Belichick's record without Brady since the Brady era began

[Rob0729]

No, I just used what he did on the pats, which is what your post that you started was, well except you threw up 18 games for some reason.

So even if you count everything from 2000 on, he 33-33 without Brady. Considering for most of the games, he was playing second or third string QBs or a rookie, that is pretty good.

 

[Pats1971]

Sorry, the last week was so good without them here in full force. But I thought it was an interesting stat. I forgot it would bring the anti-Belichick bunch in here to say that Belichick went 5-11 in 1995 which shows you that he isn't that good.

You thought it was interesting to throw out 18 games and make them not exist? Nobody is anti Bill anything. Just use actual facts not ones you have to change reality around.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

You thought it was interesting to throw out 18 games and make them not exist? Nobody is anti Bill anything. Just use actual facts not ones you have to change reality around.

Fact - Brady hasn't won a super bowl without either Bill as his HC OR a team stacked with all-stars.

 

[Pats1971]

So even if you count everything from 2000 on, he 33-33. Considering for most of the games, he was playing second or third string QBs or a rookie, that is pretty good.

Umm...Bledsoe was not a 3rd string QB, neither was Cam, neither was Cassel, neither was JG. When was the 3rd string QB here? Look dude, if you want to throw out entire seasons go ahead. I know everyone wants to make it so Brady didnt mean **** and Bill could have won 20 titles with a kid out of highschool. Who cares, its a stupid fan discussion points that media stirred up beause its too hard for people to just frekaing say, hey Bill was a great coach and brady is a great QB, nope, cant do that, someone has to win out. So all of the sudden the pats win some games in a row and the argument has to come up again. Its almost like clockwork.

 

[Rob0729]

You thought it was interesting to throw out 18 games and make them not exist? Nobody is anti Bill anything. Just use actual facts not ones you have to change reality around.

I didn't say they didn't exist. I am pointing out stuff after Belichick has completely installed his system and during the current era of football after they changed all the rule. It doesn't change his historical record. It is a different way of at things. You just don't like it because it makes Belichick look good.

 

[Pats1971]

Fact - Brady hasn't won a super bowl without either Bill as his HC OR a team stacked with all-stars.

Brady has not won a superbowl without Bill or a team that didnt win a playoff game for 18 years before he got there.

 

[Ivan]

Yeah except Brady was QB on a lot of that, maybe you didnt follow the conversation....it was with and without Brady at QB. Read the op's post, then follow along in the post. Trolling is when you post things to get a rise. I am not, I am posting along with the what the subject was and some of you do not like that. Now either follow along with the original post, or go cry about it somewher else. Also, my God put your big boy pants on, this kind of stuff should not shake you up.

You are the one who can’t handle the true numbers, you are the one making qualifications because the real numbers don’t fit your troll agenda. Belichick has achieved more than any coach in NFL history, and that’s the truth. Don’t like it? GFY.

 

[Pats1971]

I didn't say they didn't exist. I am pointing out stuff after Belichick has completely installed his system and during the current era of football after they changed all the rule. It doesn't change his historical record. It is a different way of at things. You just don't like it because it makes Belichick look good.

You threw them out to further the stupid argument you guys like to do with brady vs Bill. I dont know why people want to compare them, but for whatever reason it took awhile and the pats won some games in a row, so out comes the argument again.

 

[Pats1971]

You are the one who can’t handle the true numbers, you are the one making qualifications because the real numbers don’t fit your troll agenda. Belichick has achieved more than any coach in NFL history, and that’s the truth. Don’t like it? GFY.

What are you talkin about. lol, read the original post. I didnt throw out any years, the question was with or without Brady. Read it. If you want to have another discussion then that one, you could always make another thread.

 

[Rob0729]

Umm...Bledsoe was not a 3rd string QB, neither was Cam, neither was Cassel, neither was JG. When was the 3rd string QB here? Look dude, if you want to throw out entire seasons go ahead. I know everyone wants to make it so Brady didnt mean **** and Bill could have won 20 titles with a kid out of highschool. Who cares, its a stupid fan discussion points that media stirred up beause its too hard for people to just frekaing say, hey Bill was a great coach and brady is a great QB, nope, cant do that, someone has to win out. So all of the sudden the pats win some games in a row and the argument has to come up again. Its almost like clockwork.

I am sorry I forgot about the Cam years. Cam was a washed up QB that no one wanted and signed here for a million dollars, signed here in June with no minicamps and no preseason and massive COVID restrictions in practices. Last year was an aberration for everyone. A team trying to rebuild after they lost their QB made the year even more of aberration. But the Pats would have been better off last year with a 2008 Cassel or a 2018 Garoppolo or Brissett.

 

[Pats1971]

I am sorry I forgot about the Cam years. Cam was a washed up QB that no one wanted and signed here for a million dollars, signed here in June with no minicamps and no preseason and massive COVID restrictions in practices. Last year was an aberration for everyone. A team trying to rebuild after they lost their QB made the year even more of aberration. But the Pats would have been better off last year with a 2008 Cassel or a 2018 Garoppolo or Brissett.

Well Bill thought enough of washed up Cam that he brought him in to be the starting QB for the team. Yeah going to a new team in a covid year with no training camp, that had to be tough, no way a QB could do that and win anything.....Once again....why do we need to compare a coach with Brady? Brady is a QB. Bill has never thrown a pass in a game, Brady has never had to do a draft. I dont get the comparison here.

 

[denverpatsfan]

Since Brady was mentally checked out for most of the 2019 season, can we add in those games to this total?

 

[Rob0729]

You threw them out to further the stupid argument you guys like to do with brady vs Bill. I dont know why people want to compare them, but for whatever reason it took awhile and the pats won some games in a row, so out comes the argument again.

I am not saying anything Brady. I am judging Bill on his own without Brady. Brady is irrelevant to this conversation. Obviously Belichick would do much better with Brady than without him. I am just looking a recent history of Belichick on his own. I am on the record that Brady was more important than Belichick to the team during the last decade or so when he was here.

 

[dtbrks]

not this again.. i was just starting to enjoy the board again.

 

[Pats1971]

I am not saying anything Brady. I am judging Bill on his own without Brady. Brady is irrelevant to this conversation. Obviously Belichick would do much better with Brady than without him. I am just looking a recent history of Belichick on his own. I am on the record that Brady was more important than Belichick to the team during the last decade or so when he was here.

No, you judged Bill on his own without Brady except for 5 years that we wont count. lol. Again....Bill is a coach, brady is a player, they literally do nothing of each others job.

 

[Pats1971]

not this again.. i was just starting to enjoy the board again.

It started to die down but then the pats won a few games in a row so now we can go back to Bill made Brady and Brady would be brady Quinn without Bill as coach.

 

[Rob0729]

Well Bill thought enough of washed up Cam that he brought him in to be the starting QB for the team. Yeah going to a new team in a covid year with no training camp, that had to be tough, no way a QB could do that and win anything.....Once again....why do we need to compare a coach with Brady? Brady is a QB. Bill has never thrown a pass in a game, Brady has never had to do a draft. I dont get the comparison here.

Psst! Belichick cut Cam outright before the start of the season. He didn't want to start the season with Cam and ease Jones into it. He didn't give Cam the option to be a back up. He signed Cam as a place holder. He was either going to draft Jones or someone else or trade for Garoppolo. That was always the plan.

And I am not comparing Belichick to Brady. I am looking at Belichick on his own without Brady. You are comparing Belichick to Brady. I think Belichick and Brady worked hand in hand. Most dynasties in the NFL had a HOF coach AND a HOF QB (or two with San Fran).

 

[Rob0729]

No, you judged Bill on his own without Brady except for 5 years that we wont count. lol. Again....Bill is a coach, brady is a player, they literally do nothing of each others job.

Again, I am looking at his record in a different way. Hell, even Felger, who ultimate contrarian, said you could look at Belichick's record without Brady in many ways from his entire career, his entire Patriots, or even his career after Brady became the starter. I am just giving a different look at his career. I am not saying his entire entire career doesn't exist.

 

[Doctor DDS]

Counting a first year coaches record when he takes over a rebuild as some sort of knock on their ability is illogical. It is part of their history but says nothing about their coaching ability when their goal is building long term success. Was Parcells horrible in 1993 when the team started 1-11? Of course not, just stating a W-L record w/o the proper context is just a hot take.

 

[lancerman]

Psst! Belichick cut Cam outright before the start of the season. He didn't want to start the season with Cam and ease Jones into it. He didn't give Cam the option to be a back up. He signed Cam as a place holder. He was either going to draft Jones or someone else or trade for Garoppolo. That was always the plan.

And I am not comparing Belichick to Brady. I am looking at Belichick on his own without Brady. You are comparing Belichick to Brady. I think Belichick and Brady worked hand in hand. Most dynasties in the NFL had a HOF coach AND a HOF QB (or two with San Fran).

Not exactly, because you are specifically using Brady becoming a starter as a benchmark for your comparison and using it to combat people who aren’t limiting themselves to that. Can’t you just be happy the team is doing well instead of getting dragged into a fruitless QB vs HC discussion because you made the mistake of caring about what is said on Felger and Meatball?