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Criticizing Belichick the GM

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by p8ryts, Oct 31, 2019.

  1. patsinthesnow

    patsinthesnow PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    A few takes come to mind when evaluating BB the GM:

    No Team Can Beat the Draft
    • One could argue that there isn't one team that drafts well (over a big enough sample size). While there is enough data to support that check out a team's draft history & most likely you'll be saying miss more often than hit.

    • Belichick's trade steals as well as the amount of trades he makes outweigh the misses. Jason McCourty & Kyle Van Noy for late round pick swaps are all time trades. Trent Brown for a mid-round pick swap has arguably been a home run. These are just some trades in the last few years. Making the most trades in the league (along with being the best coach to coach them up) allows these trades to happen. That's why a Bodine whiff isn't really a big deal.
    • The Pats UDFA history is nearly unprecedented & the best in the NFL - Malcolm Butler, David Andrews, Jonathan Jones, Adam Butler, JC Jackson, etc. These aren't just role players. They are players that would go in the first two rounds in a redraft.
    I’ll take the elite success rate with trades & UDFAs along with what may be an average to below average success rate with the draft in recent years.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 31, 2019
  2. DropKickFlutie

    DropKickFlutie 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    Excellent excellent post.

    A couple more undrafted guys, and if you count low picks. Edelman, Brady, Jacobi Meyer, Develin, Burkhead
     
  3. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Come on. When you're calling the Shelton trade an arguable home run, you're making your entire argument a garbage argument. The Shelton trade was a total bust.

    It was only after his deal ended, and he was a UFA, that he got his ass into game shape and became an NFL level player worth having.
     
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  4. Sicilian

    Sicilian Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    Literally no one thinks that.
     
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  5. 203Pat

    203Pat In the Starting Line-Up

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    Burkhead was a FA from Cincinnati.
     
  6. patsinthesnow

    patsinthesnow PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    He played great in the biggest game in 2018. I don't think that makes my other points garbage but thanks for the input. I revised the post to not include him.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 31, 2019
  7. 203Pat

    203Pat In the Starting Line-Up

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    When people defend the Cyrus Jones and Duke Dawson picks I would assume someone literally thinks that.
     
  8. NG Pats Fan

    NG Pats Fan PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I’m most disappointed at last years draft missing out on Lamar Jackson. Patriots were very very high on him, yet passed on him not once but TWICE. We would have been set up for the next ten years post Brady because Jackson is a stud. That was our future franchise QB.

    With real speculation of Brady either leaving or retiring, we need to find that next QB to keep our head above water, Stidham is NOT the answer.

    Hindsight is 20-20 but it realistically could and should have happened given Brady’s age.
     
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  9. Sicilian

    Sicilian Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    That's not what that means. It means they have a different opinion on those players (and how to evaluate the reasoning behind the picks/cuts/etc). Find me a person who thinks BB has never made a bad move and I'll laugh at them with you. Disagreeing on individual instances doesn't mean suddenly they can't view any other moves as bad.
     
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  10. 203Pat

    203Pat In the Starting Line-Up

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    There should be no difference of opinion on either Dawson or Jones. They were flat out busts. Not underachievers or victims of circumstance, just flat out bad picks.
     
  11. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I think fans put more weight on the draft than Belichick does.
    To him it's always been one of 3 ways to acquire talent.
    I also think how hard it must be to draft a player to become part of the
    ultimate teams in all of sports ... much harder than drafting for a crap team.
     
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  12. shmessy

    shmessy . PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I don't like his lip kissing after SB wins.

    .
     
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  13. SBLIII

    SBLIII In the Starting Line-Up

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    He just included the Shelton trade to make the accomplishments look more impressive.
     
  14. SBLIII

    SBLIII In the Starting Line-Up

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    Mason
    Thuney
    Jones
    Jackson
    Michel
    Wise
    Winovich
    etc.

    have been part of our last 5 draft classes all who already helped us win games and Super Bowls
     
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  15. Sicilian

    Sicilian Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    Both are still playing in the league. If you want to argue they shouldn't, that's fine. People who run actual NFL teams disagree with you. At the very least, that makes the point ARGUABLE. But in your world, disagreeing with you is apparently unacceptable.

    By the way, I don't even think they're good players. I just think it's ridiculous to use two cherry picked examples as some sign that someone, ANYONE thinks BB has been perfect.
     
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  16. shmessy

    shmessy . PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Wasn't Jackson a UDRFA?

    .
     
  17. NG Pats Fan

    NG Pats Fan PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Mason and Thuney are good players
    2 guards though are your best players you’ve gotten in a combined 5 drafts?

    Wino looks like a major player, that’s good we needed someone from this class to step up

    Sony is so mediocre, passed up on Chubb
    Wise stinks
    JC Jackson went undrafted so doesn’t count, he is terrific though
    Jones undrafted again doesn’t count

    Not one decent skill position player from the past 5 drafts? Unless you count Sony, who I am not impressed with long term at all. And we passed up on his far superior generational talented college teammate.


    What about all the misses? Check rounds 1-3 in 2015-2019. A ton of misses. Non contributors, injured players

    B.B. drafted Brady, and 5 superstars from the 2009-2013 drafts that paved the way for these titles.

    Long term we could be in trouble when Brady retires
     
  18. SammyBlueCat

    SammyBlueCat PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Let me tell you something. I have first hand knowledge that Coach Bill is Cat like quick!!!!
     
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  19. SBLIII

    SBLIII In the Starting Line-Up

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    nobody knows/knew when Brady retires.

    With Brady having intention to play until he is 45 and coming off a MVP season there was/would be a real chance that Lamar would have sat on the bench through his entire rookie deal.

    If you draft a QB early you need them to play when they are cheap
     
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  20. Froob

    Froob Independent Investigator & pliable af PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Bill has some **** ups, especially in the secondary in the draft, but he more than makes up for it (especially poaching no name vets from other squads).
     

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