For the 2016 Pats to be in/win SB 51 the D has to improve ALOT

[BradyFTW!]

************ they just held one of the more skilled offensive clubs in the league to 17 points (forget their early season stats).

Goal line stand in the first half?

Safety in the second?

The pass rush isn't as potent as last year, but for chrissakes this D can win. They're only going to get better as the season progresses.

The Bengals aren't a very skilled/talented offensive club. They lost Marvin Jones in the offseason and Tyler Eifert hasn't come back yet. That's 2 of their top 4 skill position players from last year.

That said, I agree with the overall point that the defense, while pretty bad in the first half, did come on and get the job done late.

Also. re: the premise of this thread, I'm not sure I agree with it. If you assume that we're going to get nailed by the rash of injuries on offense that we typically get hit with, then sure, that'll have to be made up on defense. But if we can make it to the playoffs without the OL being wrecked, and with Brady, at least one of Edelman/Hogan, Gronk, Bennett, and at least one of Blount/Lewis healthy, then I think this offense has a great chance of bringing home a Lombardi without a significant improvement from the D.

 

[PScottman]

I think Minnesota is better than us.

On defense? Probably. So were the Seahawks in 2014. On offense? No chance. Special teams? Doubtful. Minnesota is Carolina all over again. Great D, with question marks elsewhere.

Team game with a salary cap. Everyone forgets that. You want HOF at every position - play Madden or Fantasy.

 

[pwes]

I'm kind of curious as to where they rank in 3rd down Defense. That's my only contention with the Defense, they can't get off the field on 3rd down and some of them are huge conversions.

 

[HeadHunter]

So, "statistically" we have the 3rd best D in the league?? That's a good thing. And while I will say they are a little on and off, they are not horrible by any stretch and I think they will get even better as the season goes on. Barring injury of course.

 

[letekro]

I know we're missing IMO one of if not the best linebacker out there in Collins (certainly the most athletically gifted along with Mack) but this defense is giving me all the vibes of defense's past that let Tom and the offense down for years in the playoffs until we beat Seattle in 2015.

Now i'm not saying that doesn't mean other teams don't have their own s**t to sort out too but i don't care much for the others because we can only control what goes on in Foxborough and the way i see it this offense is only heading one way. The defense on the other hand, although EVENTUALLY coming good in games, can't expect this trick to work in crunch time come January and hope #12, #87 and the others to bail them out once more.

Anyone else concerned that we're not getting that high level of performance we got a few years ago? Also how close is this D to the finished article because i believe that is key, because if there is room for improvement then that's a great sign but if what we are is the way we will be then i'm not ready to coronate yet like many people seem to be doing.

Stick with soccer.

 

[PatriotsPimp136]

The Bengals aren't a very skilled/talented offensive club. They lost Marvin Jones in the offseason and Tyler Eifert hasn't come back yet. That's 2 of their top 4 skill position players from last year.

That said, I agree with the overall point that the defense, while pretty bad in the first half, did come on and get the job done late.

Also. re: the premise of this thread, I'm not sure I agree with it. If you assume that we're going to get nailed by the rash of injuries on offense that we typically get hit with, then sure, that'll have to be made up on defense. But if we can make it to the playoffs without the OL being wrecked, and with Brady, at least one of Edelman/Hogan, Gronk, Bennett, and at least one of Blount/Lewis healthy, then I think this offense has a great chance of bringing home a Lombardi without a significant improvement from the D.

Well i hope not. It would be nice to stay away from big injuries for once.

 

[PatriotsPimp136]

On defense? Probably. So were the Seahawks in 2014. On offense? No chance. Special teams? Doubtful. Minnesota is Carolina all over again. Great D, with question marks elsewhere.

Team game with a salary cap. Everyone forgets that. You want HOF at every position - play Madden or Fantasy.

True but i was surprise we didn't draft another pass rusher in the draft. Can't have to many and you trade chandler.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Well i hope not. It would be nice to stay away from big injuries for once.

Agreed, IMO the biggest different between 2014 and the other recent teams is that it's the one year we didn't get murdered by injuries.

 

[Pats2000]

Really? You clearly know what i mean, those stats go out the window in those big games. It comes down to who's defense is best equipped being under intense pressure and standing ground. This Pats D is good but don't tell me you are 100% confident that they will get a stop after Tom and the offense do their part like they usually do.

You mean like a goal line stand on 4th and inches...yeah this D could never do that...or back to back safeties in two games...no way this D is good enough for that.

Hell this D couldn't even lead the AFC in scoring D even with the first 4 games run by backups that couldn't stay on the field if they wanted too...

Christ people, there isn't a D in this league that doesn't give up points on some drives. Also, just putting this out there, but for those of you complaining about the pass rush...gap discipline while collapsing the pocket is at the front of BB's priority list against mobile QB'site, not pinning the ears back and getting gashed.

 

[rochrist]

I thought I had gotten OUT of the game day thread!

 

[rads2005]

The defense played better in the 2nd half when they switched up their defense to man-to man.

I think Belichick's been doing the same types of things on defense for so long teams know how to game plan in GENERAL. That and the whole "bend don't break" philosophy, and that teams play their best against the Pats contributes. There's no way the ball should move so easily and so fast like in Super Bowel 2014 when the Seahawks mowed through the D to score a touchdown with like 40 seconds in the half.

I just think the personnel is there to have a truly dominant defense and it's frustrating they don't look like it, often needing opponents' mistakes, penalties, poor decisions to save them rather than outplaying the offenses consistently.

On the other hand, what comforts me is obviously Belichick and Patricia see the same thing. So maybe they'll mix the schemes up some more. Or maybe they don't care, maybe their philosophy is take away deep balls and quick scores, give up lots of short and mid range yardage plays, force the opposing offenses to string together lots and lots of passes and yards, bunker down in the red zone using the end line as an extra defender, have them settle for field goals, and ask opposing teams to outscore the Pats otherworldly offense.

 

[patfanken]

I can't take any more than one page of this drivel. I feel like I fell asleep, had a nightmare, and woke up back in the game day thread again. Some of these threads are ludicrous.

I just left a thread proclaiming Aaron Rodgers is washed up, and now this one trying to tell us that the #1 scoring D in the AFC isn't good enough to get to the superbowl. Are you kidding? Have you so quickly forgotten the 2011 defense that wasn't just bad, but HISTORICALLY bad in giving up yards, and wasn't 2nd best scoring D in the league that year, but the 18th. You remember that defense, the one we had that year we went to the superbowl and came within a hair of winning.

I can only hope that in the 3 pages I will never bother to read, many fans will have echoed what I've written, or rather I have echoed them.

 

[FourierSeries]

I can't take any more than one page of this drivel. I feel like I fell asleep, had a nightmare, and woke up back in the game day thread again. Some of these threads are ludicrous.

I just left a thread proclaiming Aaron Rodgers is washed up, and now this one trying to tell us that the #1 scoring D in the AFC isn't good enough to get to the superbowl. Are you kidding? Have you so quickly forgotten the 2011 defense that wasn't just bad, but HISTORICALLY bad in giving up yards, and wasn't 2nd best scoring D in the league that year, but the 18th. You remember that defense, the one we had that year we went to the superbowl and came within a hair of winning.

I can only hope that in the 3 pages I will never bother to read, many fans will have echoed what I've written, or rather I have echoed them.

None of that matters. "PatriotsPimp" on PatsFans forum isn't satisfied with the 2nd best scoring defense in the league. He needs the team to be leading the league in sacks as well. Therefore, Bill better go out and get every pass rusher currently available, and he better do it immediately.

 

[mikey m]

I'll admit I'm disappointed in the D so far, but that's due to my insanely high hopes for them heading into the season. I think this D will look significantly different going down the stretch then it does now, that goes for the offense too. I think BB and company are still analyzing, determining our weaknesses, etc. rather than doing everything possible to dominate the team in front of us. Not that they're not trying to draw up winning gameplans as every game does matter in this league, but I'd bet that they are holding back a bit as it is most important to play your best ball going into the playoffs.

Our defense improves over the course of the game and it'll improve over the course of the season. It is frustrating though as I feel we definitely have enough talent and pieces on D to not come out so damn timidly to start games, but its all about the big picture.

 

[PF_SU]

True but i was surprise we didn't draft another pass rusher in the draft. Can't have to many and you trade chandler.

And who should've been drafted? I'm no draft expert, but I doubt there was a pass rusher out there that would've helped the team immediately where the Patriots were drafting.

 

[JMC00]

Team gave up only 60 yards after the bungles went up 14-10. How is a defense that stepped up like that not one that can win a SB?

 

[supafly]

The Bengals aren't a very skilled/talented offensive club. They lost Marvin Jones in the offseason and Tyler Eifert hasn't come back yet. That's 2 of their top 4 skill position players from last year.

Add in WR Mohammad Sanu, as well.

 

[mosi]

I always feel that the Pats want to do just enough to win on D but not give anything away for other teams to have film on.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

Current performance of the O + current performance of the D / complimentary football = Patriots as the current most likely AFC SB contender.

A hope for better? Sure. But, fyi, the D is not going to be potent in run stopping, pass defense, rushing the passer. That kind of D is likely to be saddled with a less than potent O or is a one season wonder. That's the reality of the 2016 parody(sic) of the NFL. Bottom line: the Patriots have a team that is SB worthy today and is the envy of virtually all fan bases. Words to the contrary in this thread are bordering on silly and even tinged with the unseemly underbelly of the BB-TB era of entitlement.

 

[DarrylS]

These threads always seem to have the underlying theme of lamenting the lack of QB sacks as an indicator of something more significant than BB believes..

If you listen to the likes of Matt Chatham, Bruschi et al.. they all pretty much echo the same thing that BB values "keeping the edge" than sacking the qb..

Chandler gets glitzy stats, however if he is ineffective on the run or setting the edge is that what the Pats expect from a DE/OLB????

We are not doomed, BB does not fit the mold of meeting disgruntled fans expectations, but somehow wins a lot of games...