Desperate times in KC...

[Steve102]

*best Pitino voice*

...RAC's not walking thru that door, fans.

 

[RelocatedPatFan]

*best Pitino voice*

...RAC's not walking thru that door, fans.

*best 'Joliet' Jake Blues voice*

We're getting the band back together.

 

[ausbacker]

People who persist in saying that only do so because they refuse to grasp that it is the way he's always done it. He pretty much grew Charlie and RAC into coordinators in NY, with the Giants and JETS where RAC worked for BB moreso than BP who never saw his potential and let him walk to Cleveland and Charlie in the swamp where BP never saw great potential in a highschool coaching FO recruit turned OC to the point he routinely demeaned and eventually demoted him and took away his playcalling duties at one point. Neither one of these guys brought a system with them other than the one they learned to run during their time with Parcell's and Belichick in NY. Essentially the same base concepts system and schemes every generation of coordinator here has had to learn to run. And doesn't get to adapt beyond the scope of what Bill determines he wants it to do. They were as such essentially master installation technicians.

The great defensive plan that helped launch a dynasty...that was essentially Bill and Ernie's and Saban's brainchild installed by RAC. The lone TD Brady threw in that game was made possible by an adjustment to the route Bill made on the sidelines based on the coverage he was observing. The drive that allowed for a FG that won it was courtesy of a kid who had the ellusive it factor engineering a no huddle drive with no time outs and needing to cover roughly 60 yards in under a minute twenty.

History has no bearing on the here and now Mo. I see your point, I just don't believe in the current coaches to take this Defense and form them into an above average unit.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

If Romeo were to become available, and BB felt as though he added value to the team, then I'm sure BB would hire him.

I doubt age would have anything to do with it; Romeo is about the same age as Dante.

RAC (and Charlie) both had something Scar doesn't...an ego. If RAC gets canned in KC he will either retire or head off to be a college HC. He didn't really want to be a coordinator any more, he just took the job with Pioli because he saw an opportunity to become one again once Haley flamed out. It should have been a smart move and a decent gig, but something happened along the way, perhaps hanging on to Haley a year too long and allowing the OC position to continue to turnover in that process coupled with some really bad luck on the injury front and Pioli failing to spend and backfill gaps in FA or really complete his housecleaning. He always said a GM's job is to serve the HC's vision, which when BB is your HC makes sense, so in the end I think his choice of Haley just doomed his rebuild out of the gate. There was no valid basis on which to defer to a glorified golf pro turned OC rookie HC whose only tie to the system was tenuous at best (he was on the scouting staff when Bill and Scott were with the JETS, but only as a holdover player personnel director's (Pioli's bosses) son). He rose to offensive assistant (gopher) and in their last year there WR's coach, but Bill didn't bring him to NE...after which he bounced around as a WR's coach and eventual OC minus the playcalling duties but plus an ego on Wisenhut's AZ staff... Bad, bad, bad system fit choice.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

History has no bearing on the here and now Mo. I see your point, I just don't believe in the current coaches to take this Defense and form them into an above average unit.

Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it. If you asked fans here midway through 2001 what they thought of Belichick bringing in his cronies RAC and Weis I bet they'd have wailed that his history with them didn't matter because their plenty talented team at 5-5 coming off a 5-11 season still sucked...and they had no belief in this coaching staff's ability to alter that circumstance. RAC was just some former ST coach from the Giants who had failed like BB in Cleveland and Charlie was the guy Parcell's had no faith in as his OC.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Rumors were that Pioli was going to be fired last week.

Funny how Quinn was named the starter this week when Cassel is well enough to play and pulling down a boat load of cash.

The other rumor was Hunt had a 2 year extension offer on the table... Neither trigger has been pulled and it remains a tossup which will. That is what has created a situation so desperate not only has Cassel been benched in favor of Quinn...but Pioli spent several hours last week conducting interviews with local media calling for his head at his request. Like I said, desperate times...

 

[Bobs My Uncle]

RAC (and Charlie) both had something Scar doesn't...an ego.

Did they not have an ego the last time BB hired them?

 

[ausbacker]

Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it. If you asked fans here midway through 2001 what they thought of Belichick bringing in his cronies RAC and Weis I bet they'd have wailed that his history with them didn't matter because their plenty talented team at 5-5 coming off a 5-11 season still sucked...and they had no belief in this coaching staff's ability to alter that circumstance. RAC was just some former ST coach from the Giants who had failed like BB in Cleveland and Charlie was the guy Parcell's had no faith in as his OC.

I'd like to agree with you but there is no comparison between the then and now.

 

[chasa]

The year he was 8th was when Weiss was OC and ran essentially New England's system.

So they ran the same offense with none of the parts. I don't think that qualifies as a "system QB" When i think of a system QB its someone who only has success with a certain coach(Mcdaniels) with certain elements in place(welker/moss).
Cassel had none of that during his time in KC he had Wiess running a NE like offense, which was different then JMc ran, while similar at a base level.


I think Cassels biggest downside has been the coaching and the lack of talent around him.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Honest question for everyone, does anyone think Romeo can actually come up with game plans to help fix this atrocious secondary we have ? I'd be thrilled to have him back. Patricia seems too vanilla as far as his defensive schemes.

We have the youngest team in many a year. Plus there has been no continuity, as much of the secondary has been dinged up, at various times. For the past two games neither starting Safety has been out there. We played two or three rookies in the secondary yesterday.

Like a baby, you have to crawl before you walk. Walk before you run.

Coaches expecting a baby to run are in for a rude awakening. Good Coaches know that ther are such things as "growing pains"; and are wise enough to be stoic about it, and not expect play beyond the possible. They expect the baby to execute the fundamentals first, before they install sophisticated blitzes, and disguises.

Even then with fundamental play you can expect breakdowns. Like the wide open Steven Hill in the fourth quarter. Like the rookies he played against, that rookie too, dropped the ball.

 

[Triumph]

The other rumor was Hunt had a 2 year extension offer on the table... Neither trigger has been pulled and it remains a tossup which will. That is what has created a situation so desperate not only has Cassel been benched in favor of Quinn...but Pioli spent several hours last week conducting interviews with local media calling for his head at his request. Like I said, desperate times...

A 2 year extension isnt exactly a glowing thanks of what your GM has accomplished and sort of says "Lets see how you perform before we make a long term commitment."

Kraft wouldnt offer BB 2 more years because its insulting.

My point was that Pioli is controlling everything in KC and I mean everything. RAC is just a puppet and though it appears that he pulled Cassel, I do not buy it. Pioli had to go out and speak publicly because the 1 - 5 Chiefs are likely done this year and he stays insulated from the public and rarely gives interviews or is heard from.

 

[condon84]

The mistake he made was trying to replicate what he left in NE minus a competent coaching staff. As for RAC, he drafted Quinn...which is why he's even still in the game as a backup in KC.

Phil Savage was the Browns GM when Crennel was there. I'm not going to place the blame on RAC for the drafting of Quinn when he was not in charge of personnel decisions.

RAC has shown that he can coach up a team when he has quality players. He led them to a 10-6 season in 07 when he was getting steady play from Anderson.

Getting back to Cassel, there is no way you can watch him play and say he's a good QB. He's as bad as Mark Sanchez. They are the two worst starting QBs in the NFL.

 

[Danger Zone]

It would tickle me to see RAC come be our DC after he gets fired about as much as it would for RR to do the same.

 

[The Boston Patriot]

Honest question for everyone, does anyone think Romeo can actually come up with game plans to help fix this atrocious secondary we have ?

No, but maybe he would recognize how bad it really is and try to do something about it. It seems nobody else on this team seems to be aware of how pathetic it is. There are two issues here that need to be addressed.

1) Why is it that nobody, and I mean nobody, that has been drafted, traded for, or acquired by any means has worked out in the secondary?

2) Given that 'they' think they are obtaining players that can function in a defensive secondary and then they seemingly turn to crap. Then the coaching staff blows and desperately needs to be completely retooled.

Folks, this ain't working and hasn't been for some time.

 

[Kontradiction]

No, but maybe he would recognize how bad it really is and try to do something about it. It seems nobody else on this team seems to be aware of how pathetic it is. There are two issues here that need to be addressed.

1) Why is it that nobody, and I mean nobody, that has been drafted, traded for, or acquired by any means has worked out in the secondary?

2) Given that 'they' think they are obtaining players that can function in a defensive secondary and then they seemingly turn to crap. Then the coaching staff blows and desperately needs to be completely retooled.

Folks, this ain't working and hasn't been for some time.

Actually, it's even worse than that. The Patriots have been trying to fix it since 2008.

 

[The Boston Patriot]

Actually, it's even worse than that. The Patriots have been trying to fix it since 2008.

Yeah, I was alluding to that in the 'some time' comment.

 

[chasa]

Phil Savage was the Browns GM when Crennel was there. I'm not going to place the blame on RAC for the drafting of Quinn when he was not in charge of personnel decisions.

RAC has shown that he can coach up a team when he has quality players. He led them to a 10-6 season in 07 when he was getting steady play from Anderson.

Getting back to Cassel, there is no way you can watch him play and say he's a good QB. He's as bad as Mark Sanchez. They are the two worst starting QBs in the NFL.

I'll take cassel over:

Palmer
Skelton*
Kolb*
Gabbert
Sanchez

 

[Observer]

Man, all of these ex coaches failing everywhere makes it seem that Brady is the be-all and end-all of the New England Patriots.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Phil Savage was the Browns GM when Crennel was there. I'm not going to place the blame on RAC for the drafting of Quinn when he was not in charge of personnel decisions.

RAC has shown that he can coach up a team when he has quality players. He led them to a 10-6 season in 07 when he was getting steady play from Anderson.

Getting back to Cassel, there is no way you can watch him play and say he's a good QB. He's as bad as Mark Sanchez. They are the two worst starting QBs in the NFL.

RAC was on board with with all those decisions. He and Savage, who was a former scout and coaching assistant and eventually personnel assistant for Belichick in Cleveland and moved on to Baltimore with Ozzy and Pioli and the rest after BB resigned, and RAC were a package deal. And when Phil clashed with the former team president after their first season, RAC backed him and the other guy departed. RAC wanted Quinn in 2007 and he brought him in to KC in March as the third QB this season behind Cassel and Stanzi. Same as he brought in Daboll, his former OC in Cleveland during the Brady Quinn non era.

Cassel is no Tom Brady, but he was an average starting caliber QB for an NFL franchise before Haley nearly got him killed and messed with him through 3-4 coordinators (Haley included) in just 3 seasons. On a team whose young talent was flat out snake bit injury wise. And playing behind some truly pathetic OLines. Charlie sold his old pal a phony bill of goods on Quinn, whom Charlie kept insisting was the next coming of a QB named Brady.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

A 2 year extension isnt exactly a glowing thanks of what your GM has accomplished and sort of says "Lets see how you perform before we make a long term commitment."

Kraft wouldnt offer BB 2 more years because its insulting.

My point was that Pioli is controlling everything in KC and I mean everything. RAC is just a puppet and though it appears that he pulled Cassel, I do not buy it. Pioli had to go out and speak publicly because the 1 - 5 Chiefs are likely done this year and he stays insulated from the public and rarely gives interviews or is heard from.

It wouldn't be offering him two more years, it would be adding 2 years on to the time he has remaining on his 2009 contract, which was either 5 or 6 years meaning he is signed through 2013 or 2014 as it is. There is some disagreement as to whether or not he has been offered any extension. If he has though, the hangup is buyout language indicating Hunt have a lot of faith in him so much as he was perhaps trying to get his critics off his back with a show of faith extension.

RAC and Scott are pretty much joined at the hip now and fighting for their careers. I assume it was a mutual decision reached in the hope it somehow turns around a 1 win season. Otherwise one if not both of them are history in KC, as is Matt, the guy who had the least control over his destiny. But at least he pocketed $40M of Hunt's money. And considering the beatings he's absorbed, physically and emotionally, good for him.

As for RAC, he inherited some talent on D and Pioli did better at landing him more than he did landing the offense any that can stay on the field and function at a consistent level. RAC hasn't done much with it. Their D is worse than Patricia's this season, and RAC is both the HC and DC by choice.