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DRAFT BGC 2021 Pats Big Board - Draft Thread

2021 Patriots Season:
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Sun
Sep 12th

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patsfanfromoversea

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2020 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
Bobby Brown
Very fun. Athleticism jumps off the screen the screen imo. "At times" player rn still developing but I see a lot of upside. He's still learning how to best utilize he's skills. How to best attack and create weaknesses. Block recognition. But again at times he's explosive and more than a handful.

There will be plays where he just commits and plays low, keeps his pads low and just forklifts his man back 5 yards. Hands are improving. Again still learning how to best set up defenders. He can move though. 325? But he can move, laterally, bend, knife through his man or a double.

One thing I love seeing is him peeking, keeping "low eyes" in the backfield. He'll show colors to a side, sneak a peek below his man's pads and either toss him or hold his ground. Raw but shows smarts in how he handles himself.

+ hands & leverage. He can use and work with space if given some. Can shoot, knife, work around his man after softening the edge with chops and swats. Uses long arm, stab, push/pull, rip. Needs to combine, counter quicker but potential is there.

Doesn't always play under his feet or from the feet up and will lose balance.

Needs to be a little quicker and more physical at poa.





He is a guy i would like a trade up to the 70 range....this combination of size and athletic is really rare. Big enough for north/south run defender and probably quick enough to defend outside zone stuff etc...btw thanks for the rankings !
 

Hyped

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Just a curious question for the draftniks in this forum:

Of the 2nd/3rd tier QB's: Monds, Mills, Trask, Newman, and maybe even Franks/Book/Ehlinger

Does anyone like any of them BETTER than one of the 1st tier guys? (Lawrence, Wilson, Fields, Lance, and/or Jones)
 

Tony2046

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2019 Weekly Picks Winner
Justin Fields
He's very coachable and wants to be coached. You see it in his behavior and actions on & off the sidelines. Engaged, focused. He's been working with former/current NFL players & coaches for years. He wants to be pushed and knows this isn't his final form. He knows there's a lot of work to do to get there. Whether it's reading concepts, throwing on the move or working on other issues hes a worker that doesn't run from mistakes. Everything on & off the record from OSU coaches have been positive.


Plenty of arm talent. Routinely shows off the ability to make NFL throws. Plenty of strength and velocity. Tight windows, far hash ropes, easy gas to touch 60 yards. In terms of the tough NFL passes, he makes them routinely. Nice touch, placement & accuracy. Can drop it over a shoulder, fit it on the sidelines, throw a change up - feather it over a defender and before the lines. Can also thread the needle, fire it through traffic. Arm talent is ++.


Almost a 3/4 throwing motion. Tight front shoulder, smooth delivery that could be a lil quicker but it's fluid & efficient. Ball jumps out. Slight hitch at times up top. Overall clean & effective. Could it improve, sure but show me who's couldn't at this stage to some degree. Base is solid - set, plays with enough bounce to evade. Nice balance in his lower half, allows him to really push, drive the ball. Can slide & disappear from would-be rushers, smooth lateral footwork but you don't see enough of it. It's there though. Need to see more. Would like to see him help himself more here. Creating, reworking a platform. Overall pretty clean but I believe his lower half could be more involved. Back foot comes up too often imo. Nice footwork but could faster, a little more efficient. Overall again pretty good but could improve some.


Fields plays with a toughness that should be unquestioned. It gets him into trouble at times imo. He might think he's a little bigger and faster than he is but he has "all in" mentality and toughness. There's no "fake it" here. He'll stand in the pocket or run for a first down, take a hit no problem. Frustrating at times but you don't win by playing scared in the NFL. Funnel and channel it. Designed runs, know when to toss it away, ease up on the contact. I could see him playing in the northeast. Has the size, arm and mentality imo. I think there's a "chip on the shoulder" angle here. Been tied with Lawrence forever. All this pre-draft nonsense, I'm sure Bill would have him on a mission.


Improved throwing on the move big time since HS. Maybe Lawrence's biggest asset is throwing to his non-dominant side. Fields has a lot of potential on the move as well. Bootlegs, scrambling, misdirection he's a big time threat with his athleticism and arm. 4.4 speed. Natural and comfortable here. Also saw improvement on finding his hot read and being quicker there. Good sign, I saw him fire the ball out many times here when he recognized pressure or had to go hot.


Pocket presence could definitely improve. Too often late to react, improvise at times. It's there and you see it but the feel and reaction need to be faster. I get the sense that at times he sees it coming but just thinks his athleticism and strength will be enough to make something happen. A lot of times that works. Those instances are coachable and can be worked out. These are mostly in front of him, he'll pretend like he doesn't see them and move at the last moment. Those can improve. It's the edge where his feel is really hit or miss. That is definitely a point of emphasis imo. Great command, vocal and active. They would run difference cadences, have snap issues and he deals with it. Recognizes and adjust pre & post snap. Its obvious he puts in the work. From his ability to work concepts & go through progressions. To his ability to look of certain defenders, know the weak spots in coverage and players to target. Able to do it all in that regard, could be faster. Overall very good but needs to improve his anticipation, need a little hurry up and work.


Needs to pass with anticipation more consistently but has flashed throwing lead shoulder and other examples many times.


Ran a complex system at a young age and excelled in many areas. OSU went away from mesh, we'll "out athlete" you every other play and went to a more vertical based offense. More option routes. More QB-WR on the same page stuff. Fields ran the most complex system out of the big names. Displayed he's the most accurate pocket passer in the class (almost every analytic person out there says Fields is the most accurate passer in the class) who just happens to run a 4.4. Prototype size - Cut up 6'3 225. Proportioned, loose muscles.


Fields has displayed great decision-making, accuracy and command in the pocket with a rifle for an arm. Precise, can hit from any distance on the field without reckless abandon. His pocket presence has to improve but it's not a killer, just a real area for growth.


Fields also has silly athleticism. Athleticism that wasn't always utilized probably imo. At times it looked like he wanted to prove a point hanging in the pocket. Where not talking huge leaps and bounds. Slight advancements with his presence and feel would go a long way.


Prospects like Fields don't come along every year. Pocket passers with a ratio of 60+ passing TD's to less than 10 INT the last two years. Athleticism to make defenses think, hesitate and suffer. He has that killer mentality and again I think Bill could really do work with him. Both have a lot to prove short term and could be a great pair.






Great stuff BCG.

Question about the Fields post. Every video clip of his throws seem to be longer than 3 seconds Time to Throw. Does that concern you?

Other than that those clips also show him going through his read progressions fairly quick.

Thanks again.
 

BaconGrundleCandy

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Great stuff BCG.

Question about the Fields post. Every video clip of his throws seem to be longer than 3 seconds Time to Throw. Does that concern you?

Other than that those clips also show him going through his read progressions fairly quick.

Thanks again.
Not really. A lot of that was scheme, what he was asked vs what he can do. Push the ball down the field, option routes. I think he's more than capable of getting the ball quick, doing that type of thing.

My biggest concerns or issues or we are him cleaning up his mechanics a little bit. Specifically lower half. And how he deals with pressure at times. I don't see a lot of big things that are "must clean-ups" or fixes.
 

BaconGrundleCandy

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Are you sure this is a 1st round profile? Lots of questions and projections for a first rounder, no? Esp. w such a solid OT class.

I liked watching him at Senior Bowl (esp. practices) but remain more sceptical than you about his NFL prospects. Strength at LOS was an issue against low competition and he continued to struggle at Senior Bowl esp. in the game (re-directions/recovery as well). Im not sure how that would make him a good guard prospect for the Pats either (although he looked ok at G in PP 1v1 @SrB).

I do agree he has intriguing versatility. He could be a perfect swing OL that you could use as jumbo TE. I also like Cosell's idea of trying him at center (movement, IQ, awareness..).

There are many better, stronger, safer OT prospects though with safer backup plan as good-vg strong NFL guards. And if you're looking for potential/upside and are willing to gamble 1st rounder i think Spencer Brown fits the bill much better..


THANKS for the thread btw
Radunz is a lot of projection, I'll admit that. He definitely needs work in pass pro but I think he has as much potential as almost anyone in the draft. He dominated the SR Bowl. Wasn't always that way on film but I saw enough. Biggest issues are experience and strength imo and those are more than fixable.

Agree about Brown, I love him. He'll go top 50. Grades come out how they come out, no consensus here.
 

BaconGrundleCandy

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I love this, excellent work! Looked over the spreadsheet. Noticed you listed JOK as a safety. He was converted from that to linebacker but he does fit that mold of guys who can play both. Also noticed an aggressive grade on Radunz. One of the biggest knocks on him is he’s undersized for a tackle, wouldn’t that bring him down some? At least among the likes of Darrisaw, Jenkins, etc. I can also see that Newsome over Farley ranking, it’s close and I imagine Farley’s health risk with the multiple back surgeries factors in. Once more, great stuff and I look forward to your updates!
I don't take too much time on placing a guy at S or LB. He could be either, both depending on the team. I'll let the coaches handle that. I think he'll play more of a S role though, we'll see.

Radunz id like 6'6/300, he needs to gain 10-15 pounds of muscle, has to get stronger overall but that's not a problem next level. Him Darrisaw and Jenkins are all pretty much grouped together. For example Radunz is as good or better in pass pro and just as versatile run blocker. He might not dominate the way they do but could be a better overall player in time. I wish Brown graded a little higher but I don't rank guys. Just let the grades fall out and go with it.

Regarding Newsome I think he could a great player. Reminds me of Gilmore in the sense that he's really good doing a lot of things. Really scheme diverse. Drop him in anywhere and hes a good player. I could see GB or Pitt going after him just from a fit pov but hell appeal to a lot of teams.
 

BaconGrundleCandy

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And Barmore.
I'm also curious about these two. Parsons is considered an all-world talent. #15 might be high for Barmore, but if we trade down to the end of Round 1 or he falls into Round 2, he wouldn't be a possibility?
Interested in hearing about Parsons too.. not a scheme fit?

Not shocked at Barrimore. Fools gold. Can get similar production from a later pick / udfa.
Too many things with Parson for me to think Bill will go that way at 15. He won't be around any later so that kind of wraps that up imo. Super talented but I'm not sure Bill would want to deal with any potential issues. It's not one thing or one little stupid mistake. I've heard multiple reports about him getting into it with different coaches. Just a gut call who knows I might flip flop but i don't see it rn. He's definitely our type on the field. Not sure about the locker room.

I go back and forth on Barmore too. From a pass rushing pov he's what we need but hardly a complete player rn. And I just don't see the value at 15 or round one. I'd take him round two but would go Nixon first. He didn't have any help, no rotation at Iowa. I think he's more complete, more our type early on.
 

DropKickFlutie

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
Skip:
Trey Lance: Never played against a single FCS opponent. His offense RAN the ball 70% of the time, look it up. Against the other 5 QBs has the worst accuracy on every throw type beyond very short passes.

Jaylen Waddle: Was never the best WR on his own college team for 3 years straight. Injury prone. Also the team doesn't need a WR, we already don't have enough snaps for Agholar, Meyers, Bourne, Henry, Smith, that's 5 plus add QB, OLine , and Harris that's 12 guys for 11 starters. It's a total waste to go for a rookie WR who won't even play half the offensive snaps.

Mond and Trask: Cross them off entirely if Josh Tim-Tebow McDaniels is the only one who saw them from the Pats.
 

BUSTAMOVE

Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job
Mr BaconGrundleCandy. I usually about this time buy a few Draft guides so I can scan them before and during the draft. Problem with the guides is they don’t specifically target players who would make good Patriots.
This post is such a gift to myself. I know my football but not even close to this degree. Makes pre and Draft night fun having something like this to follow.
Thanks. Your all that and a big bag of Bacon
 

oldrover

"You're gonna have to serve somebody..."
Mr BaconGrundleCandy. I usually about this time buy a few Draft guides so I can scan them before and during the draft. Problem with the guides is they don’t specifically target players who would make good Patriots.
This post is such a gift to myself. I know my football but not even close to this degree. Makes pre and Draft night fun having something like this to follow.
Thanks. Your all that and a big bag of Bacon
What he said. :)

1618780912830.gif
 

50-yard-line

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
Too many things with Parson for me to think Bill will go that way at 15. He won't be around any later so that kind of wraps that up imo. Super talented but I'm not sure Bill would want to deal with any potential issues. It's not one thing or one little stupid mistake. I've heard multiple reports about him getting into it with different coaches. Just a gut call who knows I might flip flop but i don't see it rn. He's definitely our type on the field. Not sure about the locker room.

I go back and forth on Barmore too. From a pass rushing pov he's what we need but hardly a complete player rn. And I just don't see the value at 15 or round one. I'd take him round two but would go Nixon first. He didn't have any help, no rotation at Iowa. I think he's more complete, more our type early on.
Appreciate the reply and your work here.

I think BB is picking Barmore, maybe after a small trade down. Just a gut feeling.
 

BaconGrundleCandy

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Appreciate the reply and your work here.

I think BB is picking Barmore, maybe after a small trade down. Just a gut feeling.
I wouldn't be surprised at all tbh. Barmore is kind of a missing piece?? Like we have a lot of run stoppers but need some pass rush up the middle. That's his speciality rn. Pretty good, natural feel for where, how to attack. Good at getting in those creases and knifing through the line. + hands. Too often it's just his "feel" so to speak but he doesn't have the best plan every snap. He wins with a lot of talent little plan or variety. Not a bad thing at all. Footwork is hit or miss at times. Not many snaps against the run. Lots of potential. I see a cross between Tim Settle & Dalvin Thompson. I like him a lot, have a 2nd on him. Just think he's not good value at 15 and he'll go before we get a good chance at him.

He's really close to being on there. Should I add him? Anyone else think he's going to be available for a trade back and Bill would pull the trigger?
 

Ivan

Hall of Fame Poster
Skip:
Trey Lance: Never played against a single FCS opponent. His offense RAN the ball 70% of the time, look it up. Against the other 5 QBs has the worst accuracy on every throw type beyond very short passes.

Jaylen Waddle: Was never the best WR on his own college team for 3 years straight. Injury prone. Also the team doesn't need a WR, we already don't have enough snaps for Agholar, Meyers, Bourne, Henry, Smith, that's 5 plus add QB, OLine , and Harris that's 12 guys for 11 starters. It's a total waste to go for a rookie WR who won't even play half the offensive snaps.

Mond and Trask: Cross them off entirely if Josh Tim-Tebow McDaniels is the only one who saw them from the Pats.
Unf*ckingbelievable.
 

long distance

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
I wouldn't be surprised at all tbh. Barmore is kind of a missing piece?? Like we have a lot of run stoppers but need some pass rush up the middle. That's his speciality rn. Pretty good, natural feel for where, how to attack. Good at getting in those creases and knifing through the line. + hands. Too often it's just his "feel" so to speak but he doesn't have the best plan every snap. He wins with a lot of talent little plan or variety. Not a bad thing at all. Footwork is hit or miss at times. Not many snaps against the run. Lots of potential. I see a cross between Tim Settle & Dalvin Thompson. I like him a lot, have a 2nd on him. Just think he's not good value at 15 and he'll go before we get a good chance at him.

He's really close to being on there. Should I add him? Anyone else think he's going to be available for a trade back and Bill would pull the trigger?

Your call :)

I wouldn't be surprised either unfortunately and it is the 1st round scenario i “fear“ the most.
Its hardly a missing piece or need and its not position of value to draft in the 1st unless its a special player like VW, VV . and you have him on the field 70-80% of the time (which happened only with VW). Normally Pats DTs have 50% snaps or less..

Malcom Brown (not comparing him to Barmore) was a solid starter for 4 years - yet it was arguably the least valuable use of 1st round pick over the last decade and more incl Harry. Guys like that are available every FA for a few M$.
Derek Wolfe was signed for 3y/12M.

So depends how highly you project him (bc there's still a lot of work with him) & how much playing time you'd give him..
but at #15 it would be a shame since its the rare time and probably the last last time under BB drafting so high so id hope for a value position.
 

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