Curran: "In my estimation... [Gonzo would like to] be treated as if he's at the table in 2027." [previous title: "say goodbye to gonzo"]

[Uptown]

JC Jackson?
Malcolm Butler?

I thought that was a list of top NFL CBs, the cream. Do those guys really belong on such a list?

Maybe not Butler, but JC was phenomenal while he was here. Not elite by any stretch, but he damn sure did what he needed to do. Turnovers galore..25 INTs in 4 years is insane; especially considering he was undrafted.

 

[RDS11]

Oops, wrong thread...

 

[upstater1]

That’s all moot. Reports are Gonzo wants his own deal, not Witherspoon’s or Stingley’s.

So whatever the Pats are or are not willing to do about giving him either Witherspoon’s deal or Stingley’s is irrelevant.

It’s just muddying the waters, and any supposed conclusions based on those would be equally irrelevant.

He’s frustrated because he wants *HIS* deal and it’s not done yet.

I said IF the Patriots are not even willing to do deals like Witherspoon and Stingley's then there are only two ways to interpret that.

 

[upstater1]

This is untrue in so many ways.

They did redo a contract with Ty Law. Ty Law left the Patriots for his 11th season.

They signed Stephon Gilmore to the biggest CB contract in the NFL. Gilmore then left for his 10th season.

Samuel was not worth it. As for Revis, the Patriots gave him 10% of the salary cap. He left for the Jets who gave him 12%. He was already cooked.

The only guy they failed to sign but should have was Aqib Talib, but they replaced him with Revis & then Gilmore.

 

[thecore762]

If Gonzo wants an insane deal then it’s time to trade him for 3 first round picks. Hello browns?

All jokes aside, he is a huge part of our defense and shutting down top receivers. He is a generational talent. I hope we can come to some type of agreement, but I don’t want his deal to literally handicap this team and when the Drake contract comes up. The Pats need to deal with this as soon as possible to avoid drama.

Both parties have been professional so far but it seems Gonzo is starting to get frustrated.

 

[patfanken]

**** trading him. The guy is under contract for TWO more years. Get him on the field and ready to play and have him PROVE he's worthy to be paid among 5 best CB's in the league. The man had a GREAT game in the superbowl, but he hasn't reached the level of Revis Island. He gets beat too. Just last year some no name beat him for a TD in the Giants game, He's more like Gonzales shoal than Revis Island... so far.

My guess is the holdup is about how much of the contract is guaranteed. I'm thinking he wants a majority of the contract to be guaranteed, while the Pats want more of it to be based on production, or rankings, etc. Then there is the position bias thing, with them not being willing to pay over 10% of the caps each of the next 5 years to a CB, especially when you have to pay your QB over 20%.

I would remind how BB made Revis (at his best) irrelevant by simply putting on HIS island and ignoring him and plan his offense around him. You can do that to a great CB, but a great DT is someone who is ALWAYS in a position to make an impact.

 

[TommyD4207]

**** trading him. The guy is under contract for TWO more years. Get him on the field and ready to play and have him PROVE he's worthy to be paid among 5 best CB's in the league. The man had a GREAT game in the superbowl, but he hasn't reached the level of Revis Island. He gets beat too. Just last year some no name beat him for a TD in the Giants game, He's more like Gonzales shoal than Revis Island... so far.

My guess is the holdup is about how much of the contract is guaranteed. I'm thinking he wants a majority of the contract to be guaranteed, while the Pats want more of it to be based on production, or rankings, etc. Then there is the position bias thing, with them not being willing to pay over 10% of the caps each of the next 5 years to a CB, especially when you have to pay your QB over 20%.

I would remind how BB made Revis (at his best) irrelevant by simply putting on HIS island and ignoring him and plan his offense around him. You can do that to a great CB, but a great DT is someone who is ALWAYS in a position to make an impact.

He just turned 24 years old, and your standard is that he needs to be a hall of famer - one of the top 5 to ever play the position.

Quite the low bar you have there, Ken.

Revis had already gotten paid by this point in his career, by the way.

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

The guy is under contract for TWO more years.

And so was Witherspoon, and JSN...and countless other guys that played 3 years of a 5 year contract.
It's become the norm to pay high performing 1st rd picks when they are eligible after 3 years.
Gonzo expecting to be extended is not some outrageous demand, it's the NORM.
Pats are doing Pats things, it's not a coincidence.

 

[Drunken Cicerone]

Im guessing we trade him for a 2nd and say thats the best we could do and then we draft another CB who does very well and then we cant afford to pay so we trade him for a fifth

 

[mgteich]

If Gonzo wants an insane deal then it’s time to trade him for 3 first round picks. Hello browns?

All jokes aside, he is a huge part of our defense and shutting down top receivers. He is a generational talent. I hope we can come to some type of agreement, but I don’t want his deal to literally handicap this team and when the Drake contract comes up. The Pats need to deal with this as soon as possible to avoid drama.

Both parties have been professional so far but it seems Gonzo is starting to get frustrated.

patience1

 

[TommyD4207]

And so was Witherspoon, and JSN...and countless other guys that played 3 years of a 5 year contract.
It's become the norm to pay high performing 1st rd picks when they are eligible after 3 years.
Gonzo expecting to be extended is not some outrageous demand, it's the NORM.
Pats are doing Pats things, it's not a coincidence.

This.

Revis made more his rookie season than Gonzalez has for his entire contract. That's in non-adjusted-for-inflation money, by the way.

The reason the rookie slots exist, is so that when moron owners sign bad rookies, they're not hamstrung by the contract anymore, because they apparently need all the guardrails they can get. The TRADEOFF is, if your rookie ends up being an all-pro, he gets an extension after year 3, and gets paid.

That is the norm. You nailed it.

 

[patfanken]

He just turned 24 years old, and your standard is that he needs to be a hall of famer - one of the top 5 to ever play the position.

Quite the low bar you have there, Ken.

Revis had already gotten paid by this point in his career, by the way.

No, not a HOFer, per se, but here's the thing. I am one who has some position bias. I would MUCH rather have have to pay top dollar to a DT, or Edge defender, than a CB, who is at his best playing man to man, when the DC is running zone 80% of the time. Also IIRC someone listed the top CB's based on a variety of CB stats, and Gonzo rated 6th in the league, though pretty tightly packed with those other 5.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not among those who want to trade him as a knee jerk reaction to the delayed signing. I believe when it all plays out, that his contract will be pretty much what Witherspoon got, but with less guaranteed money and more performance-based incentives.

BTW- quick question since I didn't watch much of the game last night. Did Gonzo dress up like the other starters, or was he in street clothes?

 

[TommyD4207]

No, not a HOFer, per se, but here's the thing. I am one who has some position bias. I would MUCH rather have have to pay top dollar to a DT, or Edge defender, than a CB, who is at his best playing man to man, when the DC is running zone 80% of the time. Also IIRC someone listed the top CB's based on a variety of CB stats, and Gonzo rated 6th in the league, though pretty tightly packed with those other 5.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not among those who want to trade him as a knee jerk reaction to the delayed signing. I believe when it all plays out, that his contract will be pretty much what Witherspoon got, but with less guaranteed money and more performance-based incentives.

BTW- quick question since I didn't watch much of the game last night. Did Gonzo dress up like the other starters, or was he in street clothes?

He was wearing whatever the other starters who didn't dress. wore. 38 players didn't dress last night.

Edit: You did say he 'had to be Revis', when even Revis wasn't Revis by his third year. And I'll pay a 24 year old top-3 CB before I did the same for an Edge. Top Corners last longer, and you pay premiums on Edges depending on how many sacks they get (which is a crazy way to determine salary, but we're still here, I guess).

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

No, not a HOFer, per se, but here's the thing. I am one who has some position bias. I would MUCH rather have have to pay top dollar to a DT, or Edge defender, than a CB, who is at his best playing man to man, when the DC is running zone 80% of the time. Also IIRC someone listed the top CB's based on a variety of CB stats, and Gonzo rated 6th in the league, though pretty tightly packed with those other 5.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not among those who want to trade him as a knee jerk reaction to the delayed signing. I believe when it all plays out, that his contract will be pretty much what Witherspoon got, but with less guaranteed money and more performance-based incentives.

BTW- quick question since I didn't watch much of the game last night. Did Gonzo dress up like the other starters, or was he in street clothes?

I don't know.
But most starters were in street clothes.
Maye, AJ, Doubs...etc
I think all starters may have in streets now that I think of it.

 

[patfanken]

And so was Witherspoon, and JSN...and countless other guys that played 3 years of a 5 year contract.
It's become the norm to pay high performing 1st rd picks when they are eligible after 3 years.
Gonzo expecting to be extended is not some outrageous demand, it's the NORM.
Pats are doing Pats things, it's not a coincidence.

No, I never implied that. Just pointed out that having TWO years left was a point of leverage for the team and a great reason NOT to trade Gonzo as a knee jerk response to the impasse.\ I want him on the 2026 and 2027 teams.

BTW- extending after the 3rd year is a rather recent occurrence, it used to be done after the 4th, mostly. It was adds to the risk of the team that the player will continue to play at the top of his game for next 5-6 years, AND there was an implied concession by the player to take a bit of a discount BECAUSE the team was making a big payout 2 years earlier than they have to. I would understand this impasse a lot more if this was happening prior to the 2028 season.

I guess it comes down to this: Does Christian want to play for around $3MM this season OR become generationally rich on a long term deal. The rest is kinda just the details

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

No, I never implied that. Just pointed out that having TWO years left was a point of leverage for the team and a great reason NOT to trade Gonzo as a knee jerk response to the impasse.\ I want him on the 2026 and 2027 teams.

BTW- extending after the 3rd year is a rather recent occurrence, it used to be done after the 4th, mostly. It was adds to the risk of the team that the player will continue to play at the top of his game for next 5-6 years, AND there was an implied concession by the player to take a bit of a discount BECAUSE the team was making a big payout 2 years earlier than they have to. I would understand this impasse a lot more if this was happening prior to the 2028 season.

I guess it comes down to this: Does Christian want to play for around $3MM this season OR become generationally rich on a long term deal. The rest is kinda just the details

I think the generational wealth part is pretty much a given at this point.
Now the real question is what are the Pats really offering?
They have been known to nickel and dime in these situations in the past, much different than how many other organizations run.
Good or bad, that's the way Kraft and his staff do business.
Now is Gonzo being unrealistic in his demands? Are the Pats being cheap and not offering him a market deal?
These are questions we don't have the answers to.
People can speculate. Kraft can say what he wants, Scheffter can report all the rumours he wants.
Fact is none of us know the real details, we just don't.

 

[slash83]

I bet Dallas would give up a farm of picks, their secondary sucks.

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

I bet Dallas would give up a farm of picks, their secondary sucks.

Who cares, we need him.
We have SB hopes, our pass rush is a huge question mark.
Severely weakening our team for some lottery tickets, no thank you.