bradford get signed? Case Keenum? Josh McCown? AJ MacCarron? Did a team just trade for Tyrod Taylor?

I guess it matters how much one considers “many” to be. 8 teams max would’ve been after him. That’s 25 percent. I’m not going to say whether that’s a lot or a little. That’s up for interpretation.
 
If I am speculating I would say the team is simply going through the phase the Lakers went through after their two-peat in 2010. May sound arrogant but the team has tasted significantly more success compared to the rest of the NFL. Two Super Bowl wins and another appearance in four years? I would not be surprised if some of the core players are simply burnt out. Not every player has Tom Brady or Kobe Bryant's sheer competitive nature, and that's normal.

I'd rather think my speculation is much more believable than "Patriots players are miserable".
 
If I am speculating I would say the team is simply going through the phase the Lakers went through after their two-peat in 2010. May sound arrogant but the team has tasted significantly more success compared to the rest of the NFL. Two Super Bowl wins and another appearance in four years? I would not be surprised if some of the core players are simply burnt out. Not every player has Tom Brady or Kobe Bryant's sheer competitive nature, and that's normal.

I'd rather think my speculation is much more believable than "Patriots players are miserable".

Good point. They probably are burnt. Most of these guys from other teams never played in the playoffs. Bradshaw said on tv he thinks a playoff game is like three games of energy. May be he is dumb as he looks but intensity wise it seems partially true
 
Wait, so the reigning MVP becomes a clown show if he plays for any other offense than NEs? Man, put me down as one of the "homers" and I will gladly wear it as a badge of honor. Not many teams would want him? Did Sam Bradford get signed? Case Keenum? Josh McCown? AJ MacCarron? Did a team just trade for Tyrod Taylor?

You are building strawmen arguments. Nobody said he is becoming a clownshow but you.

Saying he will become a circus attraction is another way of saying a non-competing team will try to sign him to get their fans excited and dominate the news cycle without being in a position to actually compete.

Again, you need to READ before you post. It is not about how many teams would want him because obviously he would veto every trade to a non-competing team as any sane player at his age would. Similarly he would not sign as a FA with any of those garbage franchises.

This only leaves a couple of teams. And the majority of those teams are not running a scheme that would emphasize his strengths. This is the thing that the homers dont get. Brady is not better than any QB in every possible aspect of the game. He is hands down the GOAT in couple of them and those are the ones that need to be emphasized by your scheme. You dont get Brady and run a bootleg offense. Similarly he would be competent but by far not as efficient on any west coast style team. Why ? Because the concepts in said schemes dont emphasize the things he does better than anyone else.

Guess what ? If you plan to run a bootleg styled offense then Tyrod might actually be a better option than Brady. If this is a controversial take for you then I suggest you go join some fantasy football boards.

Which brings us back to the point. There are only so many teams that can compete and of those some can be thrown out as a potential place for Brady by the nature of their offense. You dont want to waste any his last 2-3 years by putting him into a rebuilding offense.


To summarize.. nobody is saying Brady would suck outside NE. The entire point is that he only has a limited number of seasons left and no place but NE gives him the opportunity to maxmize his potential in that time.

If he were 32 years old now the entire situation would be different. But at 41 going in to the season he really does not have much leverage at all. His only rope is to threaten to retire which he kinda threw away by proclaiming he wants to play until 45 and betting TB12 on that unprecedented longevity.
 
If I am speculating I would say the team is simply going through the phase the Lakers went through after their two-peat in 2010. May sound arrogant but the team has tasted significantly more success compared to the rest of the NFL. Two Super Bowl wins and another appearance in four years? I would not be surprised if some of the core players are simply burnt out. Not every player has Tom Brady or Kobe Bryant's sheer competitive nature, and that's normal.

I'd rather think my speculation is much more believable than "Patriots players are miserable".
I think the last 4 years have been very draining. On Brady for sure - but the other players as well. Brady is really remarkable - most guys would have packed it in by now.
 
You are building strawmen arguments. Nobody said he is becoming a clownshow but you.

Saying he will become a circus attraction is another way of saying a non-competing team will try to sign him to get their fans excited and dominate the news cycle without being in a position to actually compete.

Again, you need to READ before you post. It is not about how many teams would want him because obviously he would veto every trade to a non-competing team as any sane player at his age would. Similarly he would not sign as a FA with any of those garbage franchises.

This only leaves a couple of teams. And the majority of those teams are not running a scheme that would emphasize his strengths. This is the thing that the homers dont get. Brady is not better than any QB in every possible aspect of the game. He is hands down the GOAT in couple of them and those are the ones that need to be emphasized by your scheme. You dont get Brady and run a bootleg offense. Similarly he would be competent but by far not as efficient on any west coast style team. Why ? Because the concepts in said schemes dont emphasize the things he does better than anyone else.

Guess what ? If you plan to run a bootleg styled offense then Tyrod might actually be a better option than Brady. If this is a controversial take for you then I suggest you go join some fantasy football boards.

Which brings us back to the point. There are only so many teams that can compete and of those some can be thrown out as a potential place for Brady by the nature of their offense. You dont want to waste any his last 2-3 years by putting him into a rebuilding offense.


To summarize.. nobody is saying Brady would suck outside NE. The entire point is that he only has a limited number of seasons left and no place but NE gives him the opportunity to maxmize his potential in that time.

If he were 32 years old now the entire situation would be different. But at 41 going in to the season he really does not have much leverage at all. His only rope is to threaten to retire which he kinda threw away by proclaiming he wants to play until 45 and betting TB12 on that unprecedented longevity.


Definitely not as simple as plug and play. Great offseason discussion btw. To play along I'm going to choose the Browns as a landing spot for Brady. They have talent, cap space and picks. They could really load up and with Brady's leadership it could get interesting.

My thoughts:

1. One of Brady's most important strengths is his gametime preparation. He study's film, has years of experience and can read a defence better than any other QB in the league. That skillset is transferable to any team imo.

- The Brown's defense would benefit. "Dude, I know what you're doing. Every QB in the league knows what you're doing. You need to disguise that better".

- Brady would take command of the offense. It would take time to get his receivers, TE's etc.. on the same page but you know he would demand excellence on every play starting with the first play of TC. The Browns might bring in a few familiar faces (Edelman) to help with the learning curve.

- The OC and the offensive scheme. This would be where it gets tough imo. Even if they switched to an Erhardt Perkins scheme it would take a while (a season or two??) to get everyone on the same page.

So my conclusion would be that if Brady were traded to the Browns this year they would instantly become a playoff potential team and the longer Brady played the more dangerous they would become in the postseason. But time is unfortunately something Brady doesn't have a lot of. Although if he were traded to the Browns Brady would have an everest sized chip on his shoulder.

Teams I think would go after Brady and Brady would play for? I think you're right. Not many because it would mean their current starter would see the bench or there's not enough of a team for Brady to do anything with.

Browns - See above
Texans - Watson is young and the BOB connection. I doubt it. Sitting Watson after his breakout season seems senseless.
Bills - Holy ****. "The Revenge Move"
Cardinals - Holy **** #2 - JAG v GOAT :D
Jaguars - Coughlin teams up with the GOAT.
Bengals??- Nah. I don't see it.
Jets or Colts?? F*** them.
 
Brady would take command of the offense. It would take time to get his receivers, TE's etc.. on the same page but you know he would demand excellence on every play starting with the first play of TC. The Browns might bring in a few familiar faces (Edelman) to help with the learning curve.

That is the thing though.. excellence requires an entire organizational culture to buy in. Those things take time. And my entire argument -- as you have correctly identified but others have not -- is not about Brady and his abilities but about time.

I am absolutely sure that Brady could change an entire organization and turn them around but this is something that doesnt happen in one offseason. And I dont see how he can sacrifice 2 of his remaining years to run a project.
 
Definitely not as simple as plug and play. Great offseason discussion btw. To play along I'm going to choose the Browns as a landing spot for Brady.

As good a place as any to hypothesize about him landing, the natives would be particularly pleased to get those 2 automatic wins against the Stealers every season.
 
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You are building strawmen arguments. Nobody said he is becoming a clownshow but you.

Saying he will become a circus attraction is another way of saying a non-competing team will try to sign him to get their fans excited and dominate the news cycle without being in a position to actually compete.

Again, you need to READ before you post. It is not about how many teams would want him because obviously he would veto every trade to a non-competing team as any sane player at his age would. Similarly he would not sign as a FA with any of those garbage franchises.

This only leaves a couple of teams. And the majority of those teams are not running a scheme that would emphasize his strengths. This is the thing that the homers dont get. Brady is not better than any QB in every possible aspect of the game. He is hands down the GOAT in couple of them and those are the ones that need to be emphasized by your scheme. You dont get Brady and run a bootleg offense. Similarly he would be competent but by far not as efficient on any west coast style team. Why ? Because the concepts in said schemes dont emphasize the things he does better than anyone else.

Guess what ? If you plan to run a bootleg styled offense then Tyrod might actually be a better option than Brady. If this is a controversial take for you then I suggest you go join some fantasy football boards.

Which brings us back to the point. There are only so many teams that can compete and of those some can be thrown out as a potential place for Brady by the nature of their offense. You dont want to waste any his last 2-3 years by putting him into a rebuilding offense.


To summarize.. nobody is saying Brady would suck outside NE. The entire point is that he only has a limited number of seasons left and no place but NE gives him the opportunity to maxmize his potential in that time.

If he were 32 years old now the entire situation would be different. But at 41 going in to the season he really does not have much leverage at all. His only rope is to threaten to retire which he kinda threw away by proclaiming he wants to play until 45 and betting TB12 on that unprecedented longevity.

Well, if the point was that NE gives Brady the best opportunity to maximize in his remaining years than I largely cede that point, although I think Brady to a team like the Jags would make things interesting. I am also pretty certain that us Brady homers recognize that his market has declined from his age 32 season and will continue to decline each season at age 41. But as far as building strawmen – where do you see me or any Brady homers for that matter discussing his prowess in running the “bootleg offense”? I am not sure what this offense is nor what teams are running it. But it is a major stretch on your part to think that we don’t understand that Brady isn’t suited to run a Read-Option system built for the RG IIIs and Kaepernicks of the NFL.
 
I’m not denigrating anyone.....I just refuse to believe that it’s all because of him and that he would have done the same anywhere else

Talk about being flat out drunk on koolaid

The guy has been carrying this team.

That much is absolutely obvious.

I mean, Jabar Gaffney and Reche Caldwell!!!!!

Outside of Gronkowski, he has been given nothing to play with, and Gronk is only there half the time.
 
And 2003? The opportunity to win was handed to him on a silver platter by the defense

2004? 11 takeaways in the playoffs....defense again

1st part of his career his job was to not screw things up since the defense would just sit on the opponent

Yes, he is goat, but it has just as much with the opportunity as it does taking advantage of it

In 2003?!!!!!

The defense gave up 29 points in 31 minutes.

Brady turned in the 3rd greatest performance in Super Bowl history.

350+ yards.

What are you guys even talking about?/????????????????
 
In 2003?!!!!!

The defense gave up 29 points in 31 minutes.

Brady turned in the 3rd greatest performance in Super Bowl history.

350+ yards.

What are you guys even talking about?/????????????????


The defense got the pats to the 2003 super bowl.....NOT BRADY
 
The defense got the pats to the 2003 super bowl.....NOT BRADY

Just like the great defense this year too!

Brady got them that Super Bowl ring. That's why he was Super Bowl MVP.

Do you wonder why I think you're parroting the hater's knock on Brady? You called him a manager. Yet he had the 3rd greatest performance in NFL history.

In fact, since you wrote that (and plenty of people write that and even say he can thank his FG kicker for that victory), I just naturally lump you in with all the people who are completely unaware he had a historic performance. He was amazing.

It boggls my mind that a Patriots fan would diminish that performance. Crazy.
 
In 2003?!!!!!

The defense gave up 29 points in 31 minutes.

Brady turned in the 3rd greatest performance in Super Bowl history.

350+ yards.

What are you guys even talking about?/????????????????

Considering the talent level of the 2003 defense, that was a massive choke job by that unit. They were getting torched left & right by Jake Delhomme.
 
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