Andrew Callahan: "Universal" chatter out of Combines is that Maye's ceiling is top 5 QB

[mgteich]

The Pats will have to build a team around Maye no matter how good Maye becomes, but having an elite QB is a major step towards winning a Super Bowl or even a dynasty. I don't get why you are dismissing the impact if Maye can live up to his ceiling of being a top 5 QB.

If Maye becomes a top 5 QB and Vrabel is a very good coach, I like the Pats' chances of winning another Super Bowl. It is still far from a guarantee, but those are two of the most important pieces in a Super Bowl formula. The Bengals have the former and not the latter.

OK, I'll be much, much, more clear.

Even if Maye is a top 6-10 QB and we have a good coach in Vrabel, we are far, far, far away from being a SB competitor. If you believe that we are better situated than CIN, so be it. Our greatest advantage is the one we have had for many decades: we are in the AFC East.

 

[Rob0729]

OK, I'll be much, much, more clear.

Even if Maye is a top 6-10 QB and we have a good coach in Vrabel, we are far, far, far away from being a SB competitor. If you believe that we are better situated than CIN, so be it. Our greatest advantage is the one we have had for many decades: we are in the AFC East.

I never said the Pats are in a better situation than Cincy. The Pats are in year one of a new rebuild. We will have to see where the Pats are two years from now. They might at point be in a better position than the Burrow-Chase Bengals ever were to be a legitimate Super Bowl winner and the Bengals were in a close loss in a Super Bowl.

But again my point is dismissing the fact that Maye being a top 5 QB someday as pointless because they still won't win a Super Bowl is silly.

 

[lancerman]

Meh.. Benny J wasn't coming here.. he was alway going to a team with a ready made roster.

The Patriots legitimately had the fastest external coaching hire in like half a decade. They were dead set on Vrabel from the jump.

Idk why people want to act like Johnson is some wuss who ran to the better roster. He wasn't even hired by the Bears until over a week later

 

[Toofy]

This draft is make or break. I hope Hunter and Josh conerly are drafted by us . That would be a home run on offense . On defense sign DJ Reed, Josh sweat and Williams . If we can trade bourne + 5th round pick for jakobi that would be sweet . Sign dan Moore as LT insurance while conerly develops . Sign few unheralded young free agents who can have their Zach Baun moment with pats this year so that we can sign them next year based on performance .

Have a huge performance clause in all our contracts and let motivated free agents come here . They know we have the cash and should know if they perform they will get paid .

 

[mgteich]

Have a huge performance clause in all our contracts and let motivated free agents come here . They know we have the cash and should know if they perform they will get paid .

And then we will wonder why free agents signed elsewhere.

 

[BUSTAMOVE]

Ben Johnson will regret his decision taking the Bears job.

It was his only decision if it came down to Pats and Bears
Vrabel was shoe in at NE
Interviewing Ben was window dressing

 

[Toofy]

And then we will wonder why free agents signed elsewhere.

I am not talking about the top line free agents , I am talking about getting contracts like what Zach Baun signed last year with eagles - a prove it one . However we can additionally offer larger incentives for 2025 based on performance as compared to others . Sign 6-8 free agents on 4-6 million a year but with incentives touching 8-10 million. That way we can at least get the good ones and if they perform extend next year . Rinse and repeat till we establish our core. Not many can offer that . We have the cash. Motivate them to perform above their weight . The lure of large contract motivates them to over perform on teams like eagles. The lure of additional incentives in current year on top of their usual prove it fixed component will motivate them to join us instead of eagles.

 

[mgteich]

I am not talking about the top line free agents , I am talking about getting contracts like what Zach Baun signed last year with eagles - a prove it one . However we can additionally offer larger incentives for 2025 based on performance as compared to others . Sign 6-8 free agents on 4-6 million a year but with incentives touching 8-10 million. That way we can at least get the good ones and if they perform extend next year . Rinse and repeat till we establish our core. Not many can offer that . We have the cash. Motivate them to perform above their weight . The lure of large contract motivates them to over perform on teams like eagles. The lure of additional incentives in current year on top of their usual prove it fixed component will motivate them to join us instead of eagles.

Why can we offer larger incentives? Performance incentives count against the 2026 cap, not the 2025 cap.

And yes, guys like Braun will sign elsewhere. Why would they choose us if we insist on so much of compensation being in incentives.

The key is that we CAN afford to sign $8M-$10M a year players. We need to find those who project to be good enough and who will sign for us.

I do agree that there are players who will take one-year show-me deals as you suggest. That is NOT what we want. We have little interest in 1-year show me deals. We want players who will be here 2-4 years.

Your example is Braun. He performed. Is he being extended? Some players like a show me deal so that they can go into free agency, not so they can be extended.

 

[WhatJustHappened]

We need Trench upgrades, otherwise Maybe won't be great.
Defense and offense TOP is part of it, let's allow 38 pop... we'll lose. RP

 

[ScottishPatriots]

I love Drake and his potential but the pressure is coming soon is to start winning games, it was an easy first year to play quarterback where wins and losses didn't really matter much but that is ending.

By the end of year 2, especially year 3 if you're the guy then you can't be winning 4-5-6 games no matter your surrounding cast if you're an elite franchise guy, that's just the league.

 

[WhatJustHappened]

I love Drake and his potential but the pressure is coming soon is to start winning games, it was an first easy year to play quarterback where wins and losses didn't really matter much but that is ending.

By the end of year 2, especially year 3 if you're the guy then you can't be winning 4-5-6 games no matter your surrounding cast if you're an elite franchise guy, that's just the league.

Not sure WHO was responsible, but Daniel Jones type turnovers will NOT be allowed for much longer.

 

[Real fan 02]

The Patriots legitimately had the fastest external coaching hire in like half a decade. They were dead set on Vrabel from the jump.

Idk why people want to act like Johnson is some wuss who ran to the better roster. He wasn't even hired by the Bears until over a week later

I get it. I just never saw him a viable candidate the Job was already Vrabel's to begin with. I'm happy we have Vrabel he's what the organization NEEDS.. Ben Johnson is a WANT.

 

[Real fan 02]

Not sure WHO was responsible, but Daniel Jones type turnovers will NOT be allowed for much longer.

Alot of it was him being a rookie and trying to make a play for his team or either his ****ty OL couldn't hold up blocks so he has to throw into coverage.

 

[WhatJustHappened]

Maybe so, but Jones was considered the same, and he was a disgrace turning it over.
Do I feel the same? NO, but TO'S are tos...he needs to stop being careless with the ball.

 

[lancerman]

I get it. I just never saw him a viable candidate the Job was already Vrabel's to begin with. I'm happy we have Vrabel he's what the organization NEEDS.. Ben Johnson is a WANT.

We don't know what either is because we have to see how they play out. Johnson could be the new Josh McDaniels or he could be the next McVay. It's just annoying seeing people trying to **** on him because he isn't the guy on the team, and try to play revisionist history and act like he ran to the path of least resistance because he was scared of the Patriots or something.

 

[Betterthanmost]

Is that a complement? I hear it as he cant really be the best.

 

[Real fan 02]

We don't know what either is because we have to see how they play out. Johnson could be the new Josh McDaniels or he could be the next McVay. It's just annoying seeing people trying to **** on him because he isn't the guy on the team, and try to play revisionist history and act like he ran to the path of least resistance because he was scared of the Patriots or something.

Johnson what we do know is a great offensive mind. How coming here with the 32nd ranked roster I don't think he could have done much with it. Vrabel is the all around best choice to get the Patriots back to prominence.

 

[WhatJustHappened]

I think Vrabel was the best choice, he actually has PROVEN he has balls.
Johnson hasn't even put his nuts on the table, he'll probably fail spectacularly this year... maybe he'll be different, and be awesome, I have doubts.

 

[Real fan 02]

I think Vrabel was the best choice, he actually has PROVEN he has balls.
Johnson hasn't even put his nuts on the table, he'll probably fail spectacularly this year... maybe he'll be different, and be awesome, I have doubts.

Posters were looking at the Detroit offense. We don't have anyone that can even compare on offense to what he had in Detroit. Chicago was best place for him and NEP is the best place for Vrabel.

 

[lancerman]

Johnson what we do know is a great offensive mind. How coming here with the 32nd ranked roster I don't think he could have done much with it. Vrabel is the all around best choice to get the Patriots back to prominence.

Again we don't know who was the best choice. Vrabel has more experience. But all of his success came when he had a much better roster than what either the Patriots or current Bears have. We've never seen Vrabel with a mediocre roster. He came onto a team that was middle of the pack at 9-7 for the last two years and then was 9-7 for two more years with him. They drafted AJ Brown his second year and added him to the offensive lineup with Henry and a bunch of all pro lineman and they had success for a couple of years before falling back down, which also coincidentally happened the year after Brown left.

Not saying either will or won't succeed, but for both guys, this Pats team would be the worst team of their careers and it's not even close.

So to me it's again hard to hit out at Johnson for having a good offense when literally all of Vrabel's success came with having a stellar cast on offense. They are two guys that made their names being on talent rich teams and have not been put in a position to elevate a very bad roster.

Vrabel's advantages are that he already

1. Has went through the "learning what it actually means to be a HC" phase of the job and at least has some muscle memory on it.

2. This isn't an easy fanbase to win over and Vrabel has more sentimental ties with the fanbase, so he will have an easier time taking the hit on growing pains than Johnson who will be the new guy