Bring on the Ravens

[RodThePat]

My point is that Brady was just as much the caretaker as Flacco is perceived to be.

Except that he had already made the Pro-Bowl twice and had led the league in TD passes by his fourth year (third starting). Flacco plays in a team with much better offensive weapons, in a much more passing-friendly environment, and is much less accomplished throwing the football. The perception of Brady by his fourth season was that he was in the upper echelon of NFL QBs. You'd be hard pressed to find somebody outside of Baltimore that ranks Flacco in the top-15 of his position at this point.

 

[Kid~Brady]

My point is that Brady was just as much the caretaker as Flacco is perceived to be.

I feel you. No harm done. I just think these two QBs were always light years away from each other.

Consistency determines a good or "elite" QB to me. I hear Flacco wants to get paid like an elite.... even the Ravens arent buying that. Ed Reed just ripped this kid.

 

[robbomango]

Its called an opinion.

I can respect your opinion but you stated comments concerning flags as facts. I don't care if Brady gets the most or the least if the data supports it so if you have a link please supply it.

Peace

 

[Ron Sellers]

I never said he complained at a press conference. I will give him credit for that. However I have scene numerous times him complaining to the refs for something totally ridiculous.

Your right you guys do watch more pats game than me naturally. Seems like every pats game i watch he comes across as a whiny pretty boy.

So it would be okay if he lobbied for a flag if he was ugly?

I think the fact that you felt compelled to include the term 'pretty boy' exposes your pre-conceived bias, and makes it hard to believe that you are watching those games objectively - or that your opinions and conclusions are not completely clouded by your fandom.


You would have a valid point if other players or coaches seldom if ever asked for a flag, but that is simply not the case in today's NFL.

 

[Double TE]

I think we all agree that Brady knows the game as well as anyone and sees the field better than most everyone. Hence he probably sees penalties that officials may miss. So he points them out? What is wrong with that. Boldin was looking at the officials all day on Sunday when he did not catch a pass. Doubt it was PI on every play.

This is a silly argument.

 

[Ravensfan]

I know someone mentioned it's not all about the numbers but I still would like to point out that Flacco's and Brady's numbers are VERY similar through each of their first 4 years in the NFL. Flacco makes his share of mistakes just like any other quarterback but he's not too bad. He's certainly not at a level of Brady, Brees, Rodgers, or Manning but he's not terrible.

Comparing Flacco To Remaining Playoff QBs

According to outside linebacker Terrell Suggs, the Ravens will be facing one of the top three quarterbacks of all-time this Sunday in New England’s Tom Brady.


“When it’s all said and done, it’s going to be Johnny [Unitas], him and Peyton [Manning], end of discussion,” Suggs said.

What Suggs, and others, may not realize is that the Ravens have a quarterback on their own sideline that has in many ways mirrored Brady’s statistics over their first four NFL years.

A closer look at Flacco’s numbers compared to the three remaining quarterbacks in the playoffs – Brady, New York’s Eli Manning and San Francisco’s Alex Smith – shows that Flacco is neck-and-neck with Brady and ahead of the others.

Flacco came out of Delaware as opposed to Brady’s Michigan, Smith’s Utah and Manning’s Ole Miss, all big-time Division I programs.

Over their first four years, Flacco has the second-highest completion percentage (61 percent), only trailing Brady (62 percent). Flacco has the most passing yards per game (215.9) of the three, 2.7 yards ahead of Brady. Flacco has the second-highest collective quarterback rating (85.9). Brady’s is 86.0.

....

Flacco has said before that a quarterback often doesn’t get recognition until they win a Super Bowl ring. Brady won his first in just his second year. Manning won his in his fourth season.

In his fourth year, Flacco can get to his first Super Bowl if he wins on Sunday in New England.

“Hey, this is what a team, this is what a player, lives for is playoff time, and having to win tight games or what could possibly be tight games,” Flacco said last week. “That’s what I, that’s what we all, really want to be in the position to do.”

This season, Flacco has excelled in tough games against playoff opponents.

In seven games against 2011 playoff teams, the Ravens are 7-0. But everybody knows that Flacco is a winner. After all, he’s won more games than any starting quarterback in modern history in his first four years.

In those seven games, Flacco has completed 126 of 202 passes (62 percent) and thrown 10 touchdowns to just two interceptions. He has averaged 224 passing yards per game and posted an average quarterback rating of 99.6.

Those numbers have not only come against playoff teams, but defensively-driven playoff teams.

The four playoff teams that Flacco faced this year – Pittsburgh, Cincinnati, San Francisco and Houston – all finished the regular season with defenses ranked in the top seven. Pittsburgh was No. 1, Houston No. 2, San Francisco No. 4 and Cincinnati No. 7.

Flacco went 14-for-27 for 176 yards, two touchdowns and no interceptions against the Houston Texans in the divisional round.

“That’s a winning performance, and Joe – I told him [Sunday night] – I thought he played very, very well,” Head Coach John Harbaugh said.

There's a chart included in the article with the numbers. Link to the article: Comparing Flacco To Remaining Playoff QBs « Baltimore Ravens Blogs

For whatever it's worth (which probably isn't much for those who have already made up their mind).

 

[BradyManny]

You can't compare Brady's first few years to Flacco's first few years - statiscally. The league has changed so much since then. Flacco's #s would've been fine 10 years ago, sure. But the elite QBs are putting up much higher #s now.

Just look at the 2003 season, Manning & McNair were co-MVPs that year. I'm not even sure either makes the Pro Bowl with those numbers this season.

 

[Double TE]

You can't compare Brady's first few years to Flacco's first few years - statiscally. The league has changed so much since then. Flacco's #s would've been fine 10 years ago, sure. But the elite QBs are putting up much higher #s now.

Just look at the 2003 season, Manning & McNair were co-MVPs that year. I'm not even sure either makes the Pro Bowl with those numbers this season.

We are also blessed with awesome QBs in the prime. Brady, Brees and Rodgers with Eli Manning right behind them and Stafford coming on fast. Other than them and a healthy Payaton Manning, who really is putting up devastating numbers like that. We are just in the greatest era of QBs, plain and simple. BUT there is major drop off after the elite ones. Lets not fool ourselves.

 

[Deus Irae]

I know someone mentioned it's not all about the numbers but I still would like to point out that Flacco's and Brady's numbers are VERY similar through each of their first 4 years in the NFL. Flacco makes his share of mistakes just like any other quarterback but he's not too bad. He's certainly not at a level of Brady, Brees, Rodgers, or Manning but he's not terrible.

here's a chart included in the article with the numbers. Link to the article: Comparing Flacco To Remaining Playoff QBs « Baltimore Ravens Blogs

For whatever it's worth (which probably isn't much for those who have already made up their mind).

In year 4 as a starter, Brady was on his way to his 3rd Lombardi. That's really the end of the story. Sometimes making comparisons is just the wrong way to go.

And Flacco's in the 10-20 range as a QB right now. This year, he was certainly closer to the bottom than the top.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I know someone mentioned it's not all about the numbers but I still would like to point out that Flacco's and Brady's numbers are VERY similar through each of their first 4 years in the NFL. Flacco makes his share of mistakes just like any other quarterback but he's not too bad. He's certainly not at a level of Brady, Brees, Rodgers, or Manning but he's not terrible.





There's a chart included in the article with the numbers. Link to the article: Comparing Flacco To Remaining Playoff QBs « Baltimore Ravens Blogs

For whatever it's worth (which probably isn't much for those who have already made up their mind).

I agree that Flacco's stats are close to Brady's first four years but the similarity stops there. At various points, the Pats relied on Brady's arm to win games- big games.

BAL hasn't done either consistently or with much success.

 

[robbomango]

Brady didn't have receivers of Baltimore's caliber by a long shot never mind TE's like Todd Heap(when he was with the team) or ****son.

 

[PatsSox363804]

You can't compare Brady's first few years to Flacco's first few years - statiscally. The league has changed so much since then. Flacco's #s would've been fine 10 years ago, sure. But the elite QBs are putting up much higher #s now.

Just look at the 2003 season, Manning & McNair were co-MVPs that year. I'm not even sure either makes the Pro Bowl with those numbers this season.

This x1000

 

[Ravensfan]

You can't compare Brady's first few years to Flacco's first few years - statiscally. The league has changed so much since then. Flacco's #s would've been fine 10 years ago, sure. But the elite QBs are putting up much higher #s now.

Just look at the 2003 season, Manning & McNair were co-MVPs that year. I'm not even sure either makes the Pro Bowl with those numbers this season.

It seems all the elite quarterbacks that are putting up the crazy numbers are all QBs that have been in the league for several years now. Those QBs also throw the ball a lot more to be able to put up the bigger numbers. They don't have much of a running game. Of course you could argue that there's not much of a running game only because those teams choose not to run much but if they did, the RB numbers would be higher and the QB numbers lower. I guess it depends on how the team chooses to play the game; focus on the running game or focus on the passing game.

How about comparisons to Matt Ryan? It seems a lot of football fans (not pointing fingers here on this board) say he's an elite QB and better than Joe Flacco. They're stats, however, are very close through the first 4 years as well. I won't mention the more wins Flacco has since you can argue the wins are in large part because of the defense.

 

[Deus Irae]

It seems all the elite quarterbacks that are putting up the crazy numbers are all QBs that have been in the league for several years now. Those QBs also throw the ball a lot more to be able to put up the bigger numbers. They don't have much of a running game. Of course you could argue that there's not much of a running game only because those teams choose not to run much but if they did, the RB numbers would be higher and the QB numbers lower. I guess it depends on how the team chooses to play the game; focus on the running game or focus on the passing game.

How about comparisons to Matt Ryan? It seems a lot of football fans (not pointing fingers here on this board) say he's an elite QB and better than Joe Flacco. They're stats, however, are very close through the first 4 years as well. I won't mention the more wins Flacco has since you can argue the wins are in large part because of the defense.

Ravens records prior to Flacco:
5-11
13-3
6-10
9-7
10-6
7-9
10-6
12-4

The Ravens were inconsistent, but had 5 winning seasons and a Super Bowl in the 8 years prior to Flacco's arrival.

Falcons records prior to Ryan:

4-12
7-9
8-8
11-5
5-11
9-6-1
7-9
4-12

The Falcons had never had consecutive winning seasons, and had 2 winning seasons in the 8 years, before the arrival of Ryan. They've had a winning season every year he's been the starter.

Ryan > Flacco

 

[Double TE]

It seems all the elite quarterbacks that are putting up the crazy numbers are all QBs that have been in the league for several years now. Those QBs also throw the ball a lot more to be able to put up the bigger numbers. They don't have much of a running game. Of course you could argue that there's not much of a running game only because those teams choose not to run much but if they did, the RB numbers would be higher and the QB numbers lower. I guess it depends on how the team chooses to play the game; focus on the running game or focus on the passing game.

How about comparisons to Matt Ryan? It seems a lot of football fans (not pointing fingers here on this board) say he's an elite QB and better than Joe Flacco. They're stats, however, are very close through the first 4 years as well. I won't mention the more wins Flacco has since you can argue the wins are in large part because of the defense.

Well Brady developed and got better. Jury is still out on Ryan, Flacco, etc.

20 years from now people will look back at Brees, Mannings, Stafford, Rodgers and Brady and say that it was once in a lifetime class.

 

[Ravensfan]

Brady didn't have receivers of Baltimore's caliber by a long shot never mind TE's like Todd Heap(when he was with the team) or ****son.

Brady didn't have a running back like Ray Rice either did he? I don't remember who the RB was in those years. The great teams either have an elite QB or an elite RB. With the teams with elite QBs, are the RBs not great or are they just not utilited as much to be able to put up the numbers because those teams are throwing the ball more?

McGahee was our backup the last couple years and didn't put up big numbers because of that. He was in Denver this year and had a probowl season.

Maybe this argument makes no sense I don't know.

 

[RobertWeathers]

It seems all the elite quarterbacks that are putting up the crazy numbers are all QBs that have been in the league for several years now. Those QBs also throw the ball a lot more to be able to put up the bigger numbers. They don't have much of a running game. Of course you could argue that there's not much of a running game only because those teams choose not to run much but if they did, the RB numbers would be higher and the QB numbers lower. I guess it depends on how the team chooses to play the game; focus on the running game or focus on the passing game.

How about comparisons to Matt Ryan? It seems a lot of football fans (not pointing fingers here on this board) say he's an elite QB and better than Joe Flacco. They're stats, however, are very close through the first 4 years as well. I won't mention the more wins Flacco has since you can argue the wins are in large part because of the defense.

As a lifetime BC fan and follower of Matty Heisman's career, he is another QB who is more of a game manager than a QB who will take his team to the next level. His issue is that he has not played well in big games when a big game is required of him.

I bundle Flacco in the same category. When more is asked of him, he does less.

 

[NEP4Life]

Belichick mentioned some long Ray Rice runs in his presser today. Found one on Youtube:

Ray Rice 56-yard run against the Bengals - YouTube

A great run, but notice the play side DT completely bites on the end around and takes himself out of the play, allowing the playside OG free release on the LB, and Rice is off to the races. A well-coached, 2-gapping team won't make that mistake. *cough* *cough*

 

[RobertWeathers]

Brady didn't have a running back like Ray Rice either did he? I don't remember who the RB was in those years. The great teams either have an elite QB or an elite RB. With the teams with elite QBs, are the RBs not great or are they just not utilited as much to be able to put up the numbers because those teams are throwing the ball more?

McGahee was our backup the last couple years and didn't put up big numbers because of that. He was in Denver this year and had a probowl season.

Maybe this argument makes no sense I don't know.

It doesn't. In 01 and kinda in 02 the Pats had a servicible running game. In 03 is was dormant for most of the year and the offense was mostly short passes.

04 was Corey Dillon- monster year

05 was weak

06 was decent

07-11 the running game was effective, but complimentary and not the kind of ground game that can be leaned on when the passing game is not going.

 

[robbomango]

No need to play up Joe Flacco, can't have everything. You guys have a top ranked D with 1 of the best RB's in the league, not including receiving skills that coupled with a serviceable QB should be enough for an SB.

I think Flacco is capable of winning 1 SB but making multiple trips involves a fierce competitive nature and drive that I just don't think he has. He made some weird comments last week to the media in regards to Brady and Rogders, focus on playing error free football and being a solid leader, don't worry about the attention other QB's are getting.

Just my perspective...peace