Brandon Lloyd meeting with 49ers: Patriots are gonna blow it

[PatsSox363804]

It'll be pretty shocking if they don't so much as even bring him in for a visit. It would have to mean they have some sort of internal evaluation of him that differs dramatically from what everyone else outside of the org thinks, because he seems to fit on just about every level. And I simply refuse to believe that they FO is content with the WR status quo.

McDaniels knows everything about the guy. I'm sure they'll let him set the market and see if they think the cost is worth it. The fact that he's still on the board when receivers were going quickly yesterday tells you he either isnt in high demand around the league or everyone knows he's just trying to get a contract that he can bring back to New England and say "match this."

 

[madmike77]

The Pats can't draft WRs at all, just grab Mike Wallace and call it a day.

The issue is before these deals I think everyone believed Wallace could be had for 8-9 max on a long-term deal.

With the contracts going out now there's no way he will sign a long-term deal that averages less than 11 or even 12 a year. If no one ponies up, he'll likely just accept his 2.7 mill tender this year and then hit the market next year as a full UFA. So between Welker and Wallace the Pats would be paying out more than $20 million a year. It's doable, but seems kind of crazy.

 

[JMarr]

As somebody who has fully supported Chad Johnson all last year, WTF makes you think he will step up this year?

The WR group is probably among the most pathetic in the league.

I think some of the lack of production was due Brady locking in on receivers he trusts, as he is prone to do. Ocho still has the physical skills to play at a high level and I'm just hoping that after an entire year in the system he's ready to become a much bigger part of the offense. No reason to believe he won't be better this year.

Edit: And I realize that he didn't get a lot of reps, but it doesn't change my point.

 

[Dutchmaster617]

How much does Welker want? He shouldn't hold the team back as he clearly isn't enough, 3 top seeds with him and 0 titles. We need a Wallace badly or Welker will retire ringless.

 

[Nunchucks]

We lost that game because Gronkowski was hurt and Brady and Welker couldnt connect on a pass, not to mention the dumb safety. none of that has to do with flooding the middle of the field. I do agree that we need to improve the team but we have those in this fan base that act like the world is ending because we're only 3-2 in superbowls the last 11 years. Yeah we lost the last 2, that isn't a measure of failure. I mean look at the teams that have not even been to 2 Superbowls:

Baltimore
New Orleans
Jets
Tampa
Arizona
Atlanta
Carolina
San Diego
Seattle
Tennessee
Houston
Jacksonville
Detroit
Cleveland

literally almost half the league. The Patriots way of doing business has been far more successful than most of the league.

Those teams don't have a first ballot HoF QB.

 

[makoute]

Obviously, it all has to shake out, BUT..

Even if the Patriots stay status quo with last years team, there is no way they even sniff the Superbowl this year. Last years schedule and path was a gift from god.

The reason the Patriots lost in 2010, the reason they barely beat Baltimore and lost to NYG..they have ZERO threat outside of the hash marks. Zero. All a good defense has to do is congest the middle of the field and the game is over. how do you people not see that?

The Patriots NEED some sort of reliable option on the outside. Not Jerry Rice, not 07 version of Randy Moss. but soemone who can get open and catch a ball when it matters. If they have this, Welker/Gronk/hernandez automatically have more room.

I'm convinced WR is the biggest need. It would just take so much pressure off of Brady/welker/gronk/hernandez.

Offensive line is next, secondary 3rd, IMHO.

I think people know this, and probably why a lot of people have felt that WR is a big need on this team.

 

[PatsSox363804]

How much does Welker want? He shouldn't hold the team back as he clearly isn't enough, 3 top seeds with him and 0 titles. We need a Wallace badly or Welker will retire ringless.

Look at the numbers given out yesterday. Welker is going to absolutely want over 9 a year, possibly 10, and most of it guaranteed because there's a good chance he'll get franchised again next year and get 2 years of solid guaranteed money.

 

[Dutchmaster617]

Those teams don't have a first ballot HoF QB.

We shouldn't be looking down either, we should look up. Not compare ourselves to the lowly Jaguars but to the team that whooped us in back to back SBs, they seem to be doing fine.

 

[Steve102]

I think some of the lack of production was due Brady locking in on receivers he trusts...

This is really the issue. As TB gets older, his patience for Foxboro newbies is nil. Learn the system or get out of the way. I think the fact that Ocho stuck around all year is a testament to his work ethic. He's trying, as opposed to a Galloway who did not try to adjust.

 

[PatsSox363804]

Those teams don't have a first ballot HoF QB.

Yes that is true, but we also had the best deep threat in the league in 07 and didn't win.

I don't know, I think getting a good outside guy is important but not as important as getting a playmaker on defense. Look at the 04 and 01 teams. The offense didn't play great in either Superbowl but they took the ball away on defense and ultimately won. That's been severely lacking in the 2 losses. If Lloyd wants to get paid what Garcon got paid he simply isnt worth it because you're tying up a ton of room on 2 receivers.

 

[Mainefan]

I know we all feel the Patriots should somehow acquire a real down-field threat, but has anyone noticed how our offense ranked last year? Seems like we did fairly well without Lloyd or anyone similar.

 

[Triumph]

No worries

Ocho is due for a breakout game. We don't need anyone else.

LMAO

I cannot stomach another season of that fool.

 

[Wilfork#75]

The issue is before these deals I think everyone believed Wallace could be had for 8-9 max on a long-term deal.

With the contracts going out now there's no way he will sign a long-term deal that averages less than 11 or even 12 a year. If no one ponies up, he'll likely just accept his 2.7 mill tender this year and then hit the market next year as a full UFA. So between Welker and Wallace the Pats would be paying out more than $20 million a year. It's doable, but seems kind of crazy.

Wallace is going to ask for a huge contract, and to be honest I don't think he deserves anywhere near what he will get. He's not a #1 WR, he is going to be overpaid and we don't know how he would mesh with Brady and fit the system. This team is really close to another Super Bowl, but 1 big mistake could also take us back. I don't think Wallace is worth the risk. I like Lloyd but only if he comes cheap. If he wants more than $6mil a year he can get it from San Fran, and I wouldn't really like to go that high. There is a reason Lloyd has been with 5 teams in his career and was traded for only a conditional late round pick last season. He is only good value for this team if he comes cheap, and right now that doesn't seem to be the case.

 

[PatsSox363804]

We shouldn't be looking down either, we should look up. Not compare ourselves to the lowly Jaguars but to the team that whooped us in back to back SBs, they seem to be doing fine.

Ok lets look at the Giants. Why did they win the Superbowl this year? They had a positive turnover ratio in the playoffs. Period. In their first 14 games they turned it over a ton and were 7-7. They started taking care of the ball and went on a run. And some of that was luck, which isnt a bad thing you need luck, but they fumbled 3 times in the Superbowl and didn't lose one of them whereas we committed a stupid safety and Brady under threw Gronk, so we lost by 4. The guy that made the biggest catch in that game likely won't even be back with the team, that's how much they value him.

 

[WhiZa]

The Pats probably like a couple WRs early in the draft and because of that are OK with letting some FA WRs go for big money. I still expect them to sign one, but it probably won't be until the market dies down.

 

[Dutchmaster617]

I know we all feel the Patriots should somehow acquire a real down-field threat, but has anyone noticed how our offense ranked last year? Seems like we did fairly well without Lloyd or anyone similar.

Steelers - 17 points
Giants - 17 and 20 points

Those are the only teams that had a chance of competing and we were 14 points under our average against them, also 0-3. Going 14-1 against the teams with no hope is fun but it is misleading.

Edit: 23 against BAL about 9 under the average with a few turnovers and the only worthwhile win.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Wallace is going to ask for a huge contract, and to be honest I don't think he deserves anywhere near what he will get. He's not a #1 WR, he is going to be overpaid and we don't know how he would mesh with Brady and fit the system. This team is really close to another Super Bowl, but 1 big mistake could also take us back. I don't think Wallace is worth the risk. I like Lloyd but only if he comes cheap. If he wants more than $6mil a year he can get it from San Fran, and I wouldn't really like to go that high. There is a reason Lloyd has been with 5 teams in his career and was traded for only a conditional late round pick last season. He is only good value for this team if he comes cheap, and right now that doesn't seem to be the case.

I agree with this. If Gronk is 100% and WW makes the catch I think they win the game but that's besides the point.. Us fans are going nuts over it but I think BB and the rest of the FO are taking a prudent approach to addressing the team's needs- like they always do.

No question that this team needs a quality WR on the outside but not at the expense of improving the defense so it can make stops in the 4th quarter. Pass rush, more cover guys, more run stoppers, you name it they need more of it.

 

[madmike77]

Wallace is going to ask for a huge contract, and to be honest I don't think he deserves anywhere near what he will get. He's not a #1 WR, he is going to be overpaid and we don't know how he would mesh with Brady and fit the system. This team is really close to another Super Bowl, but 1 big mistake could also take us back. I don't think Wallace is worth the risk. I like Lloyd but only if he comes cheap. If he wants more than $6mil a year he can get it from San Fran, and I wouldn't really like to go that high. There is a reason Lloyd has been with 5 teams in his career and was traded for only a conditional late round pick last season. He is only good value for this team if he comes cheap, and right now that doesn't seem to be the case.

At this point I suspect the Steelers would be happy getting the first and saving the money.

I have a feeling Wallace will be a Steeler this year, get his 2.7 million and get his big money next year as a UFA. With the salaries going out now teams are going to be very hesitant to give up a cap-friendly 1st rounder AND pay out a long-term $11-12 million-per-year contract.

 

[Steve102]

Guys, I understand the hand-wringing, really I do. But let's look at the dreaded "value" issue the team does. Who ever they bring in is 3rd or 4th on this list behind Gronkowski, Hernandez, and Welker in the pecking order. I understand the difference of position, outside the numbers, and the whole stretching the field issue. IMO, they are going to look at paying no more than #3 receiver money for a guy that's going to be a 3rd or 4th option. Do they need an outside the #'s guy? Yep. Are they going to pay #1 WR money when they are at the table with the guy with most catches in the league? Nope.

 

[jays52]

Steelers - 17 points
Giants - 17 and 20 points

Those are the only teams that had a chance of competing and we were 14 points under our average against them, also 0-3. Going 14-1 against the teams with no hope is fun but it is misleading.

Edit: 23 against BAL about 9 under the average with a few turnovers and the only worthwhile win.

Good defenses are always going to hold offenses to low scoring games. I don't think that this should be a discussion on net points accumulated through player acquisition. The key is to be able to execute a drive that is a counter punch to what the defense is doing to you. Balance. In the case of the Patriots, it's not a vertical threat, it's a horizontal threat who can compete in 7-15 yards and occasionally get one on busted coverage.