2021 Dolphins vs Patriots pre game thread

[mgcolby]

I cant in good conscience agree here. This is a team that destroyed the Pats on the ground in their last meeting:

	CAR	YDS	AVG	TD	LONG
Salvon Ahmed	23	122	5.3	1	31
Matt Breida	12	86	7.2	0	24

The Patriots defense has to prove it can stop the run first and foremost. That is the the fatal flaw of last years' team more than any other. BTW the run defense was so bad that it made Tua 20/26 passing because play action was SO EASY! Stop the run and make Tua have to process multiple looks and multiple reads in mid and long 2d/3d down distances.

Miami might have the worst O-Line in football this season. And NE has one of the best front 7's in the league this season.

 

[Uptown]

Alert.. @captain stone ..alert @captain stone
Triggering begins in 3..2..1..

 

[Uptown]

 

[SlowGettingUp]

Seems unlikely the Dolphins starting LT will be available by Sunday:

Dolphins prepare to play without starting left tackle Austin Jackson, on COVID-19 list

Would Greg Little or Liam Eichenberg be a better option to replace Austin Jackson?

www.palmbeachpost.com

Not clear there is a huge gap down to the replacement, but Judon, Uche etc. will still be happy. Their starting OL isn't that great to begin with, so hopefully Tua is going to have a long day.

 

[Hammer of Thor]

Slater, McCourty, Andrews, White, and Hightower named team captains.
Patriots name five captains ahead of 2021 season

 

[Sicilian]

Slater, McCourty, Andrews, White, and Hightower named team captains.
Patriots name five captains ahead of 2021 season

These were the five I had as sure things. Wasn't sure if they would ever give one to a rookie, but as the QB thought Mac had an outside shot, but ultimately I'm glad they're not putting that on the kid's plate in year one.

 

[zydecochris]

Seems unlikely the Dolphins starting LT will be available by Sunday:

Dolphins prepare to play without starting left tackle Austin Jackson, on COVID-19 list

Would Greg Little or Liam Eichenberg be a better option to replace Austin Jackson?

www.palmbeachpost.com

Not clear there is a huge gap down to the replacement, but Judon, Uche etc. will still be happy. Their starting OL isn't that great to begin with, so hopefully Tua is going to have a long day.

Interesting, I thought there was still a fairly likely chance Jackson would still be able to play (by testing negative twice in 24 hours), but this local sports reporter evidently doesn't think so. I know Jackson wasn't that fantastic last year, but he is now in his second year and he clearly was considered the best option at LT that the Fins had. Eichenberg might ultimately be the best option but he is a rookie, has been injured, and has mostly practiced at other positions.

I've been thinking this will be a very close game, but the loss of Jackson would be a big loss for the Fins.

 

[PScottman]

Every season is a new team and season, this looks nothing like last year except the best elements of it.

It’s an entirely different defense.

No argument with either of these statements; however the issue remains that paper isn't proof. I still maintain that the comment "dare them to run" won't be the defensive strategy to start this game.

To allow the strength of the defense - it's rushing ability with Uche, Judon, HT, Wino, Barmore, etc to be successfully employed - the Dolphins have to be in 3d and mid/3d and long situations. So I expect an emphasis on stopping the run (because I'm pretty sure Flores knows that the Patriots DL strength is in that aspect too) is high on the Patriots to-do list to start the game.

 

[mgteich]

If Godchaux is a question the depth would be the answer.
Godchaux
Guy
Barmore
Anderson
Davis

with Wise able to move inside on passing downs.
That is a lot of quality players and a lot of versatility.
If that’s not a strength, I don’t know what is.

to each his own

I suspect that analysts outside of New England don't consider Anderson and Davis strength. Many didn't think them worthy of making the team.
And, yes, I think that Barmore is a question mark as an inside DL in his rookie year.

Personally, I think that we are not strong if we lose Guy. I do think that we are OK, absent injuries.
=====================
That being said, if what you seem to believe is true (that DT is a strength), then we have a top 5 or higher defense.

 

[SlowGettingUp]

I've been thinking this will be a very close game, but the loss of Jackson would be a big loss for the Fins.

Flores this morning - "remains a chance" Jackson will play.

Miami Dolphins coach Brian Flores said Liam Eichenberg and Greg Little would return to practice on Wednesday, giving the Dolphins close to a full cast of offensive linemen.

One lineman still missing: left tackle Austin Jackson, who remains on the COVID-19 list. The Dolphins say there remains a chance he could be active for Sunday’s game at New England but Flores is planning as if he won’t play.

“Right now, we’ll do it as if they’re not going to be there,” Flores said of Jackson and tight end Adam Shaheen, who’s also on the COVID-19 list.


Eichenberg has been out with a lower-body injury. Little had missed practice on Monday because of a mild illness unrelated to COVID. Both would be options to replace Jackson in the lineup, if needed.

 

[Ring 6]

No argument with either of these statements; however the issue remains that paper isn't proof. I still maintain that the comment "dare them to run" won't be the defensive strategy to start this game.

To allow the strength of the defense - it's rushing ability with Uche, Judon, HT, Wino, Barmore, etc to be successfully employed - the Dolphins have to be in 3d and mid/3d and long situations. So I expect an emphasis on stopping the run (because I'm pretty sure Flores knows that the Patriots DL strength is in that aspect too) is high on the Patriots to-do list to start the game.

Well you always want to stop the run but to use last years game to imply we will be at a disadvantage is wrong.
About as wrong as using a game from 2016.

 

[Ring 6]

to each his own

I suspect that analysts outside of New England don't consider Anderson and Davis strength. Many didn't think them worthy of making the team.
And, yes, I think that Barmore is a question mark as an inside DL in his rookie year.

Personally, I think that we are not strong if we lose Guy. I do think that we are OK, absent injuries.
=====================
That being said, if what you seem to believe is true (that DT is a strength), then we have a top 5 or higher defense.

What’s with the anonymous appeal to authority?
Who thought Anderson ( a 6 year veteran who played almost 1700 snaps the last 3 years— more than Lawrence guy) and Davis, who made a difference last year and had a great camp, wouldn’t make the team? You are appealing to people who were wrong??
In fact the buzz was our DT spot was so deep that there was a market for the guys who didn’t stick.

Yes it’s absolutely a strength.

Who are these “analysts” that you “suspect” think something?

 

[PScottman]

but to use last years game to imply we will be at a disadvantage is wrong.

(I should know better then to start a other "have to have the last word" post tete a tete with Andy Johnson, but here we go...)

So the new defenders don't have to disprove the reality that the Patriots' run defense last year was gashed by this same team (the offensive strategy employed by the Dolphins was successful)? They can just state "look at the names we have now!"?

I used actual past statistics that until the ball is put in play this year is the last useful data available. Your counter-inference that the run defense is "fixed" due to different players has no data with which to actually compare and cannot be proven or disproven at this time - it remains (just like my post) supposition.

Neither your prediction nor mine can be either right or wrong until such time as the game takes place because that is all either claim is - a GUESS at what might happen.

 

[Ring 6]

(I should know better then to start a other "have to have the last word" post tete a tete with Andy Johnson, but here we go...)

So the new defenders don't have to disprove the reality that the Patriots' run defense last year was gashed by this same team (the offensive strategy employed by the Dolphins was successful)? They can just state "look at the names we have now!"?

I used actual past statistics that until the ball is put in play this year is the last useful data available. Your counter-inference that the run defense is "fixed" due to different players has no data with which to actually compare and cannot be proven or disproven at this time - it remains (just like my post) supposition.

Neither your prediction nor mine can be either right or wrong until such time as the game takes place because that is all either claim is - a GUESS at what might happen.

You posted stats from different players than will be playing in the game.
No these players don’t have to “disprove” how different players played. If you seriously think the front 6 we will be putting out on the field Sunday has any resemblance to those snap counts I listed from the game that scares you, you might as well compare how the chiefs run d did against the raiders, it’s just as relevant.

Whether they played well like in week 1 when they held them to 87 yards on 27 carries and 11 points or poorly, it just doesn’t matter, because there are different players almost 100% different on the field.

It’s not about “gave the last word” it’s about you accepting you are comparing apples to concrete blocks.

 

[Hammer of Thor]

.

 

[TheRainMaker]

JaJuan Williams gets to start at CB opposite JC Jackson. Williams takes on Parker with S help from McCourty.

 

[Hammer of Thor]

 

[Hammer of Thor]

One of our faves……

 

[condon84]

Interesting thread at Finhaven entitled 3 Top Reasons Why the Dolphins will Dismantle the Patriots. Most posters cite Mac's inexperience and many mention Flores superior coaching. One predicted a 40-10 victory and another suggested Tua for MVP.

A forum full of ramblings from Florida man.

 

[TheRainMaker]

EDGE Ogbah

Good find in FA. Many on here were pounding the tables for him.

DT Wilkins

Don’t hear many good things about him.

EDGE Van Ginkel

Terrible name.

LB Baker

Fast LB. He’s the guy who easily ran down Harry and forced the fumble near the goal line.

CB Jones

Overpaid and overrated. There’s mixed opinions from analysts on him. Some say he’s good while others like myself don’t see anything special about him. He also spoke to the Miami media after Howard’s contract dispute as the media wanted his thoughts on Jones making more money than arguably the best CB in the NFL. He didn’t give a straight answer, but said that he needs to play better than he did last year. He’s never been a big play CB and that’s why Dallas let him go.