Dion Lewis usage last night vs KC

[NE-VT]

Dion Lewis might be better in open space than White. But you have to give up so much versatility to get him into space.

The same thing that makes our offense hard to defend makes it hard to learn. Our receivers are expected to modify their routes in response to defensive coverages. White might have a better understanding of our passing attack than any of the WRs who were active week 2. Having a running back that can be a legitimate slot receiver is a powerful tool. That is not to say Lewis is a poor pass catcher. But White offers more.

I think this is related to one of the reasons Blount was a bit overrated, and that Peterson will have a limited role on the Saints. A run first running back is losing value in today's nfl.

 

[Nunchucks]

I am sure we will see plenty of Dion Lewis this year. The season is young and by the end, everybody will have played a lot.

 

[Simpelton]

Dion Lewis might be better in open space than White. But you have to give up so much versatility to get him into space.

The same thing that makes our offense hard to defend makes it hard to learn. Our receivers are expected to modify their routes in response to defensive coverages. White might have a better understanding of our passing attack than any of the WRs who were active week 2. Having a running back that can be a legitimate slot receiver is a powerful tool. That is not to say Lewis is a poor pass catcher. But White offers more.

I think this is related to one of the reasons Blount was a bit overrated, and that Peterson will have a limited role on the Saints. A run first running back is losing value in today's nfl.

... not least because the shifty little third down guys tend to take less physical punishment and last longer in a league that's always getting larger and stronger at the lines.

 

[Simpelton]

As for White v Lewis... I think that particular controversy was settled last year. Dion Lewis offers very little that James White does not also offer, and White is the guy with numbers on his side.

Lewis will see some playing time, but I'm not convinced that he isn't #4 on the depth chart just now. Gillislee and White have snaps locked down for the situations in which they thrive. They're the primary power back and the primary YAC back respectively. The fight is between Burkhead and Lewis for the remaining snaps, and Burkhead is winning. Burkhead becoming the versatile beast we all know he can be is muscling in hard on Lewis' snaps, whole Lewis is more of a jack of all trades, master of none. He could struggle to find snaps while everyone is healthy, especially if he can't grab a specific role for himself.

 

[RelocatedPatFan]

I will talk with him. He possesses the cat like quickness I preach.

Trying to help you out with some other possible phrases or in terms more palatable (to say it as in) let the cat out of the bag

copycat: Someone or something that copies, imitates, mimics, or follows the lead of another.

Cat's Meow: Top of the range.

A Cat in gloves catches no Mice: Not getting what you want by being careful and polite.

Like herding Cats: Futile.

Cool Cat: Person is unflappable.

Like a Cat on a hot tin roof: Agitated.

More then one way to skin a Cat: There is more then one way to do something.

When the Cat's away, the Mice will play: Without supervision, people misbehave.
play cat and mouse: Essentially toying with an opponent

scaredy-cat -> This one needs a video description

 

[Soul_Survivor88]

As for White v Lewis... I think that particular controversy was settled last year. Dion Lewis offers very little that James White does not also offer, and White is the guy with numbers on his side.

Lewis will see some playing time, but I'm not convinced that he isn't #4 on the depth chart just now. Gillislee and White have snaps locked down for the situations in which they thrive. They're the primary power back and the primary YAC back respectively. The fight is between Burkhead and Lewis for the remaining snaps, and Burkhead is winning. Burkhead becoming the versatile beast we all know he can be is muscling in hard on Lewis' snaps, whole Lewis is more of a jack of all trades, master of none. He could struggle to find snaps while everyone is healthy, especially if he can't grab a specific role for himself.

I agree, the White v. Lewis debate has long been settled, but you're crazy if you think Dion Lewis isn't overqualified for a 4th option depth role!

The Pats are giving more carries to WRs than they are to him. LOL If all they needed was a depth piece with ST value (e.g. kickoff returner) I would've rather the they promoted Foster and dealt Lewis away to a team eager to use him.

He's being under-utilized....and it's unclear exactly why. But he's waaay too talented to be a 4th option on the depth chart. I'm sure his agent feels the same.

 

[IllegalContact]

I agree, the White v. Lewis debate has long been settled, but you're crazy if you think Dion Lewis isn't overqualified for a 4th option depth role!

The Pats are giving more carries to WRs than they are to him. LOL If all they needed was a depth piece with ST value (e.g. kickoff returner) I would've rather the they promoted Foster and dealt Lewis away to a team eager to use him.

He's being under-utilized....and it's unclear exactly why. But he's waaay too talented to be a 4th option on the depth chart. I'm sure his agent feels the same.

I would say his primary role is as a KR right now given we have few other options, I would limit his snap count on offense due to a combo of that need and his inability to play a full season

 

[Soul_Survivor88]

I would say his primary role is as a KR right now given we have few other options, I would limit his snap count on offense due to a combo of that need and his inability to play a full season

Like I said, if all they needed was a Kick returner to step in on offense for depth purposes, DJ Foster would've been a nice developmental piece, that could've fit that role perfectly - with fewer durability questions as well.

It's possible the coaches are still trying to find a role for Lewis, because if he was that un-needed, it would've made sense to have traded him during the summer when other teams called.

If it's a gameplan/match-up concern, perhaps he'll see more action against Houston's linebackers again (he had a MONSTER game in the playoffs against the Texans). If not.... I have to question the Patriots' asset management.

 

[Nunchucks]

As for White v Lewis... I think that particular controversy was settled last year. Dion Lewis offers very little that James White does not also offer, and White is the guy with numbers on his side.

Lewis will see some playing time, but I'm not convinced that he isn't #4 on the depth chart just now. Gillislee and White have snaps locked down for the situations in which they thrive. They're the primary power back and the primary YAC back respectively. The fight is between Burkhead and Lewis for the remaining snaps, and Burkhead is winning. Burkhead becoming the versatile beast we all know he can be is muscling in hard on Lewis' snaps, whole Lewis is more of a jack of all trades, master of none. He could struggle to find snaps while everyone is healthy, especially if he can't grab a specific role for himself.

Lewis was hurt last year. Lewis runs in a dynamic manner that nobody on this roster can match. I expect we will see Lewis and Burkhead share snaps between the 20s on first and second down. Gillislee is the short yardage and clock killing RB. White is the third down and 2 minute back.

 

[Soul_Survivor88]

Lewis was hurt last year. Lewis runs in a dynamic manner that nobody on this roster can match. I expect we will see Lewis and Burkhead share snaps between the 20s on first and second down. Gillislee is the short yardage and clock killing RB. White is the third down and 2 minute back.

hmmmm....I wonder if that's consistent with Rich Hill's analysis

Patriots snap counts reveal how team plans to rotate talent on offense and defense

The biggest (only?) surprise on offense comes at the running back position. How many snaps do you think Rex Burkhead has played? Burkhead’s carried the ball 5 times and been targeted an extra 7 times for a total of 12 touch attempts for 67 yards and a touchdown.

He’s played a mere 18 snaps, meaning the Patriots give him the ball on 66% of his snaps. That’s a ridiculous usage rate. The kicker is that Dion Lewis has played 20 snaps; would you have ever thought Lewis has played more than Burkhead?

James White (47%) and Mike Gillislee (34%) are playing roughly a combined 80% of the snaps based upon the game script. When the Patriots are throwing the ball, White will play a lot and when the Patriots are running the ball, Gillislee will play. It’s pretty simple, but hard to predict. Burkhead and Lewis will get a drive or two per game as change-up options.​

 

[IllegalContact]

Lewis was hurt last year. Lewis runs in a dynamic manner that nobody on this roster can match. I expect we will see Lewis and Burkhead share snaps between the 20s on first and second down. Gillislee is the short yardage and clock killing RB. White is the third down and 2 minute back.

Lewis runs in a manner that gets himself hurt without contact

 

[RobertWeathers]

Lewis was hurt last year. Lewis runs in a dynamic manner that nobody on this roster can match. I expect we will see Lewis and Burkhead share snaps between the 20s on first and second down. Gillislee is the short yardage and clock killing RB. White is the third down and 2 minute back.

As a Patriot, in 119 rushing attempts, Lewis's longest carry is 15 yards.

In 17 catches last year he averaged 5.5 ypr.

You can easily argue he never was a dynamic runner and is no longer a dynamic receiver.

 

[Nunchucks]

As a Patriot, in 119 rushing attempts, Lewis's longest carry is 15 yards.

In 17 catches last year he averaged 5.5 ypr.

You can easily argue he never was a dynamic runner and is no longer a dynamic receiver.

He was hurt last year, he admitted that he came back too early and wasn't ready to play.

I can't believe anybody would make the argument that he was never a dynamic runner.

 

[IllegalContact]

He was hurt last year, he admitted that he came back too early and wasn't ready to play.

I can't believe anybody would make the argument that he was never a dynamic runner.

he is fragile........I don't believe you can count on him as a full time member of the offense even in a rotational situation

'dynamic' does not always translate to 'results'

 

[RobertWeathers]

He was hurt last year, he admitted that he came back too early and wasn't ready to play.

I can't believe anybody would make the argument that he was never a dynamic runner.

I'm making the argument. Its supported by numbers and what we have been seeing over almost the last year.

He was recovering last year and as a receiver I've accounting for that.

In 2015 he was a dynamic receiver but as a running running back, he was steady but not a game breaker. Last year he was effective but pretty much the same runner.

It is an open question if he'll ever be the same and its clear the coaching staff views him as a 3rd stringer.

 

[Simpelton]

Lewis was hurt last year. Lewis runs in a dynamic manner that nobody on this roster can match. I expect we will see Lewis and Burkhead share snaps between the 20s on first and second down. Gillislee is the short yardage and clock killing RB. White is the third down and 2 minute back.

And in a league in which one of the most important attributes of a running back is the ability to stay on the field, perhaps you could explain to me why, exactly, you're attempting to give Lewis a mulligan based solely on injury.

As for dynamic running -- if I need a guy with maximum ability to find the seams and lanes, right now I'm giving the ball first to James White, second to Rex Burkhead, and third to Dion Lewis. Frankly I simply have not seen that "dynamic manner" from Lewis since his injury.

This besides the fact that I have no idea what "running in a dynamic manner" is actually supposed to mean. Feels like something someone just says that's subjective and justifies a player fetish. Especially because I've never exactly been impressed with Lewis in terms of the second most important attribute of a running back -- not only is his durability questionable, his vision has been maybe a tick above average at best, while White sees the field almost as quickly as Brady does.

I think keeping Lewis' snap counts low is the only thing keeping him on the field as effective as he is, since "dynamic" in his case just seems to mean he's pretty meh at everything, and you don't want to get the book out on a guy like that and have the defenses keying in on him.

Lewis has some utility exactly because he's meh at everything, so when he's in there the team can run either a pass or a throw play and Lewis will be exactly as unspectacularly decent at both. This gives Belichick a bit of utility because defenses have to hedge their bets a bit and can't stack against pass or run simply because he's on the field. but since he doesn't stand out at anything you really can't use him as a primary back at any one role, and he can't even abstract his skillset into slot receiving like Burkhead does, so that sharply reduces what you can do with him.

Best use for Lewis right now is as a wildcard back and special teams maestro. And the thing is Burkhead could probably handle every snap they give Lewis in addition to his current duties. Personally I'd be surprised if he finishes the year with the team unless someone else gets hurt.

 

[Nunchucks]

You guys have short memories

 

[Simpelton]

Ahh highlight reels, the most objective of all possible analyses.

What evidence do you have that he's still that guy after freaking knee surgery?

 

[Nunchucks]

Ahh highlight reels, the most objective of all possible analyses.

What evidence do you have that he's still that guy after freaking knee surgery?

My eyes. The guy has had no room to run and still has made ridiculous jukes and cuts.

 

[Oswlek]

Agreed. IDC about durability concerns and declined relevance. Dion Lewis is a human highlight reel. So much fun to watch. Will definitely be missed after this season

Apparently he was told he is very much in the team's future plans. I wouldn't bid him farewell just yet.