Contracts to deal with

[shmessy]

Playing-time is usually a good indicator.

Of all the Patriots starters, were there any who played a higher percentage of snaps in that last game than Wilfork? I don't know, maybe someone here has that breakdown.

Significant playing time in a meaningless exhibition last game of a season with the playoffs looming ahead is only an indicator of one of two things

1) You are a scrub and expendable
or
2) the organization is trying to help you attain you your NLTBE bonus.

 

[shmessy]

There is this:

http://itiswhatitis.weei.com/sports...yday-in-sundays-season-regular-season-finale/

"......With the game being meaningless in terms of playoff positioning with the Patriots already locking up the No. 1 seed, big-name players like Rob Gronkowski,Julian Edelman and Dont’a Hightower were inactive as the Patriots prioritized health. There was some questioning during the week of whether or not Wilfork would play enough to collect the bonus

That was answered in the first half with a big yes, as Wilfork played all but two of the defensive snaps. The 33-year-old played 38 of a possible 58 snaps by our count overall in the game, and thus finished the season playing a total of 74 percent of the snaps (818 of 1109)."

They got him in there for "all but two" first half plays? I'm guessing that must have been well north of 90% in the first half of a meaningless game.

Then they evidently, gave him the 2nd half off with Mission Accomplished.

 

[Miguel]

Of all the Patriots starters, were there any who played a higher percentage of snaps in that last game than Wilfork? I don't know, maybe someone here has that breakdown.

Significant playing time in a meaningless exhibition last game of a season with the playoffs looming ahead is only an indicator of one of two things

1) You are a scrub and expendable
or
2) the organization is trying to help you attain you your NLTBE bonus.

My quote was about how fans know how a coaching staff evaluates players.

 

[Miguel]

Fyi - I kept weekly track of Patriots incentives and tweeted how many plays Wilfork had to play in Week 17 based on the average number of snaps.

 

[hwc]

Honestly, I don't much care about Wilfork's playing time incentives and so forth. I'm glad he got one last year in. I'm glad he got paid. I'm glad he got a ring. It's all good.

I don't see where negotiations for 2015 go anywhere good. It's time. Really the best for the Pats if Wilfork goes out on top and decides to hang up the cleats. Even if he plays every snap (which would not be best for the team), I don't see how he would be worth enough for the Pats to offer him a deal that wouldn't be insulting. Realistically, a 34 year old 400 pound run stuffer has to be a limited duty role player and that spells something closer to vet minimum than $9 million.

What am I missing?

 

[Deus Irae]

There is this:

http://itiswhatitis.weei.com/sports...yday-in-sundays-season-regular-season-finale/

"......With the game being meaningless in terms of playoff positioning with the Patriots already locking up the No. 1 seed, big-name players like Rob Gronkowski,Julian Edelman and Dont’a Hightower were inactive as the Patriots prioritized health. There was some questioning during the week of whether or not Wilfork would play enough to collect the bonus

That was answered in the first half with a big yes, as Wilfork played all but two of the defensive snaps. The 33-year-old played 38 of a possible 58 snaps by our count overall in the game, and thus finished the season playing a total of 74 percent of the snaps (818 of 1109)."

They got him in there for "all but two" first half plays? I'm guessing that must have been well north of 90% in the first half of a meaningless game.

Then they evidently, gave him the 2nd half off with Mission Accomplished.

You seem to prefer to ignore the connection between your claim (i.e. doing Wilfork a solid) and the inverse claim (i.e. not screwing Wilfork over). Wilfork's week 17 snap totals were not out of line with his usual totals.

Others will take a different approach to the same information.

 

[mgteich]

The patriots could have reduced the percentage before the game.

Or the contract could have anticipated the possibility of a meaningless last game, and had an automatic change in percentage.
========

What happened was that Belichick didn't risk the health of lots of starters not named Wilfork. Some were inactive. Others played sparingly. Belichick CHOSE to risk injury to Wilfork, and risked weakening the team in order for Wilfork to reach the incentive.

We can label this decision in whatever way we want. If the goal was to have the best team possible ready for the playoffs, I think that Belichick could have done something different. Perhaps Vellano and Chris Jones might have been out there a lot.
=========
The team did what it did.

That being said, I don't think that this decision will factor into the negotiations in any way. Obviously, had Wilfork NOT made the mark and therefor NOT received the incentive, there would have been a negative effect on the negotiations.

 

[Huckleberry1]

The Patriots has no way of knowing that'll the last game would be meaningless and they did right by Wilfork to make sure it didn't cost him an incentive he would have earned had it been meaningful. Wilfork earned his pay and had a really good season for b them but I would be very surprised if they didn't try to get a restructure out of him that cost him pay this season. I really don't think they want to see him making more than 5 million when all is said and done, and at this point in his career that's fair pay IMO. Hopefully they can come to an agreement because it would be a shame to see him go out on a bad note.?

 

[shmessy]

You seem to prefer to ignore the connection between your claim (i.e. doing Wilfork a solid) and the inverse claim (i.e. not screwing Wilfork over). Wilfork's week 17 snap totals were not out of line with his usual totals.

Others will take a different approach to the same information.

You seem to ignore that the other 15 games meant something and that last one didn't. It was a meaningless exhibition. You can't see the difference between meaningful games and a meaningless exhibition.

How many other starters for the New England Patriots defense played all but two snaps in the first half that day?

"Wilfork's week 17 snap totals were not out of line with his usual totals."

Exactly. What other starter on the New England Patriots could say the same? None. Can you comprehend the reason why?

 

[Huckleberry1]

I don't believe you can modify incentives during the season, and I know you cannot just give players money for incentives they didn't meet because it violates the cap. The Pats did right by Wilfork and they have done the same for other players in the post. They don't screw players who have éarned bonuses and they don't just hand them out to those who haven't earned them, and that's how it should be.

 

[mgteich]

I really don't think they want to see him making more than 5 million when all is said and done, and at this point in his career that's fair pay IMO. Hopefully they can come to an agreement because it would be a shame to see him go out on a bad note.?

So, you think that Wilfork will just accept a re-write of his contract that cuts $4M of his bonus?

 

[shmessy]

I don't believe you can modify incentives during the season, and I know you cannot just give players money for incentives they didn't meet because it violates the cap. The Paid did right by Wilfork and they have done the same for other players in the post. They don't screw players who have éarned bonuses and they don't just hand them out to those who haven't earned them, and that's how it should be.

They evidently did modify Vollmer's incentives in November.

 

[Huckleberry1]

They evidently did modify Vollmer's incentives in November.

Wow, I thought they were locked in once the season starts or teams could screw with them at will.

 

[Deus Irae]

You seem to ignore that the other 15 games meant something and that last one didn't. It was a meaningless exhibition. You can't see the difference between meaningful games and a meaningless exhibition.

I'm not ignoring anything. I'm not sure why you refuse to accept the obvious here: Wilfork did not play an amount of snaps that was out of line with his normal 2014 game. You are claiming that's somehow a sort of 'favor' on the part of the Patriots. Others simply note that it's the Patriots not screwing him over by sitting him out when he had a reachable incentive. Calling the game an exhibition doesn't change the facts.

Ninkovich played 42 of 59 snaps
Jones played 41 of 59 snaps
Revis played 31 snaps
Collins played 32 snaps
McCourty played 32 snaps
Vince played 38 snaps
Chung played 39 snaps


Vince's numbers weren't out of line with other defensive starters who played in the game.

 

[Huckleberry1]

So, you think that Wilfork will just accept a re-write of his contract that cuts $4M of his bonus?

No, I think he will ask for his release. I just don't believe they will pay him 9 million for ,2015. Hopefully they work it out, I want him here.

 

[mgteich]

I don't believe you can modify incentives during the season.

Vollmer's contract was changed on November 10th to reduce the requirements of playing time to earn his incentives.

http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-...ebastian-vollmers-contract-incentives-changed

 

[mgteich]

Wow, I thought they were locked in once the season starts or teams could screw with them at will.

No, not the teams. Both parties have to agree to any change in contract. Technically, it is a new contract.

 

[mgteich]

No, I think he will ask for his release. I just don't believe they will pay him 9 million for ,2015. Hopefully they work it out, I want him here.

There is no need for him to "ask" for a release. He will be free agent on march 10th. If the team doesn't cut him, they will owe him a bonus check for $4.5M.

 

[Huckleberry1]

There is no need for him to "ask" for a release. He will be free agent on march 10th. If the team doesn't cut him, they will owe him a bonus check for $4.5M.

You don't think they will attempt to redo it?

 

[shmessy]

There is no need for him to "ask" for a release. He will be free agent on march 10th. If the team doesn't cut him, they will owe him a bonus check for $4.5M.

I wonder what will come first; a resolution to the Vince Wilfork situation or the publishing of the Wells report.