“It’ll take us years to contend”

[captain stone]

We are in year 1 of a rebuild. What Vrabel, his staff, Maye, and this team have done to be 11-2 is totally incredible. No one can take that away from them. The reality is that his team is far from perfect and has depth problems that will need a few more years to fix... Is this team similar to 2001? Yes, but it is far from the 2003 and 2004, and that is ok. We can get there with the potential.

A few...years?!?

DE is really the only high-cap position in which we have an immediate need for a starter. The other positions of immediate need - LG/Center & RG - are not nearly as expensive... Therefore, when considering our 11 draft picks and all of our salary-cap room, there is no reason whatsoever why our depth - not starter - issues cannot be substantially improved across all positions in One offseason.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

They loved Mayo and all the players bought in at first. Once they started losing it all fell apart.

Culture doesn't cause winning in and of itself.

 

[mayoclinic]

The reality of today's NFL is that no team is without holes, and every year involves plugging holes and hopefully upgrading the roster.

The current team has a better roster than predicted, and also better depth than predicted. Coaching also makes a difference: players who were liabilities at the beginning of the season (Elliss, Hawkins) are now solid contributors.

Take an average roster with a top coach and franchise QB, factor in average injuries a d some luck, and you have a legit contender.

Can/will the roster be upgraded next year and for the next few years? Undoubtedly. But these are opportunities, not major needs, in most cases.

 

[imahobgoblin]

A few...years?!?

DE is really the only high-cap position in which we have an immediate need for a starter. The other positions of immediate need - LG/Center & RG - are not nearly as expensive... Therefore, when considering our 11 draft picks and all of our salary-cap room, there is no reason whatsoever why our depth - not starter - issues cannot be substantially improved across all positions in One offseason.

I love how you just said what I wrote, but act as if its something different. Of course the issues will be substantially improved in another offseason. They will be. And it will be another 2 before we get it to where it needs to be.

 

[imahobgoblin]

Is anyone ever "where they need to be" to be a dynasty? Even in the middle of a run, we hear ad nauseum about a team's shortcomings. Look at the 2014-2018 Pats dynasty as a prime example.

What you strive for is to be a serious contender for an extended period. To sustainably be at the big dance with the best odds possible. Right now that's where they are, and it's exactly where they need to be.

Heck ya. Try looking at 2004-2005. What you strive for is to be a serious contender year in and year out with the opportunity to increase the quality of your team. This is why our dynasty died. Bill found a way to kill it through bad drafting. We are a contender right now. There is no guarantee about what will happen in the next 4 games, playoffs, or next year.

 

[Ring 6]

I love how you just said what I wrote, but act as if its something different. Of course the issues will be substantially improved in another offseason. They will be. And it will be another 2 before we get it to where it needs to be.

It’s not that simple. You don’t just automatically improve every year. Players leave, players come in, players improve, players decline. Improvement is relative to the other 31 teams. All 32 have mostly the same opportunities for the same players. It’s a zero sum gain. Any team is as likely to decline as improve. Given the patriots are the best team in the NFL they have a greater chance at declining.

 

[imahobgoblin]

It’s not that simple. You don’t just automatically improve every year. Players leave, players come in, players improve, players decline. Improvement is relative to the other 31 teams. All 32 have mostly the same opportunities for the same players. It’s a zero sum gain. Any team is as likely to decline as improve. Given the patriots are the best team in the NFL they have a greater chance at declining.

I never said it was that simple, NEM. There is a context of discussion to my post.

 

[Ring 6]

I never said it was that simple, NEM. There is a context of discussion to my post.

I dint know why I bother to try and educate you. You are a rock head

 

[mgteich]

The good thing about this season is that players will now want to come to NE who has a **** ton of cap space. Look for significant trades and FA signings to happen.

sure
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BTW, I do NOT think that Vrabel had trouble getting the players he wanted last off-season. It is fans that didn't get who they wanted.
So many probably still think that we would be better off with their favorites instead of Vrabel's choice of Diggs and Hollins.

I don't think players will give huge discounts, but having a playoff team will draw players.
=========
Finally, I don't expect us to sign lots of high-priced free agents. That just not economically the right thing to do. But, sure, we will have the freedom to do pretty much whatever VRABEL wants to do. As usual, half the fans will be disappointed, criticize the picks and criticize how much he pays.

 

[mgteich]

Yep, and MayoNays still managed to **** it up.

The schedule frankly has been fairly kind to us since 2021 with its Fraud 7-game winning streak.

Yes, we really do understand that you would have preferred to lose more games in 2021 and not make the playoffs.

Perhaps we should have had more polls after 4 games on how many games the posters wanted us to win this year.

 

[imahobgoblin]

I dint know why I bother to try and educate you. You are a rock head

I assure you the problem is not me. Dear NEMmy, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. Sound familiar?

 

[Huckleberry1]

I think it’s less to say anyone was calling a 13-14 win season. Just that there were many that scoffed at the idea of this being a playoff caliber team at all, schedule or not.

I think you are overstating the percentage of fans who thought they had no chance of making the playoffs. Iirc there were polls here that we could go back and get the actual numbers, but as I remember t the vast majority were hoping for a wild card berth, with very few, myself included, who thought winning the division was a realistic expectation. I think that 9-10 wins with a wild card was the general hope for this season, and that's not pessimistic for a team that has gone 8-26 the previous 2 seasons. It's fair to see that they have really outperformed expectations, and that they are well ahead of schedule. Even Vrabel conceded that mid season when asked about pursuing Micah Parsons, and his response was that wasn't where this team was at yet. So he clearly didn't see them as a Super Biwl contender that needed a player to get them over the top. Like most here he sees it as a multi year rebuild, and kept substantial cap space available to continue the rebuild this offseason.

 

[PP2]

I think you are overstating the percentage of fans who thought they had no chance of making the playoffs. Iirc there were polls here that we could go back and get the actual numbers, but as I remember t the vast majority were hoping for a wild card berth, with very few, myself included, who thought winning the division was a realistic expectation. I think that 9-10 wins with a wild card was the general hope for this season, and that's not pessimistic for a team that has gone 8-26 the previous 2 seasons. It's fair to see that they have really outperformed expectations, and that they are well ahead of schedule. Even Vrabel conceded that mid season when asked about pursuing Micah Parsons, and his response was that wasn't where this team was at yet. So he clearly didn't see them as a Super Biwl contender that needed a player to get them over the top. Like most here he sees it as a multi year rebuild, and kept substantial cap space available to continue the rebuild this offseason.

What I really like about Vrabel is that he has his head screwed on right and isn't buying the hype for one minute. He's keeping his focus on the long run- on the next few years.

I am in agreement with him that we are far from being a serious contender despite our surprising record. I have yet to see a complete 60 minute game from this team, and that's incidentally why you see Vrabel keep banging on the "no napping!" thing. The team is still very mentally inconsistent. It is my belief that this is what will cost them in the playoffs. They have to go through that gauntlet.

 

[Huckleberry1]

What I really like about Vrabel is that he has his head screwed on right and isn't buying the hype for one minute. He's keeping his focus on the long run- on the next few years.

I am in agreement with him that we are far from being a serious contender despite our surprising record. I have yet to see a complete 60 minute game from this team, and that's incidentally why you see Vrabel keep banging on the "no napping!" thing. The team is still very mentally inconsistent. It is my belief that this is what will cost them in the playoffs. They have to go through that gauntlet.

I agree. He had a plan coming in to this situation, and he's going to stick to it regardless any success they have had. I don't think he saw them as serious contenders this year, and I don't think he believes that this team as it currently is would be a long term contender, I do think however that his outlook on contending this season has changed pretty dramatically. I think he realizes the field is wide open now and that with Drake Maye they can beat any team and win any game. The truth this season is that there is no dominant team that is great in all phases of the game, which gives them an opening to win it all this season, which would be the most remarkable turnaround in football history. But that's different from being a team that is great in all 3 phases of the game, and I believe that's what he is planning to build here, and that will obviously take more time. But this season they do have a shot, and I don't know of anyone who believed that going into the season.

 

[stinkypete]

Any team can turn it completely around in one year, and 1-2 teams per year usually do.

 

[Ring 6]

I assure you the problem is not me. Dear NEMmy, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. Sound familiar?

Rock head

 

[n1997y]

What I really like about Vrabel is that he has his head screwed on right and isn't buying the hype for one minute. He's keeping his focus on the long run- on the next few years.

I am in agreement with him that we are far from being a serious contender despite our surprising record. I have yet to see a complete 60 minute game from this team, and that's incidentally why you see Vrabel keep banging on the "no napping!" thing. The team is still very mentally inconsistent. It is my belief that this is what will cost them in the playoffs. They have to go through that gauntlet.

I don’t think you are in agreement with him at all. I think you totally misstated his view of our team this year. I think he sees this team as a serious contender.

 

[imahobgoblin]

Rock head

Thats ok NEMMY

 

[mgteich]

Any team can turn it completely around in one year, and 1-2 teams per year usually do.

and any team can get to the SB; two usually do.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Any team can turn it completely around in one year, and 1-2 teams per year usually do.

Like who?